Want To Buy Winchester Model 70 Pre 64 in 375 H&H

[Flanders357]

FYI, a 375Weatherby can shoot 375HH ammo.

Oh really...does having it bored out to 375 weatherby impact H&H shot groups?

 

[Flanders357]

Winchester collectors are an odd lot, obsessed with untouched by human hands, never fired, mint in cardboard box, etc. ANY fondling of a Pre-64 Model 70 diminishes value. I would imagine a truly mint in box, never opened nor handled 375HH would fetch $10,000 or more.

I like the opposite extreme.

Look at "Ruined" pre64 375HHs. Ruined as far as collector value would include stripped and refinished stocks, often way finer than original quality. It would also involve a Griffin & Howe side mount, a wonderful Quick Detach scope arrangement that destroys their value.

You can find a very beautiful, "Improved but now ruined for collectors" Pre64 375HH in the $1800-$2500. You will not find a higher quality, more field ready African bolt action rifle at that pricepoint.

Haha yeah im in the "shooter" pre 64 category...I use mine for hunting...dont mind blemishes at all...just want a good bore

 

[318AE]

Oh really...does having it bored out to 375 weatherby impact H&H shot groups?

Seems kind of the opposite of neck sizing brass, right? Hard to think it would make it more accurate. Handy in a pinch when you lose your ammo and H&H is the only ammo in camp.

 

[Flanders357]

Seems kind of the opposite of neck sizing brass, right? Hard to think it would make it more accurate. Handy in a pinch when you lose your ammo and H&H is the only ammo in camp.

Yeah, im wondering if the shot groups in the H&H would be less tight due to it being bored out

 

[Odinsraven]

433631 is for sale currently in Iceland but an easy ship to USA

 

[Flanders357]

433631 is for sale currently in Iceland but an easy ship to USA

Can you send more pics?

 

[WC86]

Damn it @rookhawk

Now my mind starts spinning up again

Gonna need more therapy and medication

 

[318AE]

Yeah, im wondering if the shot groups in the H&H would be less tight due to it being bored out

Like a lot of things, it probably varies a lot rifle to rifle. Given that two of the gazillion things people do to improve accuracy are neck sizing brass and carefully setting the COL and distance from the lands, it’s hard to imagine a cartridge in a rifle chambered for a different round will be particularly accurate. We’re talking about hunting rifles, so it may be fine.

You’ll find there is a lot of trivia around here people like to espouse etc.

 

[Flanders357]

@bobdahunter84, so what is your synopsis of the 375 H&H you posted a link to....It website sates it is of 1952 manufacture. Is this considered a "particular" model ? Alaskan term began in 1959; was this a "big" or "dangerous game " model, a "safari" or any other particular model. The buttpad looks black, was it red on the original model of that year ? The rear sight looks "small and lacking"--is this original ?
Should the front sight be hooded ? would the receiver be factory drilled and taped ? Could this possibly be a rebarrel based on length and taper of the barrel ?
Sorry for a lot of questions but there are a lot of unknowns. Finally, what would be a fair price for that particular rifle ?
Thanks

I reached out to the seller about the rifle a couple of days ago. He mentioned that he couldn't send pictures of the bore and would only accept offers within 10% of the asking price...anyone know anything about this seller barrybrowning?

 

[Jefferry404]

@Flanders357
The 375 Weatherby is .375 caliber, same as the H&H, only it has the double radius shoulder.
BTW, the Wisner rear sight comes in 3 or 4 contours, starting with the 458 and getting smaller,
Call them to see when back in stock

 

[Jhsmith]

Not a 375H&H.
Anything I can do to help contribute to your delinquency…

 

[Flanders357]

Not a 375H&H.
Anything I can do to help contribute to your delinquency…

It will probly move in that direction after i get the 375 in the quiver

 

[Flanders357]

@Flanders357
The 375 Weatherby is .375 caliber, same as the H&H, only it has the double radius shoulder.
BTW, the Wisner rear sight comes in 3 or 4 contours, starting with the 458 and getting smaller,
Call them to see when back in stock

yes sir i have a message in with them to see

 

[bobdahunter84]

@bobdahunter84, so what is your synopsis of the 375 H&H you posted a link to....It website sates it is of 1952 manufacture. Is this considered a "particular" model ? Alaskan term began in 1959; was this a "big" or "dangerous game " model, a "safari" or any other particular model. The buttpad looks black, was it red on the original model of that year ? The rear sight looks "small and lacking"--is this original ?
Should the front sight be hooded ? would the receiver be factory drilled and taped ? Could this possibly be a rebarrel based on length and taper of the barrel ?
Sorry for a lot of questions but there are a lot of unknowns. Finally, what would be a fair price for that particular rifle ?
Thanks

I'm certainly no expert on the pre 64s, but I own 30 or so of them, so I've gained probably more knowledge than the average guy.

In terms of the name "Alaskan" it was really just a marketing ploy. They didn't change anything with the gun when they attached the name to it. In fact, the 338 Win Magnum was also called the "Alaskan" in their catalog.

They similarly gave the 264 Win Mag a name "The Westerner". If you notice a trend--most of the names were attached to new cartridges Winchester had developed. The 264 Win Mag (Westerner), 338 Win Mag (Alaskan), 458 Win Mag (African). Really only the 375 H&H is the odd choice to give a name to, because it was a non-propietary classic caliber that had been around.

Specific to that random gun I posted a link of. Definitely not an original butt pad. To your point, the original would have been red. And most 70s came with the steel/aluminum/plastic butt plate. But the 375 did have the red rubber pad. The aftermarket pad in of itself is not a big deal in my opinion. From a value perspective, the bigger deal is when someone cut the stock to keep the LOP the same if the new pad is thicker. Not sure LOP on this one.

That rear sight is a good question..while I recognize it may look non-original, I believe that was likely factory installed. That appears to be a Lyman 48 WJS Receiver Sight. That sight could be requested when ordering a standard grade rifle. The good about it--it's probably a $300+ sight today if you took it off and sold it. The downside is the receiver would have holes if you did that. Hence the reason MANY pre 64s have the holes in the receivers from the different Lyman and Pachmayr receiver sights of the day.

A gun of this vintage would definitely be drilled and tapped from the factory. Don't quotes me, but I believe that started around serial number 87,000 give or take.

I bet 50% of model 70s i bought had sight hood removed. You can buy the after market ones on eBay or Gunbroker for $20 that are really no different than the originals. They slide on easy enough. I'm 41 years old, so never had the opportunity to buy a pre 64 from the factory. My understanding was they all shipped with the hood, but they weren't attached at factory. So if buyer didn't put it on, it often got lost.

24" barrel is an offering from the factory, so I have no reason to believe it was cut.

In terms of price, this one is fair it appears. Not an amazing deal by any means. But not an outrageous price either. A 375 H&H isn't a super rare caliber. But it's also not a 30-06 or 270. The rarity certainly impacts the value. If someone was thinking of taking off that sight and getting a few hundred for that, they might find the net price more appealing.

I was at Wanenmacher this past weekend. 80% of the sellers had the "I don't really want to sell this, but if you give me too much, I might" price. I'd say Gunbroker and Guns International are more reasonable than the gun shows generally but still a good portion of overpriced guns. Tracking the penny auctions with no reserves is an excellent way to get a feel of what they're actually worth....

Sorry for the long post. I think I answered all of the questions.

 

[RedTag]

Yes I have some pre 64s in a 243, 257 rob, and 264…all shooters and still hunt with them.
The 375 is a new animal to me though. My buddy has a pre 64 he would sell me for $2500, also a shooter, but it’s just a standard model. I may do that but I was hoping to find a safari version with the front sling on the barrel and I like the rear sight that began in the 1956 models. I don’t mind “shooter” rifles that have had butt pads added. I have a little time as I’m not headed to Africa until early 2027. Hoping to get it setup with EAW pivot mounts

If you have any 375’s your looking to offload let me know!

If your buddy has one to sell you for a fair price you should buy it. Being able to inspect a gun in person is a big deal in my opinion. An online seller who is unable or unwilling to send pictures of the bore (good ones) or pictures of the barreled action taken out of the stock, is either lazy or up to no good, and I’d avoid doing business with someone of either ilk.

 

[RedTag]

Winchester collectors are an odd lot, obsessed with untouched by human hands, never fired, mint in cardboard box, etc. ANY fondling of a Pre-64 Model 70 diminishes value. I would imagine a truly mint in box, never opened nor handled 375HH would fetch $10,000 or more.

I like the opposite extreme.

Look at "Ruined" pre64 375HHs. Ruined as far as collector value would include stripped and refinished stocks, often way finer than original quality. It would also involve a Griffin & Howe side mount, a wonderful Quick Detach scope arrangement that destroys their value.

You can find a very beautiful, "Improved but now ruined for collectors" Pre64 375HH in the $1800-$2500. You will not find a higher quality, more field ready African bolt action rifle at that pricepoint.

This is exactly what I did with my pre-‘64 .300 H&H Mag. I got the gun for well under a grand, with a half dozen non-original holes drilled in the receiver, the bluing gone, and the stock ruined. But the action was sound and the bore was still bright. So on to filling the unwanted holes, applying a nice two-tone cerakote, new sights, new scope, and nice new laminate stock. This 75 year old rifle looks like new, has all the features both old and new that I could want, oh and shoots like a dream. And the best part is I’m into it for less than the price of a new Portugal gun.