Suppressing a Dangerous Game rifle - 458 lott

[generalzip]

I see very few if any examples of folks using suppressors on dangerous game rifles. Is there a reason for this other than people don’t like the “look”?

I’m contemplating having a 20” 458 Lott built and threaded for a silencerco hybrid. Silencerco told me the minimum barrel length is 20” for this suppressor.

I see the following pros and cons

Pros
- significant recoil reduction
- added weight to further reduce recoil and muzzle flip
- you won’t do significant hearing damage
-your PH will be happy
- the suppressor often throws the sound of the shot confusing the animal where it came from. I’ve witnessed this first hand hunting hogs and other game. This could be potentially helpful when hunting dangerous game confusing the animal for just a couple extra seconds to give you time to react if needed or get a second shot off.

Cons
- added weight and length (weight can be seen as a pro)
- looks if you care about that sort of thing. Personally this doesn’t bother me and I think a modern touch on a classic rifle is neat and unique
- possibly worse handling with the extra weight on the end. A 20” with 7” suppressor would probably feel like a 27” barreled 458 Lott which would be a little slower to whip around. However I’m quite strong (still in my 30s) so it’s not much issue to hold
- harder to shoot off hand with the weight out front while waiting for the animal to get in position for a shot. Sticks would be very beneficial but I know sometimes you don’t get a chance to set them up.

Anyways I was curious if anyone has ever done or seen this and what their takeaway was. My 375 ruger I shoot suppressed with a 22” barrel and it reallly takes the recoil and without the noise I have almost no flinch develop with it even shooting off a bench. I find in more accurate when the rifle rifles less and has less concussion and noise. I just wish it was 20” because I think it would balance better and make just enough difference to hold it steady freehand longer. Unfortunately the FTW model Ruger has a 22” barrel. But it shoots a 270 LRX Barnes at 2760 without any pressure signs.

 

[samson7x]

Go for it and post pics! I intend to shorten and thread a future 375 for suppressor as well.

 

[Betterinthebush]

I’d not do it. I’m afraid I get excited on a stalk after an elephant and I’d trip over my purse or the straps would get hung up in branches dangling from my elbow crook.

Seriously, whatever makes you happy and keeps one in the field. That’s all that matters.

 

[franzfmdavis]

I have to admit, my primary aversion to it is the visual aesthetic.

That being said, when I toured the @RIGBY showroom in London a week ago, they mentioned that many European customers request that a suppressor be added to their classic rifle! They do a nice job of it.

Here you can see one in their rack of customer rifles:

 

[TOBY458]

I have the same suppressor that you speak of. I’ve never used it in the role that you speak of, but on a 458 that will be carried in thick brush for miles at the time, I think you’d be cursing it before your trip was over. Short and handy are the attributes I’m looking for in a buffalo/Elephant rifle. I just returned from an elephant hunt, where we walked for miles in the thickest brush you could imagine, and I guarantee I’d have taken that suppressor off and slung it through the woods before the trip was over. If you hunted in open country, it could work. But all of the DG I’ve done in Africa has been in very thick cover.
Maybe you could have it threaded and use the suppressor during practice, and then remove it for the actual hunt. I bet it would really help you to get more shooting in during practice.

 

[375Fox]

The biggest con is it is illegal in most African hunting countries. You’d be limiting the rifle to South Africa and Namibia.

 

[Rider717]

My R8 .375 H&H in the Selous, Tanazania. Thats a Banish 45 8.6" suppressor. It added weight, which didn't bother me, but the length was something I had to think about walking under branches. After using suppressors on PH rifles in SA I am a convert to using them. Looks are individual taste and not as important as funtion to me. That said, I like how it looks.

 

[375Fox]

My R8 .375 H&H in the Selous, Tanazania. Thats a Banish 45 8.6" suppressor. It added weight, which didn't bother me, but the length was something I had to think about walking under branches. After using suppressors on PH rifles in SA I am a convert to using them. Looks are individual taste and not as important as funtion to me. That said, I like how it looks.
View attachment 688251

I just finished hunting in Tanzania. My PH said they are fully illegal there. Although I’m sure you can likely get away with it a frequently at the airport depending who checks the rifle.

 

[WC86]

I’ve thought of doing this too

That said, I was looking at the hybrid 46m which from my reading should be rated down to 18” for the pressures and energy and powder we’re discussing. I guess I need to talk to SilencerCo

For the loads below, powder grains, pressure, and muzzle energy all less than hot 338 lapua for which the 46m is rated to 18”

With the 5 inch can (modular can with the smaller base being 5”) you’re at 23” of barrel/suppressor which is less than most stock rifle barrels

quickload estimates, with an 18” barrel, are
>2150fps with 500gr solids over h4198 (that’s 470NE ballistics)
>2600fps with 300gr Barnes ttsx over h4895 (Better than 375h&h—good NA load)
~1000fps with 550gr woodleigh weld core over trail boss (subsonic with more energy at 100yds than a 44mag at the muzzle—good brush deer/pig load. Whenever we can get that bullet again in the States, of course. could also use a “maker” brand subsonic bullet to get better expansion should you feel you need it)

All with nearly 100% powder burn in barrel and pressures well below max for the Lott

A quiet, handy, lower recoiling gun for all seasons

 

[Pirkan]

I see very few if any examples of folks using suppressors on dangerous game rifles. Is there a reason for this other than people don’t like the “look”?

I’m contemplating having a 20” 458 Lott built and threaded for a silencerco hybrid. Silencerco told me the minimum barrel length is 20” for this suppressor.

I see the following pros and cons

Pros
- significant recoil reduction
- added weight to further reduce recoil and muzzle flip
- you won’t do significant hearing damage
-your PH will be happy
- the suppressor often throws the sound of the shot confusing the animal where it came from. I’ve witnessed this first hand hunting hogs and other game. This could be potentially helpful when hunting dangerous game confusing the animal for just a couple extra seconds to give you time to react if needed or get a second shot off.

Cons
- added weight and length (weight can be seen as a pro)
- looks if you care about that sort of thing. Personally this doesn’t bother me and I think a modern touch on a classic rifle is neat and unique
- possibly worse handling with the extra weight on the end. A 20” with 7” suppressor would probably feel like a 27” barreled 458 Lott which would be a little slower to whip around. However I’m quite strong (still in my 30s) so it’s not much issue to hold
- harder to shoot off hand with the weight out front while waiting for the animal to get in position for a shot. Sticks would be very beneficial but I know sometimes you don’t get a chance to set them up.

Anyways I was curious if anyone has ever done or seen this and what their takeaway was. My 375 ruger I shoot suppressed with a 22” barrel and it reallly takes the recoil and without the noise I have almost no flinch develop with it even shooting off a bench. I find in more accurate when the rifle rifles less and has less concussion and noise. I just wish it was 20” because I think it would balance better and make just enough difference to hold it steady freehand longer. Unfortunately the FTW model Ruger has a 22” barrel. But it shoots a 270 LRX Barnes at 2760 without any pressure signs.

How big is the selection of suppressors fit for this in the us? In Europe there's multiple models of light direct thread telescopic cans for .458 magnum calibers and only one that I've found for .510 but cheap and light direct thread cans barely seem like a thing on the us market.

I've looked a little at building a very short, 45-50 cm barrel, 500A² to suppress it but that's just because it'd be cool and subs would have the kinetic energy to legally hunt everything here.

 

[mdwest]

I see very few if any examples of folks using suppressors on dangerous game rifles. Is there a reason for this other than people don’t like the “look”?

I’m contemplating having a 20” 458 Lott built and threaded for a silencerco hybrid. Silencerco told me the minimum barrel length is 20” for this suppressor.

I see the following pros and cons

Pros
- significant recoil reduction
- added weight to further reduce recoil and muzzle flip
- you won’t do significant hearing damage
-your PH will be happy
- the suppressor often throws the sound of the shot confusing the animal where it came from. I’ve witnessed this first hand hunting hogs and other game. This could be potentially helpful when hunting dangerous game confusing the animal for just a couple extra seconds to give you time to react if needed or get a second shot off

A couple of those pros aren’t likely accurate or real..

For example.. at the distance you are shooting DG (inside 50 yards.. often inside 30 yards) the animal is not going to be even the slightest bit confused about where the shot came from.. he is going to be looking right at you at the moment you pull the trigger.. and even the best suppressor on the planet isn’t going to reduce the super sonic crack or enough of the powder “boom” to get the rifle Hollywood quiet.. that buff/ele/hippo/lion, etc is going to know exactly where the shot came from whether you have a suppressor mounted or not.,

And I’m not sure your PH is going to be happy… on a DG hunt he is worried about everyone’s safety (including his own)… he is going to want you on the sticks rapidly as soon as they go up.. he’s going to want you to be able to put the bullet EXACTLY where it belongs while under potential stress, etc… anything that slows your ability to move and respond quickly is a disadvantage (extra length on the gun, an unbalanced gun, etc)..

Faster follow up shots due to lower recoil are nice… but the intent should be to not need a follow up because you did your job as the client perfectly and killed the animal with the first bullet…

You also have the potential for a slower follow up if you’re having to pull off the sticks and reposition for that second shot with a longer, weight forward boom stick..

Don’t get me wrong… I love suppressors.. my hog guns are suppressed, and I hunted deer suppressed last year… whenever I PG hunt in South Africa I hunt suppressed..

But I’m not digging the idea of suppressed on a DG rifle at all…

And I own a 458 suppressor… (mounted on a 458 SOCOM at the moment)…

 

[Rider717]

I just finished hunting in Tanzania. My PH said they are fully illegal there. Although I’m sure you can likely get away with it a frequently at the airport depending who checks the rifle.

My outfitter checked with the game department and was told it was legal. At the airport weapons checks I made sure to point it out to the inspectors who were all ok with it. Our game scout said it was legal. I think it depends on who they ask and what day of the week it is. I certainly wouldn't have used it if anyone had said it was illegal.

 

[generalzip]

The biggest con is it is illegal in most African hunting countries. You’d be limiting the rifle to South Africa and Namibia.

This is a good point I hadn’t thought of. I’m going to SA in August and bringing it for a plains game hunt. However I suppose nothing stops you from simply taking off the suppressor and checking zero if you went somewhere it is not allowed?

 

[jbirdwell]

I used the Silencerco Hybrid 46 on my 375 H&H last year but I used it in its shortened version and balance was ok. Due to neck, shoulder and back issues there is not too much I can shoot without a suppressor or brake anymore but I'm slowly taking anything I own with a break and removing it to used the suppressor.

 

[generalzip]

My R8 .375 H&H in the Selous, Tanazania. Thats a Banish 45 8.6" suppressor. It added weight, which didn't bother me, but the length was something I had to think about walking under branches. After using suppressors on PH rifles in SA I am a convert to using them. Looks are individual taste and not as important as funtion to me. That said, I like how it looks.
View attachment 688251

Really nice looking rifle. I see it’s a modular can. You could always take the end module off to shorten it a bit. Hunting you just need to take the edge off doesn’t need to be quiet as possible. I try to stay at max of 22” barrels on my suppressed hunting rifles. If I need more velocity I just step up a caliber/case size.

My 6.5 cm and PRC are 20”. 6cm and another 6.5 cm 22”. 375 ruger 22”. Only exception is a long range build 300 Norma which is 26”. But that’s for open country hunting and kept in a back pack most the time.

 

[BeeMaa]

I prefer not to hunt with a suppressor when stalking game. The added length and weight throw off the balance of a rifle, not to mention the added length that's assured to be a PITA at nearly every point in a hunt taking place in the bush.

On the other hand, hunting from a fixed position like a blind or varmint hunting, they can be quite useful. I'd say limit it to around .30 caliber...but that's just me. The other place I like a suppressor is on a home defense rifle.

If being used on a DG rifle I would not be asking how to do it, but why. The disadvantages of having it far exceed the benefits. For these cartridges, I see extremely limited use for such an item. Especially considering the additional cost, weight and loss of balance when these matter so much.

@Rider717 - As much as I love a Blaser R8, suppressor use in TZ is illegal. You were lucky to avoid prosecution.

 

[generalzip]

How big is the selection of suppressors fit for this in the us? In Europe there's multiple models of light direct thread telescopic cans for .458 magnum calibers and only one that I've found for .510 but cheap and light direct thread cans barely seem like a thing on the us market.

I've looked a little at building a very short, 45-50 cm barrel, 500A² to suppress it but that's just because it'd be cool and subs would have the kinetic energy to legally hunt everything here.

We have quite a few. Silencerco was one of the first to commercially offer but the cans over time have gotten crazy well built and light weight. We no have options like the AB raptor as short as 6.3” and 8.5 oz. (Sorry for my units it’s not my fault I swear ). And the hybrid 46m which can be converted to short or long. Banish makes one. Almost every major supplier no has a model. The AB raptor is made up to 375 cal while others make 46 and even 50 cal cans like bowers. Since suppressors are highly regulated and often a lifetime buy they tend to be a bit overbuilt in the US and hence heavier as they aren’t seen as consumables like in other places. That said 3d printing technology has allowed for crazy new designs that are lightweight and storming the market.

 

[RLL]

I like the idea and will likely do it again. Did it with a 375ruger and chopped the barrel to 18”. Worked great. I would like to do it again and make another 458 B&M where the ballistics would match up better with shorter barrel. Id like 15/16 inch barrel to keep total length at 21/22 suppressed, I’d be happy in the bush with a lightish 9lb rifle and optic would make sweet shooting affair.

 

[generalzip]

I prefer not to hunt with a suppressor when stalking game. The added length and weight throw off the balance of a rifle, not to mention the added length that's assured to be a PITA at nearly every point in a hunt taking place in the bush.

On the other hand, hunting from a fixed position like a blind or varmint hunting, they can be quite useful. I'd say limit it to around .30 caliber...but that's just me.

If being used on a DG rifle I would not be asking how to do it, but why. The disadvantages of having it far exceed the benefits. For these cartridges, I see extremely limited use for such an item. Especially considering the additional cost, weight and loss of balance when these matter so much.

Can I ask would you prefer an 18” rifle with 6” suppressor or a 24” barrel unsuppressed? Same length but you have the benefits of the can. In a caliber like 458 win mag or Lott and the velocity was nearly the same between them (within 50 gps with hand loads).

 

[375Fox]

This is a good point I hadn’t thought of. I’m going to SA in August and bringing it for a plains game hunt. However I suppose nothing stops you from simply taking off the suppressor and checking zero if you went somewhere it is not allowed?

That is fine. Just make sure the rifle still has the proper balance.