Why no to the rem 700?

[7MAG]

I've been fortunate with 700's.. but admittedly have never owned one in a "hunting rifle" type profile..

I've owned 3 of them.. all in .308 Win.. all custom built for precision/sniper type work.. all were incredibly reliable.. and all were sub .25 MOA rifles..

2 were "sendero" variants, the third was a 700P (police).. I had the actions trued up, timney triggers installed, McMillan stocks fitted, etc.. and they all got higher end optics mounted as well.. 2 were "play" guns that I just enjoyed shooting at the range (we had a 600 and 1000 meter range not too far from where I lived back then).. the third was my actual "duty" rifle when I served as a sniper team leader on a metro area SWAT team for a while.. I trusted my life and my teammates lives to it on more than a few occasions..

I genuinely loved shooting all of those rifles.. they were as good or better than any other "sniper" rifles I have ever seen/shot for engagements from 50-600 meters.. (there are certainly better options for engagements further out than 600)..

All that said.. I would have zero desire to take a 700 on a buff (or any DG) hunt..

While I am sure hundreds, if not thousands of DG around the world have been taken with 700's.. I guess the question would be... "why"?

If you can afford a DG hunt, you can afford a new rifle if you dont already own something suitable for DG..

And if Im buying a 700, only to have to spend another couple of hundred bucks to have an AR extractor installed, and have other work done to it.. Why wouldnt I just buy something off the shelf thats suitable as soon as I take it out of the box (Ruger 77, Win 70, etc)?

Again.. dont get me wrong... I know a 700 in 375 H&H will kill a buff just as easily as a Rigby in 375 H&H.. and I have long been an advocate for a 700 (when it doesnt have a QA/QC issue, etc) under the right conditions.. There is a reason it has been deployed by hundreds (probably more) major metro SWAT teams and by every branch of the US Military's SOF units in some of the worst possible conditions (rain, snow, heat, sand, dirt, etc) when other options were available to them..

But for me... it just doesnt make sense for a first choice for a DG rifle..

I believe your referencing the M24 in the last paragraph, which would be their most consist and highest quality

 

[Nevada Mike]

I have a Rem 700 SPS in .22-250. Good enough rifle for popping coyotes.

Fo anything else I prefer a good CRF rifle like an M70 or Mauser 98.

 

[WyoBull]

I have several, a couple of them going back to the 721 and 722 models, all older, back when they built a good rifle.

But, for DG I have a Win Model 70 375 H&H.

 

[mdwest]

I believe your referencing the M24 in the last paragraph, which would be their most consist and highest quality

Only partially..

Through the 80's and until the early 2000's, different variations of the 700 (largely the 700P, but also the Sendero, and a few others) were the base platforms for the vast majority of the major metro SWAT teams.. Miami PD, Houston PD, Dallas PD, NYPD, LAPD, Chicago PD, etc..etc.. all used the 700 in various "civilian" forms.. Most of the times these rifles were truly "off the shelf" with zero modifications done (many departments are very liability and litigation wary and dont want anything to be questioned about "why a lighter trigger?" or "if the gun wasnt good enough from the factory, why did you select it?", etc..)..

The 700 was the absolute standard.. anything else was an exception.. In the years I served as a sniper TL, I can only recall actually seeing 3 rifles deployed by tactical teams that weren't 700's (in the US)... There was a guy in Mississippi that had a full up Win 70 custom that had been built by a guy that was known for building Camp Perry winning rifles.. and I saw a couple of Accuracy International guns... SR-25 / AR-10's were just starting to make their rounds, but I didnt see anyone actually deploy them in service or at a competition or at a school even as late as 2004 (although I know the Dept of Energy nuke escort teams were already deploying them that early)...

The Army had the M24... and the USAF bought some M24's.. but to my knowledge neither the Navy or the USMC ever deployed the M24 (maybe they did, but Im not aware?)..

Very few police agencies used the M24 during its prime.. They did start obtaining them I believe in the mid 2000's through the DRMO program (where the military transfers older equipment that is no longer in use to police agencies).. but that was after the 700 had seen its prime in law enforcement, and my understanding is most of those M24's were pretty worn out and in need of significant time in the hands of an armorer to get them shooting decently again..

 

[Phil Giordano]

Maybe I was lucky, but my 700 in 300 Winch (20 years ago) was super accurate and dependable - but I know many 700 had trubles of some kind.
The only aspect I like it more than a classic mauser-type action, is that you can chamber round just putting one in, and close the bolt.
But many others have this option.
(And, me, between Tikka and Sako, I prefer Tikka because the ejector in on the head of the bolt, and not on the action)

 

[MS 9x56]

The Remington 700 is the most copied action type in the world now so it wasn't all bad. The execution of the design is where all the failures occured. I bad mouth it probably more than most but it is a home grown product so I have to find something good to say about it. Kind of like defending your brother. Now I got that PSA out of the way, there is nothing I can say to absolve the absolutely horrendous mismanagement that drove them under.

 

[grand veneur]

Remind that this topic is primarily about the use of a rifle Rem 700, in a suitable caliber for this purpose one must assume, when hunting DG. I don't think it's about making the Rem 700 rifles bad in general, rifles that assuredly have proved their worth when hunting other game species in different conditions.

 

[supergrizzly]

I've shot more US game with a .300 WM Model 700 than anything else I own and could be considered a "Remington guy". Mine is 60's vintage and is super accurate, super smooth and not too bad looking but for DG I would not use it based on the experience and knowledge of those who know more than I do on the subject (which is very little on DG). That said, I have no faults with either of mine, the other being a 22-250 Varmint gun, but would dare to say that the older the better with this model/brand. Friends that have bought newer ones have been dissapointed and the roulette wheel of ownership has destroyed a once proud brand. I would NOT buy a new one, instead searching out a more vintage one in great condition, if I decided I needed another.

 

[Ridge Runner]

The only Rem 700's I have owned were in 7mm mag, 30-06, maybe a 308 and a .243 and they were all mid 1970's - mid 1980's production. They were all off the shelf accurate, reliable, from the first shot I put through them to the more than well over 200+ shots (each) and I never had a problem with any of them. But, I only hunted various varmints, deer, (black) bear and boar.

Back in those days had I been offered an African safari, I would most definitely have opted for a 375 H&H or 416 Rigby for no other reason than those calibers and manufacturers were the "rage" for hunting in Africa.

That said, Would I buy a Remington 700 today, I don't know, probably not, as there are better quality firearms and firearm manufacturers to choose from for the same, or not much more in, price.

 

[Monsai52]

I'm curious, we're into 3 pages of why no to the 700, but are there any good reasons why someone would want to buy a 700? I can't think of any.

Best regards,

 

[colorado]

The Remington 270 Win 700 BDL I bought in the late 60s is the best rifle I've ever owned. Literally hunted with 50 to 100 days a year for decades. Never a failure to feed or function, superbly accurate, hunted in rain, snow etc. It still looks great, shoots great and with my handloads shoots 150g Partitions to nickle sized groups at 3000 fps. I've owned quite a few rifles, including Model 70s and my beloved CZ 550 in 500 Jeffery. The BDL still trumps them all.

 

[MS 9x56]

I'm curious, we're into 3 pages of why no to the 700, but are there any good reasons why someone would want to buy a 700? I can't think of any.

Best regards,

The old BDL’s were a nice looking and nicely finished rifle.

 

[curtism1234]

I'm curious, we're into 3 pages of why no to the 700, but are there any good reasons why someone would want to buy a 700? I can't think of any.

Best regards,

To me, safety location is def a consideration in buying any rifle. Everyone prefers something different. Imo, the 700 safety is a little easier to use than a wing safety, but nothing is easier than a tang.

As someone who swapped his model 70 375hh for a Savage 375hh (though I still own both), I can totally see why someone could prefer a 700.

 

[lockingblock]

If I wanted a 700 as a dangerous game rifle, I would call Chad Dixon at Longrifles Inc and tell him exactly what I wanted it to do. He is the 700 guru and is set up to built it into a perfect DG rifle.
his videos on 700 action work are like machining porn.

 

[Ridge Runner]

The old BDL’s were a nice looking and nicely finished rifle.

I had ADL's and BDL's both models were very nice rifles. If Remington every goes back to the quality and reliability of those early models I might be prompted to by Remington rifles.

Ruger, not sure how the Marlin brand will go since Ruger took over, Savage and Mossberg have up their accuracy, quality, and reliability at more affordable prices and improved their customer service.

Now someone please correct if I'm wrong.
If memory serves me right, Remington made a shotgun, the model 887, chambered for 2 3/4, 3, and 3 1/2 inch shells. The 2 3/4 and 3 inch shells worked fine. However the 3 1/2 inch shells it would kick a shell out of the magazine by way of the loading gate when the shooter would work the pump action to expell the fired shell.

Remington was aware of this problem from day one. After numberous calls from 887 owners Remington admitted the 887 had an unfixable problem, basically telling customers they weren't going to honor any service warranty.

Since then I never bought another Remington firearm for nearly 3 1/2-4 decades. Until I purchase 2 Remington Zastavas(??) Mark X from a fellow Asher a couple of years ago.

Piss poor customer service, why buy a Remington when their are better options.

 

[colorado]

If I wanted a 700 as a dangerous game rifle, I would call Chad Dixon at Longrifles Inc and tell him exactly what I wanted it to do. He is the 700 guru and is set up to built it into a perfect DG rifle.
his videos on 700 action work are like machining porn.

Norm Thompson was the only person to ever work on my 1960s BDL. He was an artist with the 700s. He tuned the trigger to break at a crisp 2.5 lbs. When I brought our Rem XCR II to Kevin Weaver (who is an absolutely fabulous gunsmith). I brought the BDL in 270 Win in. Told him we wanted a trigger like that. He dry fired that and said that's a Norm Thompson trigger! Norm passed about 15 years ago.

 

[Tbitty]

A used Remington 700 ADL in .30-06 was my first non-.22LR rifle. And despite some rough treatment in my more youthful years, all the harsh weather you can throw at it, and over 20 years of use in my hands (plus whatever came before me), I've never had a failure of any kind. Add in shooting several others new and old through the years, never seen an issue with my father's 7mag CDL, and you cannot convince me it is a bad rifle.

Yes there are both cheaper and more expensive rifles out there. Yes there are many with features that at least theoretically improve performance. And yes there are a great number of users who have had issues with the Rem 700 rifles through the years. But the Rem 700 is the most popular hunting rifle ever built for a reason- it's a damn good rifle. Short of the AK-47, it may be the most produced rifle of all time.

Both CF and PF are subject to failure if worked incorrectly. I don't buy the hype of CF being the be-all end-all style to use, and could care less what type is used in any rifle I buy. Modern production has greatly increased mass production accuracy, so I don't know that any "mainstream" rifle can claim to be better than another, at any price point.

I want the gun I'm using to shoot straight, feel good, and be comfortable to operate. The Rem 700 checks all those boxes and I would no doubt be willing to use one (caliber dependant) anywhere, any time, for any game.

 

[Racinjason]

The Remington 700 is a great action for hunting varmints all the way up to big game as well as long range target shooting and not many intelligent people will deny them of that. I have many Remington 700 actions as well as custom actions with a 700 footprint and I absolutely love them.
However, most people (myself included) believe them to be inferior to a Mauser style action when discussing Dangerous Game. Dangerous Game animals and their abilities are not to be taken lightly.
However many countless marvelous improvements one can make to a Remington 700 (m16 extractor and dual ejectors), it still does not hold a candle to a well built Mauser style control round feed action in this realm. Even if the likelihood is very very low, there is no room or time for a malfunction or hiccup when one of the big 5 come chasing after you.

One does not take a Ferrari to the Home Depot to grab a bunch of lumber and/or material, you bring a truck for such a job. Granted, you can definitely use a Ferrari to transport such materials, but I think most people would agree it's not the wisest of decisions.

I hope I do not offend anyone due to my opinions, as they are just that; opinions.

 

[RETD16]

I have owned and shot numerous Remington M700s. I currently own two Custom KS Mountain Rifles in 25/06 and 338 Win. Mag. I also have a BDL in 7mm Rem. Mag. Also owned a VSSF in 22-250. I had zero problems with them and ALL of them would easily shoot .60” or better. However, I do not believe that push feeds are appropriate for DG. My DG rifle is a Dakota 76 in 416 Rem. Mag.

 

[MS 9x56]

While this discussion focuses on the tool used the most important part of the DG hunt is the tool operator. One can never predict how anyone, even themselves will react when a snarling trumpeting very angry animal is coming for YOU very rapidly. Some panic, some freeze up, some run, and then there is the very small minority who go into that lazer focused zone that concentrates on making that shot that will drop his or her quarry. I would bet all that I own that 99% of “rifle” failures occur in the first 3 groups of hunters, most induced by operator error panic. Just one old hunters opinion.