COVID vaccination required by Safari Company or not, your suggestion

[JGRaider]

You guys will have better luck winning the next Olympic 100M dash that getting factual information from the fed gov't, et al.

 

[Rimshot]

Thats fair enough, I was thinking more like people like my great aunt, she was in her 90s was on hospice care and caught it. So she was dying but did she die of COVID or with COVID...I guess in the end it doesn't matter but how many instances are like this, 10%, 20%, I don't know and again not sure it matters.

I think in the end it does matter a great deal. If we are going to entertain changes in our personal behavior or larger government policy (though I personally advocate for extremely limited gov't interference if any), then we need good data.

I hate to call this a silver lining, but the sheer number of deaths from all causes that remain very regular year over year, and the sheer number of COVID-19 deaths make it easy to tease out a number that reflects reality with very high accuracy. The case of your great aunt is a perfect example. Someone in hospice care is likely to die within the year, and thus would be accounted for in the "normal number of deaths" year over year, and NOT count as an "excess death" attributable to COVID-19. You could have a very large number of cases exactly like your aunt, and they wouldn't move the needle at all because they would have been already counted as a "normal" death at the close of the year. I think it's possible we might see a decrease in total deaths in the next few years as the oldest and sickest people were most susceptible to dying of COVID, and they died a few years sooner than they otherwise would have. I also think we should be taking the number of lost life-years into account, as one could make a strong argument that 30 life-years lost by a 50 year old dying is more important than 5 life years lost by an 85 year old dying.

 

[Rimshot]

Ultimately the data that is presented will be accepted as valid if the audience trusts those presenting it. Those presenting the data are mostly politicians who just can't help themselves and politicize the issue. This clouds the waters and leaves one wondering just what the truth is.

Some will choose to believe their side is right and the other is wrong simply because of politics and nothing else. The rest continue to try and separate the fly shit from the pepper and get to the truth.

Either way, our politicians have to bear responsibility for what they say and how that affects the public. Thus far, Biden has been a disaster seemingly only capable of communicating what flavor of ice cream he wants and that's if someone doesn't cut off his microphone. And Fauci has been caught contradicting himself. The old adage of FUBAR comes to mind.

This is a strong argument for finding sources you trust. Do not blindly trust politicians (I'm constantly surprised how many people still do, when the joke about a politicians lips moving is so old). Most people are just too lazy to look at source data, but at least get your info from a respected science journal without a political agenda. Anything fishy can/will be sussed out by looking at the study posted for all to see either by you or someone else, or failure of replication. Science is an extremely powerful process of finding truth, not a faith or religion.

 

[Rimshot]

You guys will have better luck winning the next Olympic 100M dash that getting factual information from the fed gov't, et al.

I couldn't agree more. Gov't has too many incentives and conflicting interests to be a reliable source of information for the commoners like us.

 

[firehuntfish]

ven the often trotted out "died with COVID vs died of COVID" isn't as big of a problem or mystery as some would claim. Now, I agree that we shouldn't count a car accident victim with COVID or a late stage rapid death cancer victim necessarly as COVID deaths, but these numbers are tiny in relative terms and easy to account for.

I think the data is as reliable as deaths associated with heart disease, cancer, flu etc. Someone with heart disease can die of a quick terminal cancer, someone with cancer can die of the flu, etc. There will be some discrepancy with any form of death.

Again, I have no political agenda here, but my personal experience with the actual number of deaths being reported as a direct result from contracting Covid has been quite different than merely anecdotal or representative of a tiny minority as you might be inclined to believe.

Per the CDC's own website, any death where the patient was Covid positive at the time of death, is recorded as a "Covid death". We are not talking about cases were patients who died of SARDS or pneumonias that were exacerbated by the presence of Covid. I am specifically referring to cases where the patient was admitted as a trauma victim or suffering from an acute MI or stroke were death was eminent and the patient coincidentally tested positive for Covid. These cases are and continue to be counted toward the overall "Covid death" total and they are occurring frequently and in alarmingly large numbers.

I am in no way attempting to discount the seriousness of this disease. I have had it myself, and I wouldn't wish it upon anyone. It can certainly be very dangerous, especially to those folks of certain demographics and comorbidities. With that said, I can also tell you that I have first-hand knowledge that these numbers are not being reported accurately. I have the ability to follow up with confidential patient outcomes after we transfer care of the patient to the hospitals, and I can tell you that I have personally treated dozens of trauma and acutely ill patients who absolutely did not die from Covid, yet because the hospital reported that they tested Covid positive at the time of death, it was reported to the State as a "Covid death". I would estimate about 20-30% of the patients I personally treated in the last 18 months who expired were misreported in regard to their actual cause of death.

Therefore, the obvious question is why would this be happening? It appears the CDC's allowance of such a broad generalization diagnosis fits the agenda of two separate narratives. Hospitals have been and continue to get compensated generously from the federal government for any Covid positive case they treat. The motivation for them to fudge up the numbers is obvious. The second motivation would be for the CDC to bolster its narrative that this disease is much deadlier than it actually is. As for why the CDC would do that, I suppose you would have to ask them. All I can tell you is what I have seen for myself.

 

[Rimshot]

Again, I have no political agenda here, but my personal experience with the actual number of deaths being reported as a direct result from contracting Covid has been quite different than merely anecdotal or representative of a tiny minority as you might be inclined to believe.

Per the CDC's own website, any death where the patient was Covid positive at the time of death, is recorded as a "Covid death". We are not talking about cases were patients who died of SARDS or pneumonias that were exacerbated by the presence of Covid. I am specifically referring to cases where the patient was admitted as a trauma victim or suffering from an acute MI or stroke were death was eminent and the patient coincidentally tested positive for Covid. These cases are and continue to be counted toward the overall "Covid death" total and they are occurring frequently and in alarmingly large numbers.

I am in no way attempting to discount the seriousness of this disease. I have had it myself, and I wouldn't wish it upon anyone. It can certainly be very dangerous, especially to those folks of certain demographics and comorbidities. With that said, I can also tell you that I have first-hand knowledge that these numbers are not being reported accurately. I have the ability to follow up with confidential patient outcomes after we transfer care of the patient to the hospitals, and I can tell you that I have personally treated dozens of trauma and acutely ill patients who absolutely did not die from Covid, yet because the hospital reported that they tested Covid positive at the time of death, it was reported to the State as a "Covid death". I would estimate about 20-30% of the patients I personally treated in the last 18 months who expired were misreported in regard to their actual cause of death.

Therefore, the obvious question is why would this be happening? It appears the CDC's allowance of such a broad generalization diagnosis fits the agenda of two separate narratives. Hospitals have been and continue to get compensated generously from the federal government for any Covid positive case they treat. The motivation for them to fudge up the numbers is obvious. The second motivation would be for the CDC to bolster its narrative that this disease is much deadlier than it actually is. As for why the CDC would do that, I suppose you would have to ask them. All I can tell you is what I have seen for myself.

Here are the deaths for the last few years. In what category would you move the large proportion of the presumed 345,000 COVID deaths into and have the data still make sense? If it is misrepresented, there should be a glaring drop in heart disease or injuries or others that are miscategorized as COVID, but where? Your anecdotal personal experience does not play out in the numbers, as a 20-30% misreported COVID deaths would be 100,000 people missing from other categories of death, and they clearly are not. In fact, many other leading causes of death increased in 2020 (heart disease and injuries the most glaring examples)

Reported US deaths by cause

This is a fantastic lesson in how personal experience and anecdotal evidence are often a poor representation of what is actually occurring on a large scale.

 

[Randy Bo]

I am specifically referring to cases where the patient was admitted as a trauma victim or suffering from an acute MI or stroke were death was eminent and the patient coincidentally tested positive for Covid.

So, are you saying that a patient who comes into the ER from a severe car accident and has sustained multiple significant injuries that resulted in significant blood loss and eventually dies because the bleeding could not be stopped in time...is tested for Covid...and if positive...the doctor records the cause of death as a "Covid Death"...with zero mention of a car accident...the multiple traumas...and the significant loss of blood...And that for every 10 trauma patients (who eventually die) that you transport to the ER...3 of those deaths are recorded as "Covid Deaths"?

 

[Randy Bo]

Therefore, the obvious question is why would this be happening? It appears the CDC's allowance of such a broad generalization diagnosis fits the agenda of two separate narratives. Hospitals have been and continue to get compensated generously from the federal government for any Covid positive case they treat.

So, not only are doctors recording the incorrect cause of death (up to 30% of the time)...they are also claiming to have treated the Covid positive person for Covid related symptoms...who possibly lived only for a few minutes or a few hours after arrival...Again with no mention of the car accident, trauma, blood loss, etc...?

 

[marksman]

First off, a virus mutates at random. It doesn't "want" anything as it's arguably not even alive. No thoughts or even metabolism is happening at all, it is just a protein surrounding some genetic code. It is no more alive than the mis-folded protein (prion) that causes mad cow disease or chronic wasting disease.

The mutations that become common will be the result of natural selection. Since it takes over a month on average to kill the host, there will be no selective pressure to make it less lethal, because it can already spread very efficiently and rapidly during the pre-symptomatic phase. A person in isolation dying in the hospital is effectively done spreading the virus. The Delta variant is in fact more deadly in part because of the increased viral load.

The most pertinent/recent:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41...45_deeplink_PID100085446&utm_content=deeplink

For the layman:
https://time.com/6098479/moderna-covid-19-booster-shot/

Some other interesting reading:
https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-r...ntech-announce-submission-initial-data-us-fda

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2114255?query=featured_home

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2113468

https://www.science.org/doi/full/10.1126/science.abj4176

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.11.21261876v1

thanks for the reply Rimshot
TBH its nothing l haven't seen before although to be informed, well worth a look
it still is IMHO like a dog chasing its tail, being not a true vaccine that sterilises the virus or gives you immunity to the virus, unless you decide to go for the new definition of what a vaccine does LOL
if you can have a treatment that will stop you getting seriously ill or going to hospital what is better?

Dr Zelenko Interview with Craig Kelly - How can Australia Get it so Wrong

⁣Craig Kelly Interviews Dr Zelenko Share Link: ⁣https://www.ourfreedomtube.com/v/hDDVoI Explaining How Australia is focussed on Vaccines that have failing Efficacy and Zero Medium and Long Term Safety Data, Craig

www.ourfreedomtube.com

this is just another treatment worth while trying,
much better than being told to go home and if you get worse go to hospital when its too late for a treatment dont you think?
if you are going to encourage the jabs and boosters really Israeli data should be looked at as being one of the most vaccinated countries in the world, who per capita have very high level of cases of vaccinated people, they are going onto the 4th shot now and consider double jabbed people as unvaccinated, still in the belief that the jab is the answer but going downhill very fast because the vaccine gave them a false sence of security, the Israeli's also reported in their studies that the efficacy of the double jabbed with Pfizer dropped significantly down after six months

COVID-19 vaccine impact in Israel and a way out of the pandemic

In December, 2020, Israel initiated a national campaign to vaccinate its population with Pfizer–BioNTech's mRNA COVID-19 vaccine BNT162b2 (tozinameran). Israel's Ministry of Health recommended a two-dose schedule with a 21-day interval between doses. Israel delivered more than 10 million doses...

www.thelancet.com

but you have data from all over the world that shows the use of anti virials work if used correctly and as an early treatment, it should also be mentioned that it is reported that these vaccines lower your natural immunity and as the mutations happen and the vaccines do not work as well
here is a link for a blog l frequent that shows a thread about "Uttar Pradesh, India, wipes out covid with Ivermectin" India is at about 13.5% fully vaxxed

Uttar Pradesh, India, wipes out Covid with ivermectin « JoNova

joannenova.com.au

everyone will see things how they want to see it and people are getting hot about the vaccines when we all should be instead looking at treatments that are already shown to work and are already available, Big Pharma and Big Government won’t champion the cheap drugs that work

regards Mark

 

[Cam Moon]

This is a very lengthy thread, and I'm frustrated enough with all the BS surrounding this that I couldn't bring myself to read the whole thing. I think my time would be better spent on reading up on the science and research about the virus. From what I've found, if someone has had both shots and they contact Covid19, they should suffer less symptoms and recover quicker than they would had they not received any shots. They can still get Covid19 and they can still transmit Covid19 to others. With that in mind, I don't understand some of the comments on here. Now, I'm not trying to be controversial. I'm looking for an explanation, as it doesn't make sense to me.

Do not let people who object to a simple vaccine put you or your people in danger. You will find that many people are ok with it and some aren’t but you have to keep the safety of your people in mind no matter the opinion of others.

How is the owner or their employees at risk by allowing someone to hunt there who has not had any shots? (Providing that all staff have)

I wouldn’t want to share camp with someone that cares so little about his fellow man that he refuses a vaccine just to make the point that “you can’t make me”.

This one I really don't get. To imply that someone doesn't care about others if they have chosen to not have the shot(s) seems excessive. In fact (providing the information I have is correct) it may show that they care MORE! (Hear me out here.....)
Our world is changing. Very noticeably so. And not for the better. I'm finding this whole "cancel culture" and "me too" movement is very detrimental for our society. We have more and more people who feel so entitled it's ridiculous. People expecting something for nothing, and then crying foul if they don't get it. We have scads of "sheeple" who act like mindless drones just blindly following orders and never questioning it. It's like watching a futuristic horror movie. And in these movies types of movies who are the heroes? The ones who question why. The ones that stand up.... Not just for themselves, but for their fellow man as well.
If someone not getting the jab really only puts themselves at risk, and they choose to do so to make a stand because they feel that people's rights are being violated, are they not putting the greater good of society ahead of their own safety?
Just another way to look at it.

Ultimately, I don't think it matters .what @Tokoloshe Safaris decides, because our governments are going to decide for us. They will tell us what we must do, and we will do it. Du MUSST!!!
I doubt I'm the only one who sees this.
BUT.......IF on the slim chance that it isn't made mandatory and you (or another outfit) mandated it for yourself (themselves) I wouldn't be in support of it. I don't know if I'd go as far as saying that it would be a deal breaker, but I'd prefer someplace that put a higher value on freedom of choice .

 

[Rimshot]

thanks for the reply Rimshot
TBH its nothing l haven't seen before although to be informed, well worth a look
it still is IMHO like a dog chasing its tail, being not a true vaccine that sterilises the virus or gives you immunity to the virus, unless you decide to go for the new definition of what a vaccine does LOL
if you can have a treatment that will stop you getting seriously ill or going to hospital what is better?

Dr Zelenko Interview with Craig Kelly - How can Australia Get it so Wrong

⁣Craig Kelly Interviews Dr Zelenko Share Link: ⁣https://www.ourfreedomtube.com/v/hDDVoI Explaining How Australia is focussed on Vaccines that have failing Efficacy and Zero Medium and Long Term Safety Data, Craig

www.ourfreedomtube.com

this is just another treatment worth while trying,
much better than being told to go home and if you get worse go to hospital when its too late for a treatment dont you think?
if you are going to encourage the jabs and boosters really Israeli data should be looked at as being one of the most vaccinated countries in the world, who per capita have very high level of cases of vaccinated people, they are going onto the 4th shot now and consider double jabbed people as unvaccinated, still in the belief that the jab is the answer but going downhill very fast because the vaccine gave them a false sence of security, the Israeli's also reported in their studies that the efficacy of the double jabbed with Pfizer dropped significantly down after six months

COVID-19 vaccine impact in Israel and a way out of the pandemic

In December, 2020, Israel initiated a national campaign to vaccinate its population with Pfizer–BioNTech's mRNA COVID-19 vaccine BNT162b2 (tozinameran). Israel's Ministry of Health recommended a two-dose schedule with a 21-day interval between doses. Israel delivered more than 10 million doses...

www.thelancet.com

but you have data from all over the world that shows the use of anti virials work if used correctly and as an early treatment, it should also be mentioned that it is reported that these vaccines lower your natural immunity and as the mutations happen and the vaccines do not work as well
here is a link for a blog l frequent that shows a thread about "Uttar Pradesh, India, wipes out covid with Ivermectin" India is at about 13.5% fully vaxxed

Uttar Pradesh, India, wipes out Covid with ivermectin « JoNova

joannenova.com.au

everyone will see things how they want to see it and people are getting hot about the vaccines when we all should be instead looking at treatments that are already shown to work and are already available, Big Pharma and Big Government won’t champion the cheap drugs that work

regards Mark

You're kind of all over the place @marksman but I will try to clear up your confusion on a number of things that here.

First off, the vaccines we have available in the USA (assuming you're in the USA) do provide sterilizing immunity, the mRNA ones being the highest % of people and J&J a little behind. This means they give you immunity to the virus and prevent infection entirely. So social media memes that claim this isn't a true vaccine or it doesn't provide immunity are simply lies, and couldn't be any easier to verify. What is true is that the primary goal of the vaccine was to prevent serious disease, and that sterilizing immunity was a bonus effect that was hoped for, but not a requirement to be deemed a success.

These vaccines both prevent catching the virus in the first place and prevent serious disease if you do catch it far, far better than any other treatment or drug so far (and other vaccines developed by Russia/China/UK). We absolutely do need to explore and test other currently available drugs and interventions. Especially cheap treatments that may not have an incentive from the private sector to run proper controlled trials on, we may even need public funded science here. I believe it is happening, but I haven't kept up with all of it lately. Many people are addicted to 'hopium' and jump the gun when something new may show promise. There appears to be some weak evidence for ivermectin but we need controlled experiments, not anecdotal correlation, in order to be confident enough that it works or does anything at all. Until then it is a fake 'miracle cure' like hydroxychloroquine, and countless other drugs that were touted as the next miracle covid cure but either had no effect or very minor benefit. Show me a randomized controlled trial and then we can determine if something may work, until then it's throwing darts and the evidence is extremely weak, and has a good chance of being caused by something else entirely. Science and scientific thinking is NOT natural to our species or how our brains work, but is necessary to learn how things actually are, not how we want them to be.

If you go back in this thread a bit, I talk about waning immunity and dropping antibody levels (you're referring to the Israeli data). This was no surprise and I talk at length about the implications and how vaccines and immunity work. I hope you will go back a few pages and read through it.

 

[thriller]

This is a very lengthy thread, and I'm frustrated enough with all the BS surrounding this that I couldn't bring myself to read the whole thing. I think my time would be better spent on reading up on the science and research about the virus. From what I've found, if someone has had both shots and they contact Covid19, they should suffer less symptoms and recover quicker than they would had they not received any shots. They can still get Covid19 and they can still transmit Covid19 to others. With that in mind, I don't understand some of the comments on here. Now, I'm not trying to be controversial. I'm looking for an explanation, as it doesn't make sense to me.

How is the owner or their employees at risk by allowing someone to hunt there who has not had any shots? (Providing that all staff have)

This one I really don't get. To imply that someone doesn't care about others if they have chosen to not have the shot(s) seems excessive. In fact (providing the information I have is correct) it may show that they care MORE! (Hear me out here.....)
Our world is changing. Very noticeably so. And not for the better. I'm finding this whole "cancel culture" and "me too" movement is very detrimental for our society. We have more and more people who feel so entitled it's ridiculous. People expecting something for nothing, and then crying foul if they don't get it. We have scads of "sheeple" who act like mindless drones just blindly following orders and never questioning it. It's like watching a futuristic horror movie. And in these movies types of movies who are the heroes? The ones who question why. The ones that stand up.... Not just for themselves, but for their fellow man as well.
If someone not getting the jab really only puts themselves at risk, and they choose to do so to make a stand because they feel that people's rights are being violated, are they not putting the greater good of society ahead of their own safety?
Just another way to look at it.

Ultimately, I don't think it matters .what @Tokoloshe Safaris decides, because our governments are going to decide for us. They will tell us what we must do, and we will do it. Du MUSST!!!
I doubt I'm the only one who sees this.
BUT.......IF on the slim chance that it isn't made mandatory and you (or another outfit) mandated it for yourself (themselves) I wouldn't be in support of it. I don't know if I'd go as far as saying that it would be a deal breaker, but I'd prefer someplace that put a higher value on freedom of choice .

Well people are at more risk of contracting a virus from people who have it cam and people who are unvaccinated are more likely to have it. ( this is a fact not an opinion) also the shots are not as available in Africa (at least as of June when I was there). I will not debate your personal feelings on the vaccine as there is no point, but a man who owns a business has the right to do what he feels is best for his people and business.

 

[Zambezi]

I don't think Cam is dictating what any business should or should not do (unless I am reading it incorrectly). He is stating, as would state, that should a business demand that I be vaccinated or I couldn't hunt with them then I would find another business that would cater to me. If the staff are vaccinated then they have their "protection" and the "amount" of virus that a nonvaccinated person carries MAY only be a few percent higher than a vaccinated person. If they want to lose my business for a few theoretical percent then that is their choice. Like it is my choice to find another business to do business with.

 

[machinistbutler]

The numbers are so bad here that a new set of restrictions has been announced. No admission to football ,hockey or other venues without proof of vaccination, or a negative covid test within 48 hours.

Alberta's ICU are full. 93 percent of those in the ICU have not been fully vaccinated. I hope I don't have a heart attack, get hurt at work or a traffic accident where I need critical care in the next few weeks.

Restaurants will be closed as well for any indoor dining , unless proof of double vaccination for everyone screening is done. I think single household outdoor dining is ok. Liquor sales have to be stopped at 10 pm, no idea what that will do.

I don't eat in restaurants much anyways, Scary stuff. Kids sports are being allowed to continue thank goodness. The last thing kids need is to have that shut down again.

On a lighter note I think I caught the exlax variant yesterday.

 

[Red Leg]

The numbers are so bad here that a new set of restrictions has been announced. No admission to football ,hockey or other venues without proof of vaccination, or a negative covid test within 48 hours.

Alberta's ICU are full. 93 percent of those in the ICU have not been fully vaccinated. I hope I don't have a heart attack, get hurt at work or a traffic accident where I need critical care in the next few weeks.

Restaurants will be closed as well for any indoor dining , unless proof of double vaccination for everyone screening is done. I think single household outdoor dining is ok. Liquor sales have to be stopped at 10 pm, no idea what that will do.

I don't eat in restaurants much anyways, Scary stuff. Kids sports are being allowed to continue thank goodness. The last thing kids need is to have that shut down again.

On a lighter note I think I caught the exlax variant yesterday.

Our restaurants have been fully open since January, kids have been in school since last year, and our football stadiums are full. And we aren't wearing masks. Hospitalizations are up because of Delta, but ICUs are managing just fine (except where staff has quit rather than submit to mandatory vaccination.)

The death rate in Texas, according to the CDC this morning, is 211 per 100,000 in population and 23d in the country. That death rate is below blue state utopias like New Jersey (2d), New York (3d), Massachusetts (5th), Connecticut (11th), and Pennsylvania (14th). California is doing better with 171 death per 100,000. The overall US mortality rate per 100,000 is 1.6%. Canada's is 1.7%. according to this morning's Johns Hopkins Coronavirus Resource Center - and after all of Canada's strict restrictions.

I am absolutely not saying the virus isn't real. I am vaccinated. But, I am suggesting the measures that government has attempted to use to limit the disease's spread do not work particularly well.

Thankfully, Almost a year ago much of the South essentially decided to follow the Swedish model. As a result, I suspect our post-exposure natural immunity levels are actually much higher than the rest of the country.

It would be useful if the government would undertake anti-body testing with half the enthusiasm that it is trying to mandate vaccination. Then we could focus vaccine delivery on those people who actually need it.

 

[firehuntfish]

This is a fantastic lesson in how personal experience and anecdotal evidence are often a poor representation of what is actually occurring on a large scale.

Like I said, you can choose to believe whatever narrative you like. I'm only representing the observations I know to be factual from personal experience of how Covid deaths are being documented and reported in the most populated tri-county area of Florida. I don't know the numbers around the rest of the country, but the reporting method hospitals are using for the CDC is the same in all 50 States. Regardless, It's not personal for me. I'm not trying to be argumentative, only informative. If you don't like what you are hearing, or want to dismiss my experiences as anecdotal, you are certainly free to do so... Not much I can do about that.

I appreciate the statistical link on US causes of death you provided. The only problem with your theory here is that in all of these cases I have mentioned, the primary cause of death is STILL being reported as heart disease, pneumonia, trauma, etc.,. For example, a death resulting from an acute MI is being recorded as heart disease as the primary cause of death, yet if the patient was also Covid-positive, it is doubly counted by the CDC as a "Covid death". That's why your are seeing consistency in the numbers.

On the CDC reporting forms, there is one line for the primary cause of death and 3 lines for secondary or underlying causes where Covid positive can (and is) being listed. This "Covid positive" report, regardless of it being the primary cause, secondary cause, or merely coincidental, still allows for the CDC to record it as a "Covid death". Don't take my word for it. It's listed as reporting criteria right on the CDC's website. It's just not being reported in MSM...

So, are you saying that a patient who comes into the ER from a severe car accident and has sustained multiple significant injuries that resulted in significant blood loss and eventually dies because the bleeding could not be stopped in time...is tested for Covid...and if positive...the doctor records the cause of death as a "Covid Death"...with zero mention of a car accident...the multiple traumas...and the significant loss of blood...And that for every 10 trauma patients (who eventually die) that you transport to the ER...3 of those deaths are recorded as "Covid Deaths"?

The first part of your question is answered above.. The 30% estimate is not all trauma. Some are trauma, some are acute MI, stroke, cardiac and respiratory arrests from hospice patients... But, yes. The average has been 3 out of 10 in time frames when cases have spiked... At least from my area where we have 6 different Fire-Rescue Departments transporting patients to 5 regional hospitals. 30% is an average.

So, not only are doctors recording the incorrect cause of death (up to 30% of the time)...they are also claiming to have treated the Covid positive person for Covid related symptoms...who possibly lived only for a few minutes or a few hours after arrival...Again with no mention of the car accident, trauma, blood loss, etc...?

No, that's is not what I am saying exactly... All patients transported to the ER in Florida who are eventually admitted are tested for Covid regardless of the condition that they are in at the time of arrival.. The way the CDC cause of death reporting forms are formatted, doctors are required to list Covid as either "underlying" or "present" if the patient was positive upon arrival in the ER. So, even if a doctor treats a gun shot patient who dies from "hypovolemia due to GSW" as the primary cause of death, if the patient also tested Covid positive, it is listed as an underlying cause and the CDC counts it as a Covid death.

I'm not accusing doctors of falsifying causes of death... I'm not accusing the hospitals of reporting false statistics either, although they certainly have financial motivation to report as many Covid cases as possible... The doctors are following the instructions they are given on the forms. I am accusing the CDC of misleading the public with the data provided. Whether it is intentional or not, the way the CDC qualifies a Covid death is completely misleading.

 

[machinistbutler]

Our restaurants have been fully open since January, kids have been in school since last year, and our football stadiums are full. And we aren't wearing masks. Hospitalizations are up because of Delta, but ICUs are managing just fine (except where staff has quit rather than submit to mandatory vaccination.)

The death rate in Texas, according to the CDC this morning, is 211 per 100,000 in population and 23d in the country. That death rate is below blue state utopias like New Jersey (2d), New York (3d), Massachusetts (5th), Connecticut (11th), and Pennsylvania (14th). California is doing better with 171 death per 100,000. The overall US mortality rate per 100,000 is 1.6%. Canada's is 1.7%. according to this morning's Johns Hopkins Coronavirus Resource Center - and after all of Canada's strict restrictions.

I am absolutely not saying the virus isn't real. I am vaccinated. But, I am suggesting the measures that government has attempted to use to limit the disease's spread do not work particularly well.

Thankfully, Almost a year ago much of the South essentially decided to follow the Swedish model. As a result, I suspect our post-exposure natural immunity levels are actually much higher than the rest of the country.

It would be useful if the government would undertake anti-body testing with half the enthusiasm that it is trying to mandate vaccination. Then we could focus vaccine delivery on those people who actually need it.

I just think it is very sad that in the next week doctors will have to decide who lives and dies. They are already bringing in nurses from another province, paying them a $20 an hour premium over the nurses already here. They are having to fly patients to other areas for treatment.

Our province lifted all restrictions, going a different path than any other province in Canada. The health care system can't handle what has happened since. Our province also has the lowest vaccination rates in Canada.

Anti vax rallies at hospitals too aren't helping anything either. It is just making people on both sides angry.

 

[Rickmt]

In my humble opinion there is a tremendous amount of unnecessary noise and hysteria surrounding the virus and vaccines. I believe in medicine and my doctor is my source of quality information. Talk to your doctor and consider vaccination seriously or accept the increased possibility of more serious illness or death for yourself or those around you. Don’t get your information from anyone other than your doctor!

 

[machinistbutler]

I prefer to take advice from my doctor, pharmacist who I trust with all my health care questions. When travelling I took the advice on what typhoid , hepatitis, tetanus or whatever else I needed to protect myself . I didn't research Guido PappyLong Pans hepatitis cure all foot rub.

Sitting on the throne with Google one can find any number of "experts" to validate any opinion. Thankfully Africahunting.com is a much nicer and more entertaining read for me.

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

As I have stated many times, as a Safari operator we do not require that visiting hunters be vaccinated for Covid 19. We do not require that are employees are vaccinated, but all of our employees were gladly vaccinated (2 jabs).

I know people feel strongly on this subject, but I never had any idea how strongly for or against.

We also do not require that visiting hunters take a malaria medication, the choice is yours.