Bullet Performance Database

[Mike Van Horn]

Something went wrong, here's the photos to the above post

 

[C.W. Richter]

Sorry about the flash: Foreground- 400 gr. Swift A-Frame with buffalo shoulder bone fragments impregnated (2,460 fps .416 Chatfield-Taylor @ 50 yds. Buffalo took a few strides and collapsed-something about heart failure.) Background-Nosler Partition .264 Richter Short Mag (.264-300 WSM) 140 gr, 3,150 fps Red Hartebeest straight down @ 200 yds. No need to measure retained weight in those cases, as more importantly we had Beer to celebrate! (I opted not to bring my triple beam balance to the dark continent in favor of important stuff!) lol

 

[C.W. Richter]

Eland Hunt

• C.W. Richter
• Nov 7, 2019
• 4

.338-06 A-Sq, 300 gr. Barnes Original SP @ 50 yds. With the exceptional SD the shot passed through! (Why we won't see the best pics on this post.)

 

[C.W. Richter]

Cape Buffalo Hunt in Tanzania

• C.W. Richter
• Sep 5, 2017

.375 H&H, Rem factory 270 gr SP, 60 yds-between the eyes. Done deal. Bullet lodged in the skull somewhere, but I've got a hunch the recovered weight was right around 1,800 lbs, 270 grains.

 

[C.W. Richter]

and now the marginal stories...NOT a big fan of the Accubond bullets...this Kudu was shot perfectly w/ a .338 225 gr at ~100 yds. One lung was impacted (by a bullet that did not expand-more like shooting it with a field point from a bow) and it ran another 500 yds before we tracked and recovered him. My take is they don't expand unless @ extreme velocity (or, they're just not made for Africa I have had some success with .257 110 gr and .264 130 gr in the mid 3,000 fps range on plains game (none went straight down), but after the kudu experience I've retired the accubonds for Africa. Plastic tipped bullets (excepting maybe the Barnes TTSX-which is essentially a solid copper bullet behind it) are not ideal in Africa. There's no accuracy improvement at shots <400 yds (which is nearly always the case there.) Real hunting bullets like the Nos PT, Swift A-Frame, Barnes TSX/TTSX/Banded Solid, Woodleigh SP PSP and Weldcores, and even many other cheaper exposed lead point bullets offered in factory ammo get the job done better there with such thick-skinned animals!!! 'Have seen many more poor decisions in all Southern African countries (like selecting a Low SD bullet for caliber-plenty of oryx still running around after using only 150-165 gr. .30 cal bullets, etc. when 180 is min., 200 is better and 220 is even better!, etc. etc. These are not 120 lb deer, but 350-450-750 and even 2,400 lb animals that are built to withstand predator attacks!) I'll take terminal performance over target performance anyday! Use Heavy-for Caliber (high SD-0.3+/-) bullets that actually expand at a wide range of velocities (not just what the pretty factory literature tells you.) Don't believe your magazine or TV; read Kevin Robertson's (and Art Alphin's) books on this very topic.

 

[bruce moulds]

c.w.,
no picture of bullets,
bruce.

 

[Newby]

I am not a fan of pretty, round, smooth 100% weight retained mushrooms.

IME, a result something like the 300gn HD Woodleighs posted by Frederik will kill quicker.

Ditto for Partitions killing quicker; but maybe not so much for the ones with the partition pushed forward, resulting in a smaller percentage of soft nose, especially if they are used on a target that is on the soft side.

 

[C.W. Richter]

Sorry about the flash: Foreground- 400 gr. Swift A-Frame with buffalo shoulder bone fragments impregnated (2,460 fps .416 Chatfield-Taylor @ 50 yds. Buffalo took a few strides and collapsed-something about heart failure.) Background-Nosler Partition .264 Richter Short Mag (.264-300 WSM) 140 gr, 3,150 fps Red Hartebeest straight down @ 200 yds. No need to measure retained weight in those cases, as more importantly we had Beer to celebrate! (I opted not to bring my triple beam balance to the dark continent in favor of important stuff!) lol

c.w.,
no picture of bullets,
bruce.

No bullets recovered on many, as explained Bruce. LOL also Africa hunting loading issues as well (as encountered by others above.) lol

 

[C.W. Richter]

hmm the forum is a bit cryptic....2nd try still didn't post pic. if it takes too much of my time-I won't bother lol I hereby solemnly swear to tell the truth and nothing but the truth (and that the animals were not road-kill.) this is the photo of the .416/.264 post above. perhaps too much traffic on the website? 21 pages worth? lol idk

 

[C.W. Richter]

Some of the best performance would be with solids, and you'll rarely see a pic of that bullet recovered! Angling acutely toward, .416 Taylor 400 gr Barnes Banded Solid, 2460 fps, 40 yds-hit lung and split liver in half.

Namibia Hunt Elephant

• C.W. Richter
• Sep 18, 2019

 

[C.W. Richter]

to me, retained weight is akin to a real estate broker stating "3,000 ft of road frontage..." on a farm/hunting property in their silly ads-who outside of retail businesses want road frontage???!!! (My preference is 10' of road frontage where the entrance is.) Did the animal die quickly? Yes? Good performance. Let's eat. (Now, in extreme cases, like the orig. Berger bullets blowing apart like you shot the animal w/ a 28 gauge and 7.5 shot, that's just no good.) Had it happen in America on a deer years back at 200 yds. Same w/ the original Nos BT. Use Hunting bullets-not target bullets (marketed for hunting.)

 

[bruce moulds]

cw,
those original bergers are what they now describe as hunting bullets.
they show a few videos of quick kills, which people see as proof.
a vast difference between them and swift aframe!
bruce.

 

[C.W. Richter]

cw,
those original bergers are what they now describe as hunting bullets.
they show a few videos of quick kills, which people see as proof.
a vast difference between them and swift aframe!
bruce.

I fully agree with you-for shots beyond 400-450 yds. My son and I have made many a spectacular shot (out to 720 yds) on thin-skinned game (i.e. deer, aoudads, woodchucks) in America with good success mainly due to their superior accuracy. Inside 400, I'll take a Hunting bullet! In my flat-shooting guns, i'll always have 2 loads with me-one for quick kills <400 and one for accurate shot placement beyond that. And, actually, the original Berger bullets were really BAD on terminal performance, thus the reason they thickened up the jacket (i.e. Nosler BT and more recently some of the Hornady DG bullets!) It was appalling-had both blow into pieces the orig Berger VLD and Nos BTs.

 

[C.W. Richter]

'But I previously worked with enough Sales & Marketing Department (and CEO/President) types to understand why this was! LOL "just sell it!" Big companies need to sell "the latest, greatest thing" each year, whether or not it's really better is immaterial (to their bottom line.)

 

[C.W. Richter]

hmm the forum is a bit cryptic....2nd try still didn't post pic. if it takes too much of my time-I won't bother lol I hereby solemnly swear to tell the truth and nothing but the truth (and that the animals were not road-kill.) this is the photo of the .416/.264 post above. perhaps too much traffic on the website? 21 pages worth? lol idkView attachment 338026

I am not a fan of pretty, round, smooth 100% weight retained mushrooms.

IME, a result something like the 300gn HD Woodleighs posted by Frederik will kill quicker.

Ditto for Partitions killing quicker; but maybe not so much for the ones with the partition pushed forward, resulting in a smaller percentage of soft nose, especially if they are used on a target that is on the soft side.

Newby: consider under what circumstances those perfect mushroomed bullets were recovered, and the reason why the photos were able to be taken!

 

[C.W. Richter]

as it's late and corona appears to be affecting the speed and quality of uploads here (i'll post the pic later!)...'had a .458 Win Mag and my son collected a quartering-away buff using Federal Fusion 500 gr factory loads @ 20 yards-after stalking him and even pulling a sneaky maneuver in 4 feet of warm, black swamp water in high reed grass. Dropped on the spot; bullet mushroomed to the size of a US Quarter coin. I'm not a fan of that round at longer yardages (as I did chronograph it at 2090 fps), but it does the job up-close! And that factory ammo IS recommended for those of you that don't reload. I'm a big fan of double-tap (and Norma) ammo for those of you that don't reload. They are knowledgeable about the bullets that perform best in any given caliber...You'd be surprised at how a bullet 50 gr heavier than your preference (or what's available at your local store) performs so much better on African game! (i.e. 350, 450 gr 375, 416!) the 458 Win Mag is somewhat of an (too short) anachronism, so 450 gr bullets at higher velocity are often the solution on big game, or a 458 Wyatt/Ackley/Lott w/ 500+ gr bullets!

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

and now the marginal stories...NOT a big fan of the Accubond bullets...this Kudu was shot perfectly w/ a .338 225 gr at ~100 yds. One lung was impacted (by a bullet that did not expand-more like shooting it with a field point from a bow) and it ran another 500 yds before we tracked and recovered him. My take is they don't expand unless @ extreme velocity (or, they're just not made for Africa I have had some success with .257 110 gr and .264 130 gr in the mid 3,000 fps range on plains game (none went straight down), but after the kudu experience I've retired the accubonds for Africa. Plastic tipped bullets (excepting maybe the Barnes TTSX-which is essentially a solid copper bullet behind it) are not ideal in Africa. There's no accuracy improvement at shots <400 yds (which is nearly always the case there.) Real hunting bullets like the Nos PT, Swift A-Frame, Barnes TSX/TTSX/Banded Solid, Woodleigh SP PSP and Weldcores, and even many other cheaper exposed lead point bullets offered in factory ammo get the job done better there with such thick-skinned animals!!! 'Have seen many more poor decisions in all Southern African countries (like selecting a Low SD bullet for caliber-plenty of oryx still running around after using only 150-165 gr. .30 cal bullets, etc. when 180 is min., 200 is better and 220 is even better!, etc. etc. These are not 120 lb deer, but 350-450-750 and even 2,400 lb animals that are built to withstand predator attacks!) I'll take terminal performance over target performance anyday! Use Heavy-for Caliber (high SD-0.3+/-) bullets that actually expand at a wide range of velocities (not just what the pretty factory literature tells you.) Don't believe your magazine or TV; read Kevin Robertson's (and Art Alphin's) books on this very topic.
View attachment 338024

C W Richter.
Sorry to be a party pooper but I have to disagree with you on the accubonds. My son shot 90% of his game in Namibia with a 308 using 150grain accubonds. All the game he shot went down. His Oryx cow was one shot thru the chest where he was told to hit it. Total penetration thru and thru with a decent size exit wound. His blesbuck took 3 shots, 2 weren't needed but it was still standing so he kept shooting.
All my game was one shot, short run and fall down using a 35 Whelen loaded with 225grain accubonds . This includes a black wildebeest at around 180 yards and a Kudu front on at around 120 yards. The bullet from the Kudu hit him in the front, destroying the top of the heart the lungs, thru the paunch and found in the rear ham, around 5 and a half feet of penetration. That kind of performance will do me.
The woodleigh PPSP are just as good if not a bit better.
Just my 2 cents worth
Cheers mate Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I am not a fan of pretty, round, smooth 100% weight retained mushrooms.

IME, a result something like the 300gn HD Woodleighs posted by Frederik will kill quicker.

Ditto for Partitions killing quicker; but maybe not so much for the ones with the partition pushed forward, resulting in a smaller percentage of soft nose, especially if they are used on a target that is on the soft side.

Newby
A photo of a 225 grain accubond. A pretty rounded mushroom but only retained about 70 odd percent of the weight. It's the only accubond recovered from my Whelen or the son's 308

Sorry it's the pretty picture you don't like. But the accubonds worked for us.
Cheers mate Bob

 

[bruce moulds]

I fully agree with you-for shots beyond 400-450 yds. My son and I have made many a spectacular shot (out to 720 yds) on thin-skinned game (i.e. deer, aoudads, woodchucks) in America with good success mainly due to their superior accuracy. Inside 400, I'll take a Hunting bullet! In my flat-shooting guns, i'll always have 2 loads with me-one for quick kills <400 and one for accurate shot placement beyond that. And, actually, the original Berger bullets were really BAD on terminal performance, thus the reason they thickened up the jacket (i.e. Nosler BT and more recently some of the Hornady DG bullets!) It was appalling-had both blow into pieces the orig Berger VLD and Nos BTs.

the reason berger thickened the jackets was not to do with hunting.
it was because some of them were blowing up in mid air.
I had this myself and bergers sent me replacement ones from usa to oz at no cost - credit to them.
that was 6.5mm bullets used for fclass.
the main reason I was trying them was that at that time you could use them out of the box without batching.
the only other good bullets at the tome were sierra 142s, and they had to be seriously batched and a certain % thrown out or used for running in barrels.
the bergers although dearer were cheaper.
bergers now need batching too.
bruce.

 

[Surgeon1]

WWWDB. That is a perfect acronym!