Politics

On expiry dates, and shelf life.
I am never too certain of it.
Typical examples are medicines.
For example, ships hospital has every medicine, for everything. On the other hand, seamen are generally healthy people, under annual medical fitness certificate.

So, medicines on board are not used in great quantity, or used rarely.
When they expire, they get replenished to full inventory again on annual basis to get medical chest certificate. Replenishing entire hospital is expenisve exercise
It is unthinkable in modern day that somebody is given expired aspirine! God forbid! (he might die, or he could sue?)

Then I remember a story of "last ivory hunter" (Wally Johnson) book written by capstick.
He injected him self with expired antivenom serum after being bitten by gaboon viper and survived, One of few ever bitten by that snake that survived..

Then I remember war in Croatia
We were getting all kinds of aid, including European medical aid and medicines, and including expired medicines from old stocks. in large quantities....
Nobody complained.
People were treated, and survived.
I asked my mother about that (PHD Neurologists, chief of staff), she said no issue, All works.

Oldest ammo I've been firing was milsurp, vintage 1953, Works.

Then we come to modern ammo and explosive artillery ammo, shelf life and low stocks
I have doubts on shelf life. Expiry dates are convenient and profitable for industry. it keeps production alive, even without consuming.
Expired things must be replenished.

I am not a doctor or pharmacist, but from what I understand expired medicine can lose some of its potency or effectiveness. But for the most part it still works pretty well. And obviously its way better than nothing.

But what I have noticed is that people want the best and greatest and nothing else. Even asylum seekers or refugees. In Toronto on the news today there was a sob story about how some asylum seeker had to walk from Pearson airport to a shelter on peter street (about 25km). Once he arrived at this shelter and saw that people were sleeping on the street he supposedly developed a mental health issue and is now roaming the streets. Now having to sleep on the street for a week or two and walk 25km isnt particularly fun but if you are an asylum seeker, meaning you are fleeing your country because you are facing severe persecution like your life being danger, wouldnt you just be happy you arrived in a country where you are safe.

Another interesting thing Ive noticed is a lot of these asylum seekers are able to pay for $2000 plane tickets to come to Canada. They are also wearing brand new Nike sneakers and so forth. But they have zero $$ on them in Canada. Very strange.
 
On expiry dates, and shelf life.
I am never too certain of it.
Typical examples are medicines.
For example, ships hospital has every medicine, for everything. On the other hand, seamen are generally healthy people, under annual medical fitness certificate.

So, medicines on board are not used in great quantity, or used rarely.
When they expire, they get replenished to full inventory again on annual basis to get medical chest certificate. Replenishing entire hospital is expenisve exercise
It is unthinkable in modern day that somebody is given expired aspirine! God forbid! (he might die, or he could sue?)

Then I remember a story of "last ivory hunter" (Wally Johnson) book written by capstick.
He injected him self with expired antivenom serum after being bitten by gaboon viper and survived, One of few ever bitten by that snake that survived..

Then I remember war in Croatia
We were getting all kinds of aid, including European medical aid and medicines, and including expired medicines from old stocks. in large quantities....
Nobody complained.
People were treated, and survived.
I asked my mother about that (PHD Neurologists, chief of staff), she said no issue, All works.

Oldest ammo I've been firing was milsurp, vintage 1953, Works.

Then we come to modern ammo and explosive artillery ammo, shelf life and low stocks
I have doubts on shelf life. Expiry dates are convenient and profitable for industry. it keeps production alive, even without consuming.
Expired things must be replenished.
Expiration dates are "convenient and profitable for industry." That is so predictable. Let me offer some observations about US military procurement having done this for a major defense corporation.

The Department of Defense, through the acquiring service, will establish a set of procurement criteria for a weapon system. Those criteria will include the desired performance envelope, sustainability (including shelf-life), combat durability, training criteria etc etc. The service will then request proposals from industry to fulfill that requirement set. Typically, depending on the system, three to five bidders will respond to the RFP.

To the dismay of our enemies, US weapon systems tend to perform exactly as specified using that methodology. It is far more efficient, responsive and cost effective than the state run factories of Russia and China. And judging by how much Russia and China attempt to copy our systems, far more innovative.

With all do respect, you can not compare an aspirin or a Soviet era F1 grenade to a fire and forget Javelin ATGM or extended range GMLRS missile. Would I try to fire one past its "use by date" if about to be overrun by a T72 - sure. However, The US Army tries real hard to never put its soldiers is in such a position.

For instance, a newly produced Javelin has a hit likelihood of around 95% within 3500 meters of a clearly identified target. The de-mil criteria are not in the public domain, but the weapon is still likely to function as advertised when pulled from service. However, the US military's cost vs gains analysis puts a pretty small reliability deferential on that performance gap. From our perspective, our most valuable and costly asset is a trained US soldier. We spend a great deal of resources insuring his weaponry performs exactly as expected. That is another way that the US differs dramatically from the Eastern way of war.

The Javelins we have been providing to Ukraine have been our oldest stocks first (the same with every other munition). Much of that, produced during the war on terror, will be expiring in the foreseeable future. Those munitions have been used quickly and effectively by Ukraine. We are currently ramping up new production to not only fill any US backlog or Ukrainian requirements, but to also supply through military sales many of our allies who have been impressed with the weapon's performance.

That is true of any of our munitions.
 
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By no means am I am expert on this stuff, but it seems to me that the "alternate electors" plan was doomed from the start.

 
Expiration dates are "convenient and profitable for industry." That is so predictable. Let me offer some observations about US military procurement having done this for a major defense corporation.

The Department of Defense, through the acquiring service, will establish a set of procurement criteria for a weapon system. Those criteria will include the desired performance envelope, sustainability (including shelf-life), combat durability, training criteria etc etc. The service will then request proposals from industry to fulfill that requirement set. Typically, depending on the system, three to five bidders will respond to the RFP.

To the dismay of our enemies, US weapon systems tend to perform exactly as specified using that methodology. It is far more efficient, responsive and cost effective than the state run factories of Russia and China. And judging by how much Russia and China attempt to copy our systems, far more innovative.

With all do respect, you can not compare an aspirin or a Soviet era F1 grenade to a fire and forget Javelin ATGM or extended range GMLRS missile. Would I try to fire one past its "use by date" if about to be overrun by a T72 - sure. However, The US Army tries real hard to never put its soldiers is in such a position.

For instance, a newly produced Javelin has a hit likelihood of around 95% within 3500 meters of a clearly identified target. The de-mil criteria are not in the public domain, but the weapon is still likely to function as advertised when pulled from service. However, the US military's cost vs gains analysis puts a pretty small reliability deferential on that performance gap. From our perspective, our most valuable and costly asset is a trained US soldier. We spend a great deal of resources insuring his weaponry performs exactly as expected. That is another way that the US differs dramatically from the Eastern way of war.

The Javelins we have been providing to Ukraine have been our oldest stocks first (the same with every other munition). Much of that, produced during the war on terror, will be expiring in the foreseeable future. Those munitions have been used quickly and effectively by Ukraine. We are currently ramping up new production to not only fill any US backlog or Ukrainian requirements, but to also supply through military sales many of our allies who have been impressed with the weapon's performance.

That is true of any of our munitions.
The bolded part is probably what Mark-Hunter is referring to. A Javelin, that is past its use by date, will still probably perform quite well and obviously in a pinch it will work. But that small performance gap is why it has a use by date and gets replaced. I assume a similar rationale applies to expired medicine being replaced on a ship...

I am sorry if this is an idiotic question but what happens to munitions that are past their use by date? Do they get destroyed or ?
 
The bolded part is probably what Mark-Hunter is referring to. A Javelin, that is past its use by date, will still probably perform quite well and obviously in a pinch it will work. But that small performance gap is why it has a use by date and gets replaced. I assume a similar rationale applies to expired medicine being replaced on a ship...

I am sorry if this is an idiotic question but what happens to munitions that are past their use by date? Do they get destroyed or ?
Normally they are de-milled (de-militarized). That means they are broken down into their components. Reusables like some sensors, chips, lenses, perhaps even rocket/missile bodies if the same system is in production, will go back to the contractor. Often the expiration, like the current Javelin, is in part driven by a newer model with enhanced capabilities. The other components, for instance the solid fuel, would be destroyed.
 
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And because lots of things interest me - a really sobering look at the EV "revolution."

 
I am sorry if this is an idiotic question but what happens to munitions that are past their use by date? Do they get destroyed or ?

Not entirely sure what happens to everything, but I know the Army and/or CIA blows up a lot of old Munitions. Usually after a big rain. I can hear and feel my house shake every time they do. Sometimes at my house it sound like a war going on across the highway from my house, with the army running live fire training with fully automatic weapons, cargo plane drops, touch and go on grass and helicopters.
 
And because lots of things interest me - a really sobering look at the EV "revolution."

I read that article earlier today. The left wing climate activists are bound and determined to destroy the Western economies through their fantasy EV and green energy only MANDATES. Meanwhile, China is still building 2 coal fired plants a WEEK and India isn't far behind them. But they live in a different atmosphere, so It'll all be OK. LOL
 
As long as we are talking about the human species, this would seem to be a pipedream.
Point is well made.
But it is not necessarily so.

Few years ago, I was reading a book "War! What is it good for?" Author Ian Morris, tries to explain the paradox of war.

I cannot give any better summary, then it is actually given on amazon. I will quote.

In War! What Is It Good For?, the renowned historian and archaeologist Ian Morris tells the gruesome, gripping story of fifteen thousand years of war, going beyond the battles and brutality to reveal what war has really done to and for the world. Stone Age people lived in small, feuding societies and stood a one-in-ten or even one-in-five chance of dying violently. In the twentieth century, by contrast―despite two world wars, Hiroshima, and the Holocaust―fewer than one person in a hundred died violently. The explanation: War, and war alone, has created bigger, more complex societies, ruled by governments that have stamped out internal violence. Strangely enough, killing has made the world safer, and the safety it has produced has allowed people to make the world richer too.


War has been history's greatest paradox, but this searching study of fifteen thousand years of violence suggests that the next half century is going to be the most dangerous of all time. If we can survive it, the age-old dream of ending war may yet come to pass. But, Morris argues, only if we understand what war has been good for can we know where it will take us next.


End of qoute
Wars created large states. States control internal violence, and we live in relatively safer environment.

This then brings me to the vision that Eisnehowers shared in his speech, and I qouted above.

Disarmament, with mutual honor and confidence, is a continuing imperative. Together we must learn how to compose difference, not with arms, but with intellect and decent purpose. Because this need is so sharp and apparent I confess that I lay down my official responsibilities in this field with a definite sense of disappointment. As one who has witnessed the horror and the lingering sadness of war-as one who knows that another war could utterly destroy this civilization which has been so slowly and painfully built over thousands of years-I wish I could say tonight that a lasting peace is in sight.

Entire Eisnehowers generation (inlcuding other countries leaders) have participated in world war 2, and have seen horrors of industrial warfare, burned cities and destroyed Europe and other places. All of the ww2 leaders of that time had their family members serving the Army as well, and have good understanding of consequences of their individual decisions in war, by death and destruction and personal family risks,
(Roosevelt son, served army, both Kennedys sons, one future president served army, Marshall Tito was actually firing personally at enemy, his son wounded and lost arm in eastern front, Churchill son served army, and was part of British mission in Balkans - being shot at, even dictator such as Stalin had a son in army that ended up as POW, and Stallin refused to exchange him for captured German Marshall Paulus, I could go on but this was the generation of leaders that we talk about)

This was generation that created post ww2 world order. They wanted something better for mankind
This generation also created the best what they could - United nations organization. (Funny nobody talks about UN, in recent forum discussions)

This I beleive was Eiks vision in the moment of speech in 1961
And I am coming now to conclusion that this vision, as described in Eiks speech has been blurred globally, as this generation has passed away, new generations of leaders came and new challenges arose.

What is happening now, after collapsing of soviet union, and emergence of "modern Russia" and subsequent events are actually establishing new geopolitical spheres of interests of global superpowers.
War in Ukraina will end on negotiation table, and I do hope, when negotiations come that this will make new global stability, otherwise if it spirals out of control it could be too late.
 
Point is well made.
But it is not necessarily so.

Few years ago, I was reading a book "War! What is it good for?" Author Ian Morris, tries to explain the paradox of war.

I cannot give any better summary, then it is actually given on amazon. I will quote.

In War! What Is It Good For?, the renowned historian and archaeologist Ian Morris tells the gruesome, gripping story of fifteen thousand years of war, going beyond the battles and brutality to reveal what war has really done to and for the world. Stone Age people lived in small, feuding societies and stood a one-in-ten or even one-in-five chance of dying violently. In the twentieth century, by contrast―despite two world wars, Hiroshima, and the Holocaust―fewer than one person in a hundred died violently. The explanation: War, and war alone, has created bigger, more complex societies, ruled by governments that have stamped out internal violence. Strangely enough, killing has made the world safer, and the safety it has produced has allowed people to make the world richer too.


War has been history's greatest paradox, but this searching study of fifteen thousand years of violence suggests that the next half century is going to be the most dangerous of all time. If we can survive it, the age-old dream of ending war may yet come to pass. But, Morris argues, only if we understand what war has been good for can we know where it will take us next.


End of qoute
Wars created large states. States control internal violence, and we live in relatively safer environment.

This then brings me to the vision that Eisnehowers shared in his speech, and I qouted above.

Disarmament, with mutual honor and confidence, is a continuing imperative. Together we must learn how to compose difference, not with arms, but with intellect and decent purpose. Because this need is so sharp and apparent I confess that I lay down my official responsibilities in this field with a definite sense of disappointment. As one who has witnessed the horror and the lingering sadness of war-as one who knows that another war could utterly destroy this civilization which has been so slowly and painfully built over thousands of years-I wish I could say tonight that a lasting peace is in sight.

Entire Eisnehowers generation (inlcuding other countries leaders) have participated in world war 2, and have seen horrors of industrial warfare, burned cities and destroyed Europe and other places. All of the ww2 leaders of that time had their family members serving the Army as well, and have good understanding of consequences of their individual decisions in war, by death and destruction and personal family risks,
(Roosevelt son, served army, both Kennedys sons, one future president served army, Marshall Tito was actually firing personally at enemy, his son wounded and lost arm in eastern front, Churchill son served army, and was part of British mission in Balkans - being shot at, even dictator such as Stalin had a son in army that ended up as POW, and Stallin refused to exchange him for captured German Marshall Paulus, I could go on but this was the generation of leaders that we talk about)

This was generation that created post ww2 world order. They wanted something better for mankind
This generation also created the best what they could - United nations organization. (Funny nobody talks about UN, in recent forum discussions)

This I beleive was Eiks vision in the moment of speech in 1961
And I am coming now to conclusion that this vision, as described in Eiks speech has been blurred globally, as this generation has passed away, new generations of leaders came and new challenges arose.

What is happening now, after collapsing of soviet union, and emergence of "modern Russia" and subsequent events are actually establishing new geopolitical spheres of interests of global superpowers.
War in Ukraina will end on negotiation table, and I do hope, when negotiations come that this will make new global stability, otherwise if it spirals out of control it could be too late.
I think you and I are in almost total agreement. Where we differ perhaps is his actual message.

The paragraph you quote is not the point of his speech. That was a bit of idealism that he almost had to add - and even it ends with the clear warning that "lasting peace" was not in sight.

What his speech did attempt to do was rally the American people to the responsibilities - militarily, politically, even morally - that they would have to shoulder in this new post war period of perpetual conflict. He even admonishes them with respect to their involvement in and understanding of that environment so that they were partnered decision makers in the course the country would take on the world stage.

I personally think that has been the nation's greatest failing since the war. I may just be getting older, but I don't believe the collective ignorance of the country has ever been greater. After all, the majority of the voting population seems to be content to be led by either a senile octogenarian or a self-absorbed promoter who seems to have no real understanding of history or international relations.
 
And because lots of things interest me - a really sobering look at the EV "revolution."


It's a farce. The leftists in charge of it know its a farce as well. It's not green and its not sustainable.

What is the hope for the future is batteries or slow-depletion capacitors. They are doing work on graphite battery technology that avoids the need for rare earth elements. Slow depletion capacitors would reduce the weight of cars by thousands of pounds and would solve the recycling crisis from EVs.

This is an interim step towards good, sustainable EVs. What remains to be seen is the way to power them all without nuclear power and lots of it. That's where the left's obsessions FOR EVs and AGAINST nuclear destroy's the future potential of EVs overall.

In the meantime, they are filthy polluters with no end of life recycling plan. But they go fast and their build quality is excellent, so as long as you buy a Tesla to go fast and have fun, by all means.
 
It's a farce. The leftists in charge of it know its a farce as well. It's not green and its not sustainable.

What is the hope for the future is batteries or slow-depletion capacitors. They are doing work on graphite battery technology that avoids the need for rare earth elements. Slow depletion capacitors would reduce the weight of cars by thousands of pounds and would solve the recycling crisis from EVs.

This is an interim step towards good, sustainable EVs. What remains to be seen is the way to power them all without nuclear power and lots of it. That's where the left's obsessions FOR EVs and AGAINST nuclear destroy's the future potential of EVs overall.

In the meantime, they are filthy polluters with no end of life recycling plan. But they go fast and their build quality is excellent, so as long as you buy a Tesla to go fast and have fun, by all means.
And don't go far or carry anything heavy or don't live in a rural setting.

The Ford Lightning seems to be going nowhere in spite of recent price cuts as people who actually use trucks are coming to realize the impact of load on range. Towing seems to be even worse.

My tool box and bed diesel tank add nearly a thousand pounds of weight to my F250 before I put the first item in the bed.

 
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I'll stick to my dirty diesel 2500 HD :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:
 
And don't go far or carry anything heavy or don't live in a rural setting.

The Ford Lightning seems to be going nowhere in spite of recent price cuts as people who actually use trucks are coming to realize the impact of load on range. Towing seems to be even worse.

My tool box and bed diesel tank adds nearly a thousand pounds of weight to my F250 before I put the first item in the bed.


I hear you. I'm a truck snob, I like my creature comforts quite a bit. So when I priced a loaded Ram 2500 mega cab cummins limited, it was $100k. A Ram 1500 ecodiesel (now discontinued) has an MSRP loaded of $75k and few discounts. My current ride is a 2016 1500 ecodiesel I bought new, MSRP was $61k but the discounts brought it down to just over $40k. Times have changed since Covid.

So I'm one of those guys waiting in line for a cyber truck. We'll see what they cost. When they quoted $50k that seemed like a lot of car for light ranch work, kids going to high school, and getting home in the snow. If they spike the MSRP, we'll probably buy a couple tacomas at the $50k mark as I can't sink my teeth into $100k vehicles at this time.

A lot of people buy trucks for things other than "Truck work". Comfort. Capacity for people and stuff. Infrequent towing of small trailers. Not getting stuck in the snow. About any of them will handle my duty requirements and that of many drivers. Saving the planet with green energy is not remotely in my considerations.
 
I think you and I are in almost total agreement. Where we differ perhaps is his actual message.
Oh, but you can allow me a "bit of cherry picking"?
Would be great to discuss in more details once over a glass of Macallan.
 
It will be interesting to see "how it ends"- that is, the US/Europe war on fossil fuels. It is clear that energy production from solar/wind is only sufficient to allow transportation to the elite 1% of the population- and what about all of the transportation needed to move goods from source to user?
To paraphrase Marx, politicians can always give something to the workers but they can never take it away. In an isolated world, US/Europe would go through a transition: switching away from fuels would result in hardship, which when it got to critical mass would result in changing of policy, reinstating the industrial economy and things would return to "normal". However US/Europe isn't isolated from the rest of the world that hasn't bought into the scam- From what I read and hear, I would fully expect the communist countries to seize the opportunity to take over the political operations of the Free World, likely without firing a shot.
 
Oh, but you can allow me a "bit of cherry picking"?
Would be great to discuss in more details once over a glass of Macallan.
That's why I dearly cling to my old 05 Dodge Cummins 3500 with 6 speed stick. Pre smog and piss tank, built up the way I want it, no infotainment center, analog guages, radio, (I even have a cassette player included). Everyone wants it but no dice. My son in law will get it when I die.
 
It will be interesting to see "how it ends"- that is, the US/Europe war on fossil fuels. It is clear that energy production from solar/wind is only sufficient to allow transportation to the elite 1% of the population- and what about all of the transportation needed to move goods from source to user?
To paraphrase Marx, politicians can always give something to the workers but they can never take it away. In an isolated world, US/Europe would go through a transition: switching away from fuels would result in hardship, which when it got to critical mass would result in changing of policy, reinstating the industrial economy and things would return to "normal". However US/Europe isn't isolated from the rest of the world that hasn't bought into the scam- From what I read and hear, I would fully expect the communist countries to seize the opportunity to take over the political operations of the Free World, likely without firing a shot.
That's what Russia has been doing since WWII.
 
And don't go far or carry anything heavy or don't live in a rural setting.

The Ford Lightning seems to be going nowhere in spite of recent price cuts as people who actually use trucks are coming to realize the impact of load on range. Towing seems to be even worse.

My tool box and bed diesel tank add nearly a thousand pounds of weight to my F250 before I put the first item in the bed.


I spent a good bit of my career boiling oil so I know I’m biased, but these EV’s make no sense from a utility or environmental POV.

A lie told repeatedly and with conviction is still a lie.
 

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