Federal's 7mm Back Country - What is your opinion?

[greyfox]

I wanted to rebarrel a 308 to 338 FED, just because. Now I'm glad I didn't, I know I could neck 308 up, but that's not the point. Unfortunately the market is flooded with Nihe cartridges and the 338 FED and the RCM's are victims of that trend.

 

[Rifleman97]

@JG26Irish_2
Beats me why big companies want to try to re-invent the wheel. Very few proprietary cartridges live on. Weatherby and H&H are exceptions.
Other alphabet cartridges seem to have gone the way of the dodo. RCM, WSSM, 338 Federal, Lazzarini and a few others.
Bob

Lazzeroni cartridges are alive and well, you can still buy brass and the coated bullets that was invented for them. The reason Sako quit making rifles in that chambering was purely corporate, and Mr Lazzeroni is still in business making awesome quality custom rifles, only available in his chamberings. We don’t hear about them much because he does load development for you with bullets designed for the cartridge (moly coated copper) so there’s very few people with questions about loading for them, and being a custom maker there’s only so many people who have those rifles. They were never intended to replace the staples like the 30-06, 300 win, 7mm rem, etc.

I used to have a lazzeroni built 7.82 warbird I sold a number of years ago on long range hunting. I think hornady makes brass for those cartridges now (not available from them per se, he orders them in many thousands of rounds bulk and sells them to customers from his website)

It’s not really related to your point, I just find those cartridges really interesting.

 

[DG870]

@Wyatt Smith
Ah, young grasshopper you to will fall into the 45-60 age group one day
But
You will still be hu

@Uncontrolled_round_feed
All well and good.
BUT
in the year nineteen hundred and twenty two the greats Col Whelen and John C Howe released then penultimate in hunting perfection.
THE MIGHTY 35 WHELEN.
Therefore I postulate the Whelen achieved greatness before Winchester, so Winchester takes second place. Sorry no ceegar.
Bob

I’ve been a .270 fan since 1973, when I bought my first .270 (because of Jack O’Connors writings in Sports Afield). The .270 has served me well but I shoot several different calibers including the mighty 35 Whelen .

I feel it’s fair to point out that took Winchester a couple extra years to introduce the 270 but it took the Whelen until 1988 for Remington to make the Whelen a legitimate cartridge.

 

[steve white]

The suppressed trend is only going to accelerate with the easing of restrictions/elimination of the $200 tax. I saw a truly unique rifle at the DSC summer show in Grapevine, Tx. It was a sub five pound rifle with a folding stock, suppressor, adjustable cheek rest and an 8 inch barrel. Yes eight inches. It fired a new cartridge. I cannot find what I kept from the show about it....would someone remind me what it was that I handled that day? Seems like IT was described as having a steel case for the cartridge, but not certain.

Found it. It was the Q Fix 8.6 BLK 8 inch with Trash Panda silencer. Those SBR types will have to have new cartridge technology, so get ready for "new" in the market, ready or not.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I wanted to rebarrel a 308 to 338 FED, just because. Now I'm glad I didn't, I know I could neck 308 up, but that's not the point. Unfortunately the market is flooded with Nihe cartridges and the 338 FED and the RCM's are victims of that trend.

@greyfox
Why rebarrel just rebore to 358 Winchester, neck up your 308 brass and have fun with the baby Whelen.
Bob

 

[Russ16]

Lazzeroni cartridges are alive and well, you can still buy brass and the coated bullets that was invented for them. The reason Sako quit making rifles in that chambering was purely corporate, and Mr Lazzeroni is still in business making awesome quality custom rifles, only available in his chamberings. We don’t hear about them much because he does load development for you with bullets designed for the cartridge (moly coated copper) so there’s very few people with questions about loading for them, and being a custom maker there’s only so many people who have those rifles. They were never intended to replace the staples like the 30-06, 300 win, 7mm rem, etc.

I used to have a lazzeroni built 7.82 warbird I sold a number of years ago on long range hunting. I think hornady makes brass for those cartridges now (not available from them per se, he orders them in many thousands of rounds bulk and sells them to customers from his website)

It’s not really related to your point, I just find those cartridges really interesting.

30 years ago when I was really getting into guns the lazzeroni guns and cartridges were fascinating to me. Glad they are still around.

 

[Flbt]

I wanted to rebarrel a 308 to 338 FED, just because. Now I'm glad I didn't, I know I could neck 308 up, but that's not the point. Unfortunately the market is flooded with Nihe cartridges and the 338 FED and the RCM's are victims of that trend.

358 w is all ways a option

 

[Flewis]

The good thing about new cartridges is that sometimes it helps bring back the old stuff. The 6.5cm sure put life in the 264s. The same looks Like the 350 legend may be doing to the 35s. How many new 277s do we now have. I’m good with the new stuff and I do buy some of it.

 

[CBH Australia]

I’ve been a .270 fan since 1973, when I bought my first .270 (because of Jack O’Connors writings in Sports Afield). The .270 has served me well but I shoot several different calibers including the mighty 35 Whelen .

I feel it’s fair to point out that took Winchester a couple extra years to introduce the 270 but it took the Whelen until 1988 for Remington to make the Whelen a legitimate cartridge.

It’s probably the popularity the popularity of the -06 family of cases that makes it feasible to keep the Whelen going, just say’n

 

[Mountaineer]

@JG26Irish_2
Beats me why big companies want to try to re-invent the wheel. Very few proprietary cartridges live on. Weatherby and H&H are exceptions.
Other alphabet cartridges seem to have gone the way of the dodo. RCM, WSSM, 338 Federal, Lazzarini and a few others.
Bob

338 Federal is here to stay. I found ammo in Namibia and even Seward Alaska.

 

[pilar]

After seeing a couple of videos on them big NOPE

 

[Daisy]

After seeing a couple of videos on them big NOPE

Basing that off a savage rifle?

He also didn’t even have hearing protection in for first shot.

 

[pilar]

Basing that off a savage rifle?

He also didn’t even have hearing protection in for first shot.

I’m not worried about what manufacturers make the 7mm BC it’s the 80,000 lbs of chamber pressure, if the USA DOD can’t get the 6.8 fury to not jamb up with over pressure it’s just a idea gone bad?

On top of that I see sako/ tikka can’t get the 7mm PRC to shoot huntable accuracy in some models because of heavy recoil even with suppressors and breaks

 

[Wyatt Smith]

I’m not worried about what manufacturers make the 7mm BC it’s the 80,000 lbs of chamber pressure, if the USA DOD can’t get the 6.8 fury to not jamb up with over pressure it’s just a idea gone bad?

On top of that I see sako/ tikka can’t get the 7mm PRC to shoot huntable accuracy in some models because of heavy recoil even with suppressors and breaks

At 80,000 psi there is a lot less room for error, any small problem will show it face a lot quicker than at 60,000.
What surprised me was that the bolt handle lifted, which should be the primary extraction, but then wouldn’t pull backwards.
I’d like to see if this is a common problem with other either the ammo or rifles.

 

[Rifleman97]

At 80,000 psi there is a lot less room for error, any small problem will show it face a lot quicker than at 60,000.
What surprised me was that the bolt handle lifted, which should be the primary extraction, but then wouldn’t pull backwards.
I’d like to see if this is a common problem with other either the ammo or rifles.

Exactly, I feel like it’s a rifle issue. If extraction was an issue, it would show in difficult bolt lift. Once the bolt is lifted, as long as the case has some taper to it, it should no longer be able to be stuck.

Also could be a extractor issue, where the bolt lifts because the extractor isn’t tight enough around the rim to actually extract during primary extraction, and is left to be fully extracted without any added leverage.

 

[pilar]

Exactly, I feel like it’s a rifle issue. If extraction was an issue, it would show in difficult bolt lift. Once the bolt is lifted, as long as the case has some taper to it, it should no longer be able to be stuck.

Also could be a extractor issue, where the bolt lifts because the extractor isn’t tight enough around the rim to actually extract during primary extraction, and is left to be fully extracted without any added leverage.

• Extractor Wear:
  The higher pressures generated by the 7mm Backcountry cartridge can potentially place more stress on the extractor, leading to premature wear or failure.
  
  
• Carbon Fouling:
  The steel case may not expand as effectively as brass, potentially leading to increased carbon fouling in the chamber, which could cause malfunctions or require more frequent cleaning
• 
  Noise from pressure still requires hearing protection
  
  That SOB must be incredibly loud if ear foam and muffs are still needed with a suppressor !!!!

And carbon fouling causing cases to stick , uhmm no thanks

 

[nomspc]

I’m not sure if I’ve posted this at AH, but I have an 18” 7BC barrel for my R8. I’ve had it to the range once; now that I have the 155 Terminal Ascent and the 195 Berger, I need to get back out there and reshoot everything. So far:

Velocity
168 LRX - 2964
170 Terminal Ascent - 3003
175 Fusion - 2953

These numbers make this a legit 750 yard elk rifle. That may be of little interest to many of us, but I bet there’s a market for short, suppressed rifles with that kind of power.

Comparing OAL of the R8 with a can to a 22” Model 70

Accuracy was fine and would be even better if I quit yanking the 5th shot.

I did notice increased bolt effort with the Fusion load. Recoil was similar to the R8 shooting 7 PRC, which is to say noticeably less than the R8 shooting 300WM.

 

[Flbt]

There is no such thing as a legit 750 yd game round.
There might be a legit 750 yd long range shooting round.

I’m not sure if I’ve posted this at AH, but I have an 18” 7BC barrel for my R8. I’ve had it to the range once; now that I have the 155 Terminal Ascent and the 195 Berger, I need to get back out there and reshoot everything. So far:

Velocity
168 LRX - 2964
170 Terminal Ascent - 3003
175 Fusion - 2953

These numbers make this a legit 750 yard elk rifle. That may be of little interest to many of us, but I bet there’s a market for short, suppressed rifles with that kind of power.


View attachment 704453

Comparing OAL of the R8 with a can to a 22” Model 70
View attachment 704454
Accuracy was fine and would be even better if I quit yanking the 5th shot.

View attachment 704455

View attachment 704456

I did notice increased bolt effort with the Fusion load. Recoil was similar to the R8 shooting 7 PRC, which is to say noticeably less than the R8 shooting 300

 

[Daisy]

I’m not sure if I’ve posted this at AH, but I have an 18” 7BC barrel for my R8. I’ve had it to the range once; now that I have the 155 Terminal Ascent and the 195 Berger, I need to get back out there and reshoot everything. So far:

Velocity
168 LRX - 2964
170 Terminal Ascent - 3003
175 Fusion - 2953

These numbers make this a legit 750 yard elk rifle. That may be of little interest to many of us, but I bet there’s a market for short, suppressed rifles with that kind of power.


View attachment 704453

Comparing OAL of the R8 with a can to a 22” Model 70
View attachment 704454
Accuracy was fine and would be even better if I quit yanking the 5th shot.

View attachment 704455

View attachment 704456

I did notice increased bolt effort with the Fusion load. Recoil was similar to the R8 shooting 7 PRC, which is to say noticeably less than the R8 shooting 300WM.

Great post. Hard to argue with any of that