Hornady 450/400 3"

[Garciamarquez1918]

Just doing at relative recoil calculations -- does anybody know the weight of the charge in Hornady factory loads? Thanks in advance.

 

[Bandera]

Just doing at relative recoil calculations -- does anybody know the weight of the charge in Hornady factory loads? Thanks in advance.

Nope but you could look load data for the 400 grain bullet @ 2150 fps. It would be a guess but get you close enough.
The Chuck Hawks site lites it at 51 ftp out of a 9 pound rifle.

450/.400-3" (400 at 2150)

9.0

51.0

 

[Garciamarquez1918]

Thanks for your help! But I'm interested in the actual powder weight because of course that affects recoil. Just trying to decide if it makes sense to develop a higher pressure load with lower powder weight or go with the flow and buy the Hornady.

 

[Surgeon1]

I hand load for all my doubles but many newer doubles from major manufactures use Hornady ammo to regulate their doubles. I’ve shot factory 450-400 in my Heym and 470 & 500 Heym with factory Hornady ammo and when velocities match there is very little if any recoil difference. I use 65gr RL 15 with 1gr filler to duplicate Factory Hornady velocity and can tell no difference in recoil. Same with 470 using IMR3031

 

[Bandera]

Thanks for your help! But I'm interested in the actual powder weight because of course that affects recoil. Just trying to decide if it makes sense to develop a higher pressure load with lower powder weight or go with the flow and buy the Hornady.

If you use the Barnes load data, which has powder weights.
71 grains to 77 grains of N160.
9 pound rifle.
71 grains powder, 400 grain bullet @ 1964 fps, Recoil Energy 45.85, recoil pulse 5.06 lbs sec, recoil velocity 18.1 fps.

77 grains powder, 400 grain bullet @ 2080 fps, Recoil Energy 52.19, recoil pulse 5.4 lbs sec, recoil velocity 19.32 fps.

6.34 ft lbs of difference. In my brain it is not worth chasing lower recoil. Especially on a double rifle where the regulation load is important.

On a Ruger No.1 or other single shot then yes it could be worth chasing the lower recoil. In which case I would look at CEB.

I reload for my Ruger No.1 450-400.

 

[deewayne2003]

I hand load for all my doubles but many newer doubles from major manufactures use Hornady ammo to regulate their doubles. I’ve shot factory 450-400 in my Heym and 470 & 500 Heym with factory Hornady ammo and when velocities match there is very little if any recoil difference. I use 65gr RL 15 with 1gr filler to duplicate Factory Hornady velocity and can tell no difference in recoil. Same with 470 using IMR3031

I find that odd, you feel the same recoil with the faster powders?

In my .470 I use 78gr IMR3031, foam wad, Win mag primer, 500gr bullet and get much less recoil compared to Hornady factory; although they both regulate beautifully and hit same point of aim.
(24” barrels)

 

[Nhoro]

I find that odd, you feel the same recoil with the faster powders?

In my .470 I use 78gr IMR3031, foam wad, Win mag primer, 500gr bullet and get much less recoil compared to Hornady factory; although they both regulate beautifully and hit same point of aim.
(24” barrels)

That is interesting, I would suggest that the powder weight difference at 5 or 6 grains is pretty small compared to bullet weight and rifle weight and so has less significance. It would suggest the Hornady load is travelling at higher velocity. I have a 458 lott. The difference between 2050 fps and 2190 fps is hardly noticeable. 2250 fps was a noticeable and then 2350 fps was a jump in recoil. I think the closer to max loading, the more significant the recoil.

 

[Bandera]

I would also add that with most of the recoil calculator's they do not take into account the burn rate of powder which does affect the recoil pulse.

There is most likely a generic value added to the calculation for a powder burn rate.
The goal is for an estimate on felt recoil.

 

[Legion]

Hornady's 450/400 3" Nitro Express load uses their 400 grain DGX (Dangerous Game eXpanding) or DGS (Dangerous Game Solid) bullet. Based on my experience pulling bullets and chronographing these (because I'm that guy who wants to know what's really in the case), the charge weight is approximately 85-90 grains of a proprietary slow-burning powder.

 

[Garciamarquez1918]

Fabulous thank you so much! If you happen to pull any more bullets are are able to actually weigh the charge I'd be hugely grateful.

 

[Tanks]

Thanks for your help! But I'm interested in the actual powder weight because of course that affects recoil. Just trying to decide if it makes sense to develop a higher pressure load with lower powder weight or go with the flow and buy the Hornady.

Why bother? .450/400 is the .22 of the NE calibers. Whatever load you develop will not reduce recoil significantly compared to factory loads.

 

[1dirthawker]

i tend to agree with @Tanks on this one, not a lot of difference either way. certainly not enough to be concerned about.

hornady loads in my 450-400 run at 2100 fps. my handloads for the rifle are the same velocity (since that is what it regulates at) can't tell any difference in recoil. find the velocity of hornady in your rifle,
work up a hand load that is close and go shoot something with it. the difference in this caliber is pretty small.

 

[Garciamarquez1918]

Why bother? .450/400 is the .22 of the NE calibers. Whatever load you develop will not reduce recoil significantly compared to factory loads.

Because I'm a delicate flower.

Maybe I'm missing something, but if the Hornady load is 90 grains, a 72 grain load reduces recoil energy by about 16% according to the online calculator I use. I'll take anything I can get!

 

[Tanks]

Because I'm a delicate flower.

Maybe I'm missing something, but if the Hornady load is 90 grains, a 72 grain load reduces recoil energy by about 16% according to the online calculator I use. I'll take anything I can get!

With proper technique recoil doesn't matter.

 

[Garciamarquez1918]

With proper technique recoil doesn't matter.

Well you're a better man than I, as are many here and elsewhere! Having had three serious concussions in my life I'm particularly sensitive to recoil. Add to that my bad technique and oh man it's a problem lolol.

 

[Tanks]

Well you're a better man than I, as are many here and elsewhere! Having had three serious concussions in my life I'm particularly sensitive to recoil. Add to that my bad technique and oh man it's a problem.

Here is a video I had made regarding the technique.
1) Let recoil happen, let the gun go up instead of directly back on to your shoulder. That reduces the recoil energy going back. It is like a pendulum. You will notice that my feet do not move at all.

Different view from the back, again upper body lets recoil happen, feet do not move at all.

 

[Tex .416]

That is interesting, I would suggest that the powder weight difference at 5 or 6 grains is pretty small compared to bullet weight and rifle weight and so has less significance. It would suggest the Hornady load is travelling at higher velocity. I have a 458 lott. The difference between 2050 fps and 2190 fps is hardly noticeable. 2250 fps was a noticeable and then 2350 fps was a jump in recoil. I think the closer to max loading, the more significant the recoil.

Concur, PSI may be a bigger factor than the charge weight. A few months ago, a member asked for some help with a youth load with the Barnes TTSX 130 in .30-06.
I use that bullet for hunting so tested some with the minimum charge weight of 53.5 of Varget which produced 3100 fps in a .30-06. That load is 6 grains more than my .308 Win load, 47.5 of Varget, with Varget, which is near max, but 100 fps slower at 3,000 fps. Both rifles weigh the same, the bullet was the same, the powder was the same, but the .308 load was lower velocity, but at near max pressure, while the .30-06 was 100 fps higher velocity, 6 grains more powder, but operating at minimum pressure. The minimum pressure .30-06 load had noticeably less recoil.

Here is the thread:

T

Post in thread 'Critique this youth load'

Dec 20, 2025

Rook,

caught a few minutes with relatively calm wind this afternoon before going out to hunt.

The first load tested was Varget for two reasons. First, I have lots of it on hand, which is an important factor to keeping life simple. Second, Varget provided the most case fill, which usually produces better accuracy.

Varget worked so well on the lowest charge weight of 53.5 grains with good velocity, this will be my hunting load for .30-06 for deer and pigs.

The recoil was very noticeably milder than my .308 load with the 130’s. This experiment reaffirmed something I have noticed in...

• Tex .416

• 
• 

 

[Bandera]

With proper technique recoil doesn't matter.

I agree Tanks. I shoot a No.1 in 450-400 and find it pleasant to shoot. Proper stance and balance make a huge difference.

 

[Longwalker]

I have pulled bullets from Hornady factory loads, and weighted the powder, but I have to recite from memory since I sold the rifle and with it the reloading records. 79 grains of a powder that "looks" similar to H1000 is what I recall.

 

[MacJenkins]

Surprised I had a box of DGX. Just pulled a round. It had 80.9 grains of powder. Similar color to H1000, but a lot bigger stick than that or H4831 or IMR4831. It’s about half way between those powders and 50 BMG.

I have a lot of powders and it does not look similar in size to anything I recall but does have that greenish tint that a lot of Hodgdon powders have.

I’m not too sure why it matters. I doubt the box of ammo I have now, that Im guessing is 15ish years old is the same powder they used 5 years ago or today.

I’m a big believer in the faster powder for doubles, the recoil difference is very noticeable to me. I think I’ve only used RL15 in the two 400’s I’ve owned but have shot lots of variation of powders in the 450’s and up I have and had.

My Westley 450/400 loves 400 CPS and solid Northforks with 65.0 RL15 @ 2040fps for a reference.

My 577 with a 750 regulates at 115 grains of RL15, or 139 grains of IMR4831. The IMR gets your attention really fast.

My technique is different than Tanks in the video. His is not wrong just different than mine. I square up a lot more when shooting the big rifles and suck up the recoil more. For me it makes that second shot much faster as my barrels don’t come off target as much. For me is actually easier on the pocket of my shoulder as well because I mount the gun just a bit farther in towards my chest. Probably half a pad width.

Everyone is different, use what works for you.