Mild large bore

Milehighshooter

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One of the 9.3's would be my choice. Either in x62 x64 or x66 if available to you. No 350 gr but there are 300 and 320 gr bullets available.

All depends on some personal factors, like hand loading, factory vs custom build, components availability. For example if you were able to locate all the parts and components, I'd build a 10.75x68. A buddy of mine in NZ has one, I'm building one myself. Or a 416 Taylor. If you didn't mind forming your own cases and didn't plan to travel with it, a 400 H&H would be a nice fit. But all of these will be custom jobs. I wouldn't sleep on the 416 Ruger either, if you found a good deal. A 416 Rem would be easiest, and it shouldn't be a problem to load down to 2150-2250 range.

A 400 Whelen could also be fun, but you would have to 100% be certain you got the Petrov/true original Whelen/G&H chamber reamer with the .458 shoulder. With modern powders you should be able to reach 400 gr @2150 safely if needed, but you also have plenty of lighter bullets to choose from for a pretty good price compared to 416 or larger bullets, unless you went 458 Win and loaded it with 45/70 bullets/velocity.
 
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crs

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There are many ways to skin a cat. This is my low impact big bore:
51985_600x400.jpg

Jacketed bullets from 210 to 400 grains. Factory load is 300 grains at 2225 fps.
Pay your money and take your choic
 

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Ray B

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There are several calibers that fit your desires but there is one decision that you should make prior to selection: Belted, non-belted or rimmed? The 375H&H is the basic design for belted while the 404 Jeffery is non-belted, the 45-70 is rimmed. For the last hundred years the belted has been the dominant design for magnum large bores- being used for 300, 338, 458 & other magnums. It's hold on cartridge production is quite secure. The 404 Jeffery design has been around about the same hundred years but only recently has it been rediscovered for its ability to operate through slightly altered "standard" actions and as a base for such proprietary cartridges as the Dakota and others. Not having the step-down from the belt, the 404 case has an increase in capacity. A variation of the Jeffery is the Ruger series, the same non-belt design but the diameter is kept at .532, same as the belted case. The rimmed design is older than either belted or non-belted, having its primary use in lever action and double barrel rifles. Since you indicate interest in bolt action rifles, you selection wouldn't include rimmed cartridges.

Of the belted cartridges I quite like the 338, 375 & 458 magnums for the reasons that you mention. But the non-belted cartridges based on the 404 also fit the criteria. All can be reduced loaded with lighter powder charges and bullet weights, so similar performance is obtainable from both. On theoretical grounds I prefer the 404 because it is a more straight-forward design without the belt, but the availability of ammunition as well as factory made rifles is a significant advantage of the belted cartridges. Inexpensive bullets are obtainable for both the 375 and 458 but sadly lacking in the 423 used by the 404 Jeffery. I prefer the 404 despite the premium only bullets available for it and am experimenting with sizing down cast bullets of .427" to the .423. the .427" bullets are readily available being marketed for use in 44/40 cartridges. The shortcoming is that they are only 200 grains. I would prefer heavier bullets for it, 300 - 350 grains. I may invest in a bullet mould for it, but not there yet.

I checked with CZ a year or two back and while they had a ready supply of 375, 416 & 458 chambered rifles, they had the 404s only on special order and a greatly increased price. So the decision comes down to getting a really nice chambering that has potential to do everything that you want, but lacks commercial acceptance and supply, or one that while not being exactly what you want, is well supported in rifle section and ammunition availability. It may not be noticed while you are involved in your search and decision process, but in reflection I'm sure tht you will see it as a highly enjoyable activity. Best of Luck with it!!
 

ChrisG

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I agree with the .375 H&H assessment. It is comparatively mild. As you don't see yourself hunting DG, I would go with something in the .458 family as bullets go from inexpensive lead cast all the way up to 600 grain core bonded hammers. I will always recommend buying a rifle in a cartridge MORE powerful than you think you need. The reason is simple. You can always download a big gun, but you can't upload a small gun beyond it's potential. A .458 Win Mag is perfect I think for what you want. It fits all the criteria you were looking for:

-Common cartridge (easy to find ammo and brass, dies, etc. for)
-Large bore.
-Common bullet diameter, so loading components are easy to find.
-can always be loaded down nearly handgun ballistics (300 grain bullet at 1,200 fps comes to mind)
- If you ever decide to hunt large, dangerous game (don't count yourself out yet), it can be loaded with a 480 grain premium bullet to 2,150fps, duplicatingthe .450 nitro.
 

JPbowhunter

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Thanks all for the replies, its hard to respond to everyone but I'll try summing it up.

There have been some great suggestions and my interest has been piqued in several calibres.

Really though I would always go a 9.3x62 unless i could find something bigger worth jumping up for.

For me thats either a 450/400 or a 404 jeffery. I emailed Australia's importer for cz and winchester about the 404 and they dont bring them in.

I know the argument for 375 over 9.3 but for lack of a better explanation I just dont like the calibre and dont desire to own one.

As for DG, I'm certain i will hunt buff in australia at some point but for Africa i simply cant see it happening. Leopard I'm very interested in but we can't import, elephant i would love to but at the same time don't belive I could kill one (love seeing others do it though). Lion and rhino I have no interest in and buff, well i would but i just feel that they like buffalo in Australia have suffered from an artificially inflated market. I'm a diy hunter at heart anyway and $20k aud plus for a common animal like a buff by the time it's all said and done I start to think about how I could hunt the states 3 or 4 times out west or NZ for the next 20 years with my brother for the same money.

So unless something else blows me out of the water I'll keep an eye out for a 404, I'm in no rush so I'll play it as it comes.

Thanks again gents i truly appreciate the help.
 

HWL

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A beautyfull "mild large bore" is the 10,75x68...

HWL
 

Daga Boy

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You absolutely wont go wrong with a 9.3 x 62. Its making a huge come-back in Africa and many folk (myself included) rate it as the nicest all round bush rifle. The difference in platform size vs a .375 H&H is very noticeable (go try 2 CZ550's side by side and you will see what I mean) and recoil is less but the terminal effect is in the same class. Not strictly legal on DG in all African countries but nevertheless well up to buffalo (in fact even elephant, although that's not on your list). Both my son and I have recently bought CZ550's in this calibre and both of us plan to use them as our "go to" rifles for everything that we would either deliberately hunt or happen to run into in our neck of the woods with the exception of long range applications. This includes leopard, giraffe and buffalo and an occasional lion ( as a rule no elephants, save for an occasional "stray").

.404 Jeffrey has also made a vigorous comeback and is favoured by many as guide/PH rifle. I don't own one but my arm could easily be twisted.

When it comes to .458 cal rifles I agree with Chris G - go for a .458WM given your parameters. However if you do, then look for one on a standard length action. The nicest ones I have handled have all been custom built on K98 actions. Although a full magnum length action is only about 1/2" longer it makes a big difference in overall balance and "feel" and with the longer action you might as well go for a Lott or Rigby. (In a CZ 550 the .458WM, .458Lott, .416 Rigby and .450 Rigby are all the same size). A downside with this calibre is that you need quite a long barrel to get acceptable velocities with heavy bullets; however a 23" barrel will give you acceptable velocities with all bullets in the 350-450gr range.
 

lwaters

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What about 416 Ruger? No belt plenty of bullets and if a reloader
 

lwaters

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Damn phone!! You can neck up 375 Ruger brass if you need to.
 

lwaters

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Don't count out the Ruger no.1 in 450/400 with practice it can be reloaded almost as fast as a bolt and won't jam.
 

JPbowhunter

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Don't count out the Ruger no.1 in 450/400 with practice it can be reloaded almost as fast as a bolt and won't jam.
I did briefly think about it but single shots just don't really do it for me, i had a chat to my wife the other day about it all. Im 30 in a couple of years and i have permission to save up for a double by then if i can. Have to be a cheaper one maybe merkel 140e or chapuis ugex pr similar. I think ill go with either 450/400 or 9.3x74r if they're available.
 

lwaters

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I did briefly think about it but single shots just don't really do it for me, i had a chat to my wife the other day about it all. Im 30 in a couple of years and i have permission to save up for a double by then if i can. Have to be a cheaper one maybe merkel 140e or chapuis ugex pr similar. I think ill go with either 450/400 or 9.3x74r if they're available.
Either will work.
 

IvW

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Only one comes to mind, 375 H&H Magnum
 

Daga Boy

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It all depends what the gent has in mind to do with it.
Neither a 9.3 x 62 nor a 375 H&H is actually a large bore (large medium actually), but they work for the appropriate applications.
A 45/70 also works for the appropriate applications and its a mild recoiler.
As a dedicated elephant gun you want .450 upwards with plenty oomph; however they recoild heavily
I think he would like a 9.3 x 62
 

IvW

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Only one comes to mind, 375 H&H Magnum

Having said that the 375 H&H Mag is a medium bore and not a Large bore but it does fall exactly into your bullet weight range.

Mild big bores would be 404 Jeff in a bolt gun and 450/400 NE in a double.

True big bores start @ .450.
 

Von S.

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JP,

You did say big bore, right?

To me that starts a 40 and goes from there.

If you want mild and versatile my choice would be the 458 win mag.
 

IvW

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JP,

You did say big bore, right?

To me that starts a 40 and goes from there.

If you want mild and versatile my choice would be the 458 win mag.

375 H&H, 404 Jeff, 416 Rigby or even the 9.3x74R or 9.3x62 would be better choices for the OP's needs.

458 WM is a poor choice.
 

Von S.

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I guess that's where opinions can differ.

You have in your list 3 rounds that aren't even big bores, yet one again, a difference of opinion.

I have been using the 458 win mag with great success around the world for over fifty years and it has never failed me.

Amazingly you don't appear to have anything good to say about the 458 or the 460 and with only about 400 fps between them with the same bullet your objectivity ....in my opinion...is somewhat in question.

Good luck
 
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Witold Krzyżanowski

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Talk to Von Gruff. He lives in your neck of the woods and had a 404 Jeffery built on a 98 Action. I understand that a Win. Mod 70 African Express in 300 RUM can be converted to 404 Jeffery by swapping out the barrel. The 404 will work just fine on Water Buffalo and or Scrub bulls. Woodleigh makes a good assortment of bullets.
Very good idea. 404Jeffery is a great caliber.
Witold
 

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