Push your rifles (and yourself), Mauser surprise.

roklok · Jul 4, 2026

I had a rude awakening today. I am just a couple weeks out from my buff and elephant hunt and today finally did a timed drill with my .458 built on a Czech military Mauser. I had been shooting this .458 for over a year, zeroing the irons, zeroing the scope, load development, etc. It had been reliable since I fixed an issue with ejection early on. See this thread for my ejection problem and fix: https://www.africahunting.com/threads/mauser-98-ejection-problems-check-your-rifles.95009/

During my time shooting this rifle I had run it briskly, and thought I had it all sorted out. Both softs and solids fed, fired, and ejected well.

Today I ran a drill with a timer. This is a drill I saw on YouTube years ago and sort of adopted it. The video shows some South African lads shooting a .375 purportedly to practice for the "advanced weapons handling assessment to be a nature guide" Here is the video:

Not sure if this is an actual drill in SA, but it is fun and requires only three rounds per try. It is fun to challenge yourself with a timer set to random or have a buddy push the button. According to the video description 15 seconds is the par time, I try to get all three hits (15, 10, and 5 meters) under 7 seconds, starting with an empty chamber.

Anyway, on the timer, pushing myself and the rifle to get a quick time, my previously deemed reliable Mauser .458 choked. Multiple times. Somehow it was getting rounds ahead of the extractor when run hard and fast. The extractor on this rifle did not allow snap over, so with a round in the chamber ahead of the extractor it turned into a club until I could clear the round out of the chamber. I am not sure how or why this was occurring, I was not short stroking it, and the rifle functions as intended when run at slow to brisk, somehow when pushed to the limits it chokes. I imagine it would take a high speed camera to diagnose what is happening. I would have never discovered this issue had I not pushed the rifle to my limits. Starting with 4 rounds in magazine, empty chamber, it took 4 tries before I was able to successfully fire the first shot, then when I finally got the first round off it choked on the second.

I have a Zastava M98 .375 H&H that does allow the extractor to snap over the rim, I swapped this extractor onto the 458 bolt and now it seems to be functioning fine. I successfully ran the same timed drill with no issues. I am not sure if the rounds are getting ahead of the extractor or not, but if they are the extractor snaps over easily enough that I can't tell. I don't think they are, this extractor has a bit more clearance at the bottom corner.

Moral of the story is run your rifles fast and hard, push yourself with a timer. I thought this rifle was GTG for my DG hunt but was mistaken. I am going to continue to push with more timed drills in the next couple weeks, but I believe I have solved the issue.

Rifleman97 · Jul 4, 2026

This is pure speculation without seeing it, but it sounds like the speed of pushing the round forward is causing the round to bounce off and forward of the bolt before the magazine spring has time to push it up under the extractor. Stronger spring could be one possible fix, to get the round pushed up under the extractor sooner. The other and more likely would be to have the bottom of the extractor milled/filed down some so there is enough clearance that it can pick up the rim from further down the bolt stroke when the casing is higher up from lifting up out of the magazine.

Based on your success with the other extractor, that's the more likely cause in my opinion. An actual gunsmith will probably have more and better ideas as to the root cause.

318AE · Jul 4, 2026

So, I take you are prioritizing this functionality, likely requiring a stronger spring, over sitting around in a Cabelas all day and dry cycling it?

I’m glad you caught it now.

Ontario Hunter · Jul 4, 2026

You have answered your own question. The military extractor designed for 8mm cartridge had to be significantly modified to accept 458 rims. Someone didn't quite get the job done right. If sfter changing extractors you were snapping over on the 458 cartridges that weren't properly feeding from magazine, I think you would know it. Closing the bolt on snap-over typically requires more effort. I would recommend you go ahead and modify the old 458 extractor claw to match the one from 375. Completely modify it. You have made yet another argument for snap-over capability in dangerous game rifles.

I doubt the problem lies with extractor spring tension. If anything too stiff an extractor could be an issue for snap-over. Stiff extractor might delay rim jumping to bolt face which could make the rifle cycle rougher, but making the extractor stiffer would likely only make the problem worse. Did you notice any difference in difficulty removing the two extractors from bolts?

Philip Glass · Jul 4, 2026

roklok said:
I had a rude awakening today. I am just a couple weeks out from my buff and elephant hunt and today finally did a timed drill with my .458 built on a Czech military Mauser. I had been shooting this .458 for over a year, zeroing the irons, zeroing the scope, load development, etc. It had been reliable since I fixed an issue with ejection early on. See this thread for my ejection problem and fix: https://www.africahunting.com/threads/mauser-98-ejection-problems-check-your-rifles.95009/

During my time shooting this rifle I had run it briskly, and thought I had it all sorted out. Both softs and solids fed, fired, and ejected well.

Today I ran a drill with a timer. This is a drill I saw on YouTube years ago and sort of adopted it. The video shows some South African lads shooting a .375 purportedly to practice for the "advanced weapons handling assessment to be a nature guide" Here is the video:

Not sure if this is an actual drill in SA, but it is fun and requires only three rounds per try. It is fun to challenge yourself with a timer set to random or have a buddy push the button. According to the video description 15 seconds is the par time, I try to get all three hits (15, 10, and 5 meters) under 7 seconds, starting with an empty chamber.

Anyway, on the timer, pushing myself and the rifle to get a quick time, my previously deemed reliable Mauser .458 choked. Multiple times. Somehow it was getting rounds ahead of the extractor when run hard and fast. The extractor on this rifle did not allow snap over, so with a round in the chamber ahead of the extractor it turned into a club until I could clear the round out of the chamber. I am not sure how or why this was occurring, I was not short stroking it, and the rifle functions as intended when run at slow to brisk, somehow when pushed to the limits it chokes. I imagine it would take a high speed camera to diagnose what is happening. I would have never discovered this issue had I not pushed the rifle to my limits. Starting with 4 rounds in magazine, empty chamber, it took 4 tries before I was able to successfully fire the first shot, then when I finally got the first round off it choked on the second.

I have a Zastava M98 .375 H&H that does allow the extractor to snap over the rim, I swapped this extractor onto the 458 bolt and now it seems to be functioning fine. I successfully ran the same timed drill with no issues. I am not sure if the rounds are getting ahead of the extractor or not, but if they are the extractor snaps over easily enough that I can't tell. I don't think they are, this extractor has a bit more clearance at the bottom corner.

Moral of the story is run your rifles fast and hard, push yourself with a timer. I thought this rifle was GTG for my DG hunt but was mistaken. I am going to continue to push with more timed drills in the next couple weeks, but I believe I have solved the issue.

I am glad you have taken my advice to run it hard and try to break it before you go on a DG hunt. This is exactly the type of thing that happened to me when the leopard charged. I had not run that Ruger hard enough to know it would fail to eject.
My friend and client who is going on the group safari with me next year to the EC just called yesterday to tell me he took my advice and ran his .458 hard. The scope mounting screws sheared off and the scope came off the rifle! He said "thank you for telling me to try to break it here instead of it breaking there".

uplander01 · Jul 4, 2026

Rifle gremlins are ever present. Sometimes really hard to figure out. I’ve dealt with them, this is why when I start preparing for a safari I start with 2-3 rifle options. For at least 2 or 3 range sessions I push them all, accuracy, speed, level of confidence. 1 rifle always emerges and proves itself the best option,…I put the others away and train with only that choice for the 45-60 days leading up to the safari. Then go hunting.

Ontario Hunter · Jul 4, 2026

Philip Glass said:
I am glad you have taken my advice to run it hard and try to break it before you go on a DG hunt. This is exactly the type of thing that happened to me when the leopard charged. I had not run that Ruger hard enough to know it would fail to eject.
My friend and client who is going on the group safari with me next year to the EC just called yesterday to tell me he took my advice and ran his .458 hard. The scope mounting screws sheared off and the scope came off the rifle! He said "thank you for telling me to try to break it here instead of it breaking there".

Surely "running it hard" did not shear [sic] off the scope mounting screws? More likely the cause was monstrous recoil of 458 Lott and a scope that was probably heavier than needed ... and/or overtightened scope base screws. I watched a gunsmith torque the base screws on my Springfield "to specs." Result was rear screw through military sight dovetail stripped and buggered both the screw and the threads in the hole. Overtightened base screws is a common occurrence. Sometimes more is not better.

Choupique · Jul 4, 2026

Philip Glass said:
try to break it here instead of it breaking there

Definitely a good idea, and its applicable to all the critical gear you plan to travel for a hunt with. Rifles, boots, clothes, sleeping bags, etc. All subject to making your experience suck if you dont vett it out before using it in the field.

Far as rifles go, theres no substitute for rounds down range under stress. If you get a stress free shot on the hunt, great. Itll be easy. If you dont, thats not the time to find out that either the rifle or the operator arent up to it.

Philip Glass · Jul 4, 2026

Ontario Hunter said:
Surely "running it hard" did not shear [sic] off the scope mounting screws? More likely the cause was monstrous recoil of 458 Lott and a scope that was probably heavier than needed ... and/or overtightened scope base screws. I watched a gunsmith torque the base screws on my Springfield "to specs." Result was rear screw through military sight dovetail stripped and buggered both the screw and the threads in the hole. Overtightened base screws is a common occurrence. Sometimes more is not better.

Excuse me? You were not there. I don't even know what make of scope or rings he was using. IT DOES NOT MATTER. Maybe it would have broken eventually with the one at a time range loading I detest later on but it broke when he was running multiple rounds quickly.
PROVING MY POINT ON WHAT A FELLOW SHOULD DO WITH HIS RIFLE BEFORE A DG HUNT.
Anything can fail so it matters not what gun, scope, rings, screws. The point is he found out at home not with a buff staring him down.
Glad my friend took my advice before he became a statistic. Y'all do what you want.

Choupique · Jul 4, 2026

Philip Glass said:
WHAT A FELLOW SHOULD DO WITH HIS RIFLE BEFORE A DG HUNT.

We often forget that these were originally weapons of war. They arent a thing to be babied, and thats not what we need them to do. Test them the way they will need to be used, in the worst case. The good ones will easily take it, the ones that cant shouldnt be used for anything important.

Lots of people handle their rifles like glass rods. Thats fine, but if you never test it (and yourself) against the worst expected operating conditions, youre taking a risk of having your hunt ruined or worse.

deewayne2003 · Jul 4, 2026

Philip Glass said:
I am glad you have taken my advice to run it hard and try to break it before you go on a DG hunt. This is exactly the type of thing that happened to me when the leopard charged. I had not run that Ruger hard enough to know it would fail to eject.
My friend and client who is going on the group safari with me next year to the EC just called yesterday to tell me he took my advice and ran his .458 hard. The scope mounting screws sheared off and the scope came off the rifle! He said "thank you for telling me to try to break it here instead of it breaking there".

Well said, we had our first Safari rifle tune up last weekend…..

Running real hunting ammo through our .375s we’ve been shooting and hunting deer/pigs with all season, when my buddy discovered his .375 M70 stainless would empty the magazine spewing the rest of his ammo on the ground when the bolt is pulled back at panic speed.

“Glad I found that out now instead of next year!”

If anyone knows the correct part numbers for a new magazine spring and follower for M70 Stainless .375H&H CRF please send me a PM.

roklok · Jul 4, 2026

Ontario Hunter said:
You have answered your own question. The military extractor designed for 8mm cartridge had to be significantly modified to accept 458 rims. Someone didn't quite get the job done right. If sfter changing extractors you were snapping over on the 458 cartridges that weren't properly feeding from magazine, I think you would know it. Closing the bolt on snap-over typically requires more effort. I would recommend you go ahead and modify the old 458 extractor claw to match the one from 375. Completely modify it. You have made yet another argument for snap-over capability in dangerous game rifles.

I doubt the problem lies with extractor spring tension. If anything too stiff an extractor could be an issue for snap-over. Stiff extractor might delay rim jumping to bolt face which could make the rifle cycle rougher, but making the extractor stiffer would likely only make the problem worse. Did you notice any difference in difficulty removing the two extractors from bolts?

Both extractors seemed to have the same amount of tension when removing from bolt. I was able to accomplish removal and installation with my fingers, no tools required. I do plan on modifying my .458 extractor to match the one off my .375. In my 458 this extractor takes less effort to snap over a rim than it did in my .375, but that may be an effect of the longer bolt handle on my .458. I tested it about a dozen times, dropping cartridges into the 458 chamber and snapping the extractor over it. I am not sure I would notice the difference in bolt closure between CRF and snap over when running a timed drill.

This experience has definitely put me squarely in the "snap over capability" camp for a DG rifle. The Springfield 1903, 1917 and P14 Enfields all are designed to readily snap over. It seems a tremendous liability to have a rifle that becomes a club if a cartridge gets ahead of the extractor.

I have recently extended the bolt handle on this .458 and I suspect that the added length and positioning is enabling me to cycle the bolt quicker, and that is why I just now discovered these issues, despite shooting this rifle for a while.

Ontario Hunter · Jul 4, 2026

deewayne2003 said:
Well said, we had our first Safari rifle tune up last weekend…..
View attachment 774678

Running real hunting ammo through our .375s we’ve been shooting and hunting deer/pigs with all season, when my buddy discovered his .375 M70 stainless would empty the magazine spewing the rest of his ammo on the ground when the bolt is pulled back at panic speed.

“Glad I found that out now instead of next year!”

If anyone knows the correct part numbers for a new magazine spring and follower for M70 Stainless .375H&H CRF please send me a PM.

Did it drop cartridges out the bottom (floorplate let go) or throw them out the top? If all the cartridges jumped the rails and flew out the top, then I'd say for certain the issue is not follower or spring but rather feeding rails. Possibly an over strength spring could cause this but that seems unlikely. I don't see how a follower out of adjustment would cause all the cartridges in the box to skip the rails. Did he load the magazine through the floorplate? Sometimes that can cause a shell to jump the rails during cycling if they're not stacked just right. However, I usually find the gun simply jams.

For those who don't have snap-over capability and want to carry their rifles with chamber loaded (I.e. hunting dangerous game), I strongly recommend loading the magazine to max, cycle a round into the chamber, then flip the rifle over and carefully open the floorplate. Place the next round so it's staggered properly above the top round showing, and then carefully close the floorplate. I can just push the rim of a fourth round under the claw of my 3+1 404 Czech Mauser and close the bolt. For my 30-06 Springfield 03A3 with snap-over extractor I can load five in the magazine, drop a round in the chamber, depress cartridges in box with fingertips of left hand wrapped around the bottom of rifle, and then close the bolt. Usually I don't put the 6th round in the gun. Five is plenty. To be honest, I've never checked to see if there's enough room remaining in magazine to push the rim of extra round under the claw like my Mauser.

Choupique · Jul 4, 2026

Ontario Hunter said:
recommend loading the magazine to max, cycle a round into the chamber, then flip the rifle over and carefully open the floorplate. Place the next round so it's staggered properly above the top round showing, and then carefully close the floorplate

In most rifles, this is more easily accomplished by loading the magazine, dropping one in the chamber, closing the bolt halfway, pointing the rifle up, and pushing the round that just fell out of the chamber under the extractor.

Yall know what doesnt have all these kinds of problems? Good push feed rifles.

Ontario Hunter · Jul 4, 2026

Choupique said:
In most rifles, this is more easily accomplished by loading the magazine, dropping one in the chamber, closing the bolt halfway, pointing the rifle up, and pushing the round that just fell out of the chamber under the extractor.

Yall know what doesnt have all these kinds of problems? Good push feed rifles.

Indeed. There should be more room in the magazine with bolt at half cycled position to push the rim of extra round under the claw. Thanks. Here all this time I thought I knew everything. My hat size just shrank three inches.

Schuetze · Jul 4, 2026

That looks like a good drill for any dangerous game practice. I'll give it a try before this year's buff hunt.

I practice all year using cast bullets in my 375 H&H Zastava Mauser 98 actioned Remington 798. While the recoil is moderated, the bolt manipulation is the same as well as the sight picture and trigger control. By using my cast bullets and reduced powder charges, my cost per round of practice 375 is probably less than 10 cents a round and allows me to shoot hundreds of practice rounds a year. Practice makes perfect as they say.

A few weeks before the hunt I up the loads to what I'll shoot in Africa.

Choupique · Jul 4, 2026

Ontario Hunter said:
Here all this time I thought I knew everything

Im still young so I actually do know everything!

Learned that trick with an 1896 mauser. Have found since that it has worked on a few different mausers and model 70's and rugers. Might have to close it a little past half way with some of the fatter rounds. Easier to push it down enough the farther up the magazine you go.

Personally, i like the idea of an extractor that wont snap over. If it can snap over onto the case, it can snap over off of the case. In practice, ive never seen it cause an issue and all push feed extractors work that way. Not being able to snap over also removes the option of tossing a loose round in a dry action and slamming it shut quickly. Theres really no practical reason to not have an extractor that can snap over.

When extractors weren't designed to snap over, the rifles were stripper clip charged. Nobody is loading dangerous game rifles with clips.

Ontario Hunter · Jul 4, 2026

Choupique said:
Im still young so I actually do know everything!

Learned that trick with an 1896 mauser. Have found since that it has worked on a few different mausers and model 70's and rugers. Might have to close it a little past half way with some of the fatter rounds. Easier to push it down enough the farther up the magazine you go.

Personally, i like the idea of an extractor that wont snap over. If it can snap over onto the case, it can snap over off of the case. In practice, ive never seen it cause an issue and all push feed extractors work that way. Not being able to snap over also removes the option of tossing a loose round in a dry action and slamming it shut quickly. Theres really no practical reason to not have an extractor that can snap over.

When extractors weren't designed to snap over, the rifles were stripper clip charged. Nobody is loading dangerous game rifles with clips.

Exactly. It's maybe not such a bad idea to have a rifle with no snap over capability and bolt that locks open on an empty magazine if feeding it with stripper clips in a firefight, but for hunting it doesn't make a lot of sense to have a rifle with those features.

Philip Glass · Jul 7, 2026

deewayne2003 said:
Well said, we had our first Safari rifle tune up last weekend…..
View attachment 774678

Running real hunting ammo through our .375s we’ve been shooting and hunting deer/pigs with all season, when my buddy discovered his .375 M70 stainless would empty the magazine spewing the rest of his ammo on the ground when the bolt is pulled back at panic speed.

“Glad I found that out now instead of next year!”

If anyone knows the correct part numbers for a new magazine spring and follower for M70 Stainless .375H&H CRF please send me a PM.

Good to know ahead of time!

Philip Glass · Jul 7, 2026

Choupique said:
We often forget that these were originally weapons of war. They arent a thing to be babied, and thats not what we need them to do. Test them the way they will need to be used, in the worst case. The good ones will easily take it, the ones that cant shouldnt be used for anything important.

Lots of people handle their rifles like glass rods. Thats fine, but if you never test it (and yourself) against the worst expected operating conditions, youre taking a risk of having your hunt ruined or worse.

Well said.

Push your rifles (and yourself), Mauser surprise.

roklok

Rifleman97

318AE

Ontario Hunter

Philip Glass

uplander01

Ontario Hunter

Choupique

Philip Glass

Choupique

deewayne2003

roklok

Ontario Hunter

Choupique

Ontario Hunter

Schuetze

Choupique

Ontario Hunter

Philip Glass

Philip Glass

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