The dumb things I have done

[Eric Anderson]

I wonder what type of paperwork it takes to show up in Joberg and claim a rifle that has been sitting there for a year.

I just used my hand receipt that the Sgt gave me the year before. Picked it up, waited 5 mins for them to find the log book from that time last year, and signed the dotted line acknowledging receipt of my rifle back. I came away very impressed. Imagine if the TSA had been involved.

 

[Eric Anderson]

It is a total cost issue. I flew Emirates to Johannesburg in October. I did indeed purchase the travel permit. I also had business class tickets for less than a thousand more than steerage on Delta. Business on Delta was nearly 3K more than Emirates - the $200 seemed a pretty reasonable investment. Moreover, I frankly found it comforting to have a guy in a uniform walk my rifle to my next flight rather than some hourly wage baggage handler toss it on a cart. That is pretty close to a service.

Volunteering to store your rifle for a year sounds pretty darn creative to me.

Yea, SAPS storing my rifle for a year was awesome. Mentally I had already written off the rifle as lost when I went back down to the SAPS station. As far as Dubai, paying $200 each stopover for them to not manage to steal a $450 rifle seems excessive. I felt like I was being shaken down in all honesty. That is what upset me so much, and it lined up with my previous experiences in the Middle East. 15 years ago, I understood I was an uninvited foreign service member. I had always thought that much of the... unsavory character traits I witnessed were as a result of that. It was always in the back of my mind how I might act towards say, Russian troops in NC who had to overthrow my government because my government had screwed up so badly. Yes I would be grateful if the US government had gotten that bad, but I still would harbor a lot of resentment towards foreign troops.

Fast forward 15 years, I am a customer of their national airline, and welp, the sticky fingers and graft are in full force. Yes I had screwed up by not realizing that I was importing a firearm even though I never went through customs, but I can’t find any mention of the $200 fee on their website. https://www.emirates.com/english/help/firearms/declaration-form.aspx

 

[mdwest]

Im wondering if this fee in Dubai is something fairly new?

Its been a few years, but I used to transit Dubai with all sorts of "controlled" items (body armor, helmet, weapons parts, magazines, etc..)... Typically when going through Dubai to Iraq I only had a 4-5 hour layover... When going through Dubai to Afghanistan it was typically 24-48 hours though (we used to process our entry visas into Afghanistan at the A'stan embassy in Dubai and it would take at least a day, sometimes 2...)..

I never paid any sort of fee.. the police would meet me at customs, have me bring out my "stuff" for them to inspect.. then they would take it and store it in the police holding area for however long I was going to be there (to include even a 4 hour layover).. A couple of hours before I was ready to board my flight, I would just hand the gate agent my receipt from the police, and they would arrange to have my "stuff" moved from the storage locker to the aircraft...

Never once did I have anything go missing.. and never once did I pay a fee..

Granted, I wasnt transiting with an actual firearm or ammo... but there were literally hundreds of people doing this exact same thing every day back then with other items the Emirates wouldnt allow in their country .. and the police had the transaction down to a science.. it was efficient, easy, etc.. and they were always cordial, and reasonably friendly, etc.. I dont think it ever took me more than 20 minutes to hand off my stuff, or more than 20 minutes to get it back onto an aircraft..

I still transit Dubai at least once a year (sometimes more).. but havent taken any controlled "stuff" through there with me in probably 6-7 years..

 

[cagkt3]

I flew Emirates in March, no problems transiting Dubai. Had to file for a permit ahead of time, but I didn't pay a fee (or if I did it was rolled up in my airfare).

 

[Red Leg]

Yea, SAPS storing my rifle for a year was awesome. Mentally I had already written off the rifle as lost when I went back down to the SAPS station. As far as Dubai, paying $200 each stopover for them to not manage to steal a $450 rifle seems excessive. I felt like I was being shaken down in all honesty. That is what upset me so much, and it lined up with my previous experiences in the Middle East. 15 years ago, I understood I was an uninvited foreign service member. I had always thought that much of the... unsavory character traits I witnessed were as a result of that. It was always in the back of my mind how I might act towards say, Russian troops in NC who had to overthrow my government because my government had screwed up so badly. Yes I would be grateful if the US government had gotten that bad, but I still would harbor a lot of resentment towards foreign troops.

Fast forward 15 years, I am a customer of their national airline, and welp, the sticky fingers and graft are in full force. Yes I had screwed up by not realizing that I was importing a firearm even though I never went through customs, but I can’t find any mention of the $200 fee on their website. https://www.emirates.com/english/help/firearms/declaration-form.aspx

Checked my ticketing from last October. I did have to file in advance for a permit (six - weeks if I remember correctly), but there was no charge. I am sure working the thing on zero notice triggered some sort of fee. Similar things happen everyday a lot of places other than an Arab owned business.

I suspect I have spent a bit longer in the Middle East than most. Started with two years of language training at DLI for Arabic and FSI for the Arabian Peninsula dialect in the early eighties, a tour as an Army Attaché' in Riyadh in the late eighties, a fellowship at the School of Contemporary Arab Studies - Georgetown University, Desert Storm, several tours with CENTCOM, and lots of time working business deals for a major defense corporation from 2003 - 2014. I have negotiated everything from rugs to the US military use of the Doha Air Base. I have very mixed feelings about the Arabic people (to the extent any people can be stereotyped). I am not including Afghanis or Iranians - they are not Arabs.

They are typically unfailingly polite, and generous to a fault. Never admire an object in your host's home, or you are likely to find it delivered to your front door the next day as a gift. They are family oriented and love their children - typically spoiling them rotten. They have a culture steeped in for lack of a better word - "the deal." Bargaining is in their DNA, and they were "capitalists" long before the word was coined. They are also prisoners of a religion, which is slowly draining most of the initiative out of too many of their societies. Islamic fatalism - the notion that success is determined by submission to the will of God - wars daily with their more entrepreneurial instincts. It also inhibits basic inquisitive thought and wars with things like the scientific method. They can be recklessly brave, and yet seemingly impossible to train - that fatalism thing again.

Outside war zones, I have never been treated badly in an Arab country. Most Saudis for instance are very comfortable with us. Many of their technocrats and military leadership were educated in this country. Jordanians are some of the finest people you will ever meet. Their educated elite are very Euro-centric.

The problem is found in the uneducated fanatics with nothing to lose being manipulated by uneducated clergy and highly educated political opportunists trying to take advantage of available canon fodder. The most stupid decision we made in Iraq (which is saying something - there were a whole list of them) was to disband the Iraqi Army. That ended a State employment system for some 3/4's of a million Arab men. Most were left with no alternative than to embrace fanaticism. Hopefully the destruction of ISIS will weed out most of the remnants of that unintended consequence.

But I digress - a lot. I have always been fairly treated by Arab businesses. I personally think Emirates is the best airline flying today. To be fair, you presented them with a problem that was in direct violation of their firearms' transport policy. They found a work-around and charged you and administrative fee for doing it. Seems pretty reasonable to me. Most US or European Airlines would likely be somewhat less accommodating.

 

[Dragan N.]

Im wondering if this fee in Dubai is something fairly new?

Its been a few years, but I used to transit Dubai with all sorts of "controlled" items (body armor, helmet, weapons parts, magazines, etc..)... Typically when going through Dubai to Iraq I only had a 4-5 hour layover... When going through Dubai to Afghanistan it was typically 24-48 hours though (we used to process our entry visas into Afghanistan at the A'stan embassy in Dubai and it would take at least a day, sometimes 2...)..

I never paid any sort of fee.. the police would meet me at customs, have me bring out my "stuff" for them to inspect.. then they would take it and store it in the police holding area for however long I was going to be there (to include even a 4 hour layover).. A couple of hours before I was ready to board my flight, I would just hand the gate agent my receipt from the police, and they would arrange to have my "stuff" moved from the storage locker to the aircraft...

Never once did I have anything go missing.. and never once did I pay a fee..

Granted, I wasnt transiting with an actual firearm or ammo... but there were literally hundreds of people doing this exact same thing every day back then with other items the Emirates wouldnt allow in their country .. and the police had the transaction down to a science.. it was efficient, easy, etc.. and they were always cordial, and reasonably friendly, etc.. I dont think it ever took me more than 20 minutes to hand off my stuff, or more than 20 minutes to get it back onto an aircraft..

I still transit Dubai at least once a year (sometimes more).. but havent taken any controlled "stuff" through there with me in probably 6-7 years..

I would imagine that somebody working for the US army/government and travelling with "controlled items" would be treated differently than a random guy travelling with a firearm...

 

[mdwest]

I wasn’t working for the US Army or US government.

I was working for a private firm providing support services to other businesses involved in reconstruction efforts (re-establishing the electrical grid, etc) who were directly contracted with the Iraqi Ministry of Energy...

And to NGO’s involved in humanitarian demining efforts in Afghanistan...

 

[rdog]

WHY would you take a M16 to Africa?

 

[TwoTracks]

WHY would you take a M16 to Africa?

He was on a mandated “work” trip. This thread is a little old, but I like it, so I’m glad it got bumped.

 

[mark-hunter]

@rdog
he was a marine or army, and travelling to overeseas mission with marines. (in his younger days) and the thread is 2018 vintage.