My Rage against RAGE Broadheads - With Video evidence

Discussion in 'Bowhunting Africa' started by TOM, Aug 30, 2011.

  1. Norwegianwoods

    Norwegianwoods SILVER SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    I do believe that the new Hypodermic is by far the best Rage design yet.

    I think the collar design is rather good and the ferrule is great in all ways but one in my opinion.
    I think the tip is way to short in front of where the deployment of the blades starts.
    I am worried this can make a problem at shots at sharp angles, like when from a treestand or at quartering shots.

    I think a 125 grain version where the extra weight would be used to make a longer ferrule with a longer tip would be a better design.

    When using Rage and other mechs with large cutting surfaces it is important to have enough momentum to ensure good penetration.
    I am shooting 615 grain arrows at 260 fps and would get good penetration with these mehcs, but I still prefer to use fixed broadheads.
    But I am considering to test the new Hypodermic and also the all steel Ulmer Edge.
     
  2. bhtkevin

    bhtkevin New Member

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    Im late to this thread but had a rage fail on a buck with a drop tine some years back. The problem was (i could hear in the video later) the broadhead made contact with my tripod before I drew and I didnt realize. WHen I recovered the arrow, the blades were 90 degrees to the arrow shaft and penetration was obviously poor. Part my fault, but still annoying. I check this on draw now.
     
  3. dobber

    dobber AH Enthusiast

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    I use the 3 blade rage and have had nothing but success, but in saying that I also check the ring and make sure the blades are set correctly every time I put an arrow to string. Both myself and my son were in the same tree, he arrowed his bear at 19 yards with a fixed muzzy it went about 200 yards, I hit mine at 9 yards it maybe went 15 yards. Not saying anyone is better than the other, they both got the job done, only problem I had was trailing a bear in the dark, but that's half the fun
    You could fling a hunk of bamboo through the lungs and the critter would die, know your equipment, trust your equipment and be flexible with changing things up
     
  4. elmerfudd555

    elmerfudd555 AH Senior Member

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    Ive used Thunderhead 100s and 3 blade Rage 100's extensively over the last few years. The Rage has accounted for some spectacular kills for me - 355lb black bear at 23 yds that went 12 yds and 5 deer that either just dropped or expired within 15-50 yds. One thing I have noticed is that I almost never can reuse a Rage head. The blades are nearly always bent or the blade on the tip is curled over. The tiny set screws are a bitch to remove and strip easily. Just too much headache to replace the parts and at 13 bucks a piece, not cheap to just throw away. The Thunderheads are another matter completely. Drop 3 new blades in the ferrules and away you go. Ive never lost an animal with the Rage but admit that the total cost of ownership has me thinking about going back to the NAP product.
     
  5. enysse

    enysse AH Ambassador

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    Well the one thing, I have observed over see hundreds of Rage shots on tv, if you hit the ribs or gut...you will probably find the deer...if you try a hard angle shot or hit a solid bone...like the shoulder you will not find the deer...it is probably wound..and will live to see another day. But yes, Rage kills can be fast and bloody. Expandable broadheads are made for those picture perfect broadside shot.

    I can see using a expandable broadhead on deer or antelope, anything else, I'll stick to the thunderhead 100 grains or something like it.
     
  6. LIBERTY

    LIBERTY New Member

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    MECHANICAL BROADHEADS

    This is my first post on this site. I have never had the opportunity to hunt Africa BUT that doesn't mean I have never hunted with a bow. I've been hunting and killing big game with a longbow and fixed 2 blade broadheads for over 40 years. In that time I have come to some conclusions. First conclusion is KISS, keep it simple stupid. There is
    nothing simpler than a longbow or a carbon shaft or a fixed 2 blade cut on contact head. The heads I use are 160gr Grizzly single bevel broadheads. Very rugged, easy to sharpen and when they are mounted straight on a well tuned arrow shaft they buzz thru big Roosevelts elk like a hot knife thru butter. I've never been able to damage one and they twist going thru flesh and bone. I've taken 9 Roosies God knows how many deer a few bears and about ten hogs with them and they performed great each and every time.Nothing moves, nothing gives they just do exactly what they were designed to do. Try em you might like them. Liberty
     
  7. Stocky

    Stocky AH Veteran

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    What do you guys think of the Slick Trick fixed in RSA?

    Man, those things are sharp... I was in Cabelas when I ran amuck and tried shaving my arm with literally every blade I could, a result of opening a pack of G5's that were the dullest 'heads I've ever seen. The salesman suggested these because they were "german steel" and he was right. Never looked at them before but got a pack to try on the range.
     
  8. Norwegianwoods

    Norwegianwoods SILVER SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    The Slick Trick fixed work very well in RSA.
    They fly great and penetrate very well.

    I am sure you will be very happy with them.
     
  9. Synergy

    Synergy AH Senior Member

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    look at this video, bad performance of the rage broadheads

     
  10. firehuntfish

    firehuntfish AH Enthusiast

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    Nothing new or surprising there... Not much has changed since I posted my opinion above on this subject 5 years ago..... I do believe that the Rage brand is still the #1 selling broadhead... Amazing what effective marketing can do.
     
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  11. Lrntolive

    Lrntolive AH Enthusiast

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    A little late to the conversation, but just to to share experiences. I think there are multiple factors being overlooked.

    We like to blame the broadheads for everything, but sometimes it is not their fault. When speed bows were becoming the "rage" I had a friend hunting Pronghorn with a super light arrow ~250 gr and fixed blade. The shot was about 50 yards. The arrow hit the pronghorn on the shoulder and bounced off. We were both in shock. My friend was focused on speed rather than kinetic energy and paid the price. For mechanicals to work, I believe balanced must be achieved between bow, arrow and broadhead.

    Now, I have never used mechanicals, but when I worked for a wildlife agency in CO, all the wildlife officers were against mechanicals. Not to say they couldn't work, but more moving parts means a greater chance of failure. I tend to agree. There's enough that can go wrong with a modern bow, and I don't need my arrows to be an added concern.

    My friends who hunt whitetail back in my old home state of Virginia have great success with expandables, as do most whitetail hunters in the south, but those animals are small in comparison to northern whitetail, mule deer, elk, and more importantly African animals. I'll be honest that I have not hunted Africa yet, but I'm booked for June 2017, and I will video my entire hunt. I will not take expandables.

    Just aspects I think we all need to consider.
     
  12. Limcroma Safaris

    Limcroma Safaris SPONSOR AH Enthusiast

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    This is an excellent point... Unfortunately, this very point makes the case for avoiding the Rage and similar style expandable broadheads... Without an enormous amount of kinetic energy, these style of broadheads will not get any penetration. That necessary kinetic energy is also the same force that causes deflections, breaks blades, and arrow shafts as demonstrated in the video. Thus, nullifying said penetration. It's a lose-lose scenario unless you shoot enough bow to get a pass-through and you are lucky enough not to contact bone on the way. Why would any bow hunter take the chance?

    Watch a hundred bowshots on YouTube with Rages and count how many are pass-throughs on whitetails. You won't find many. On an elk or moose? Good luck....One lung may be enough to kill a whitetail, but it won't kill a large African plainsgame animal.... At least not the same day as it was shot....:(
     
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  13. wesheltonj

    wesheltonj AH Enthusiast

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    I was Elk hunting (rifle, right after archery) last year, my outfitter said that starting this year No more mechanical broad-heads, too many lost elk. He singled Rage in particular.
     
  14. Gemsbok Gangsta

    Gemsbok Gangsta AH Veteran

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    It is funny many states here in the US do not allow expandable broad heads for hunting period.
     
  15. thriller

    thriller AH Fanatic

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    WOW Rages just completely fell of my radar.... I have always used Grim Reaper Expendables in my bow. They seem to work fine for whitetail (over 50 of them), but that video makes still me nervous lol
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2016
  16. Lrntolive

    Lrntolive AH Enthusiast

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    I'm not disagreeing. Just saying those who chose to use expandables should take all those aspects into consideration. Again, I don't spot them, but I those that do and have had success.
     
  17. jeff

    jeff AH Elite

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    The Montec G5s that are made with the mono flow technology are also the dullest heads I've ever seen straight out of the package.
     
  18. 35bore

    35bore AH Legend

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    Sad thing is, that if there were 30 or even 50 successful hunts using ANY product, be it rage, sidewinders, muzzy, etc. etc. The first time it fails, we start doubting and start looking for the new latest and greatest.

    Same with bullets (whether manufacturer or bullet weight, etc. etc.) Even caliber. There are countless threads and campfire stories on this site about it. "Why did it fail?" "Why didn't the animal drop like they always do?", "Why did I miss?"

    Sad truth is, sometimes we fail... less than perfect shots have been made by everyone on this site I'm willing to wager. If it works, then great, if it doesn't, ,, then it MUST be an equipment failure.

    I have watched this video countless times to see if I could see what TOM said happened. I can't see it though. It looks like it went staight into the front leg, and I'm sorry, that's what it looks like on video. I wasn't there to find the animal, or to see the performance. There are just too many success stories, and I won't be swayed by one unfortunate event.

    If I quit using the 35Whelen or the 308 because of misses, or poor marksmanship, then what would I use? I've made poor shots,and questionable shots with a bow as well (obviously looking at it afterwards), and some I ended up with a nice pile if meat for the freezer. Others, just a long walk in the woods looking for an unrecoverable animal...
     
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  19. firehuntfish

    firehuntfish AH Enthusiast

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    35bore,

    Your point is well taken about mistakenly blaming equipment failure for human error. The inherent design flaw and outstanding failure rate of the expandable broadhead design on large game is a completely different argument. The consistent failure of these broadhead designs goes way beyond human error.

    The expandable broadhead idea was born out the theoretical advantage of providing a much larger cutting surface in a compact design that would not have the planing and drifting issues of big fixed blade heads resulting in inconsistent points of impact. Bigger holes, more tissue damage, more kills, accuracy of a field point....Great in theory, but they have yet to perfect the design. Without enough kinetic energy, you get poor penetration. With too much kinetic energy, you break blades, heads, and shafts when bone is impacted.

    In order for this design to work properly in theory, it would have to be an all-steel ferrule with heavy duty blades .040" or better. This would likely bump the head weight up to 150+ grains. Additionally, you would likely need to pair it with a heavy duty arrow shaft sturdy enough to prevent the broadhead from shattering the shaft upon solid impact. Then, top that off with a bow with 80lb. + limbs @ 30"+ draw length capable of generating enough kinetic energy necessary to open the blades and push the broadhead through bone rather than deflecting off of it, or shattering the arrow shaft..... Problem there is that even if this new design was marketed, these manufactures are going to narrow their target market to about 1 out of 100 bow hunters who are both willing and capable to shoot such a rig.

    Bow hunters, most of all, need to be the most ethically minded specifically because of the limitations of our equipment. I will continue to discourage folks from taking these broadheads to Africa. Nothing ruins the rush of shooting the animal of your dreams more than experiencing the pain of wounding or not recovering that animal. Why increase your chances of this by using equipment not intended for the job?
     
  20. Ragman

    Ragman AH Veteran

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    I have used mechanicals with 100% satisfaction on whitetails, mule deer and pronghorn, including Rage 2 and 2-blade, NAP Spitfires and Grim Reaper (my favourite out of the 4). Every animal has dropped in my sight except one mulie that ran down the other side of the hill, only to drop 10 yards from the crest (that was with a Spitfire). I'll still use them with confidence.

    That being said, I agree with most on here. I would not fly all the way to Africa and spend that kind of money to use a mechanical. I don't relish the thought of paying for an animal wounded but not killed. Been there and done that with the rifle! I would either use a Slick Trick or a PX2. The PX2 is a broadhead marketed here in Canada and it has become my favourite in a hurry. Very little bow-tuning required.
     

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