GrizzlyStik 200 gr Samurai Broadhead Test

[Bowhuntr64]

New test of this classic just dropped. Check it out.

 

[SikaMDhunter]

Nice as always

 

[rookhawk]

@Bowhuntr64 Thanks again for a great review. Your testing is 100% consistent with my son's real-world Africa experiences with this brand of broadhead. (although his were 150gr I believe) Tips rolled, one broke off, edge chatter. Weak penetration.

Iron WIll single bevel 150gr w/o bleeders suffered NONE of these shortcomings.

Thanks again for documenting the broadhead's capabilities!

 

[jpomazi]

Thanks Bowhuntr64. I always appreciate your testing. I did a lot of research before building my setup for Cape buffalo in 2019. I was on the verge of going with grizzlystix arrows and Ashby broad heads. Let me say I have no skin in the game. I just wanted a combination that worked. For me there were two many instances of failure with that setup. I ended up going with a Easton FMJ 250 dangerous game arrow with Ironwill 250 grain buff broad heads. They had just come out but based on my other broad heads from them I felt good about it. I got approximately 24" of penetration on a 30 yard shot on my buffalo. That was out of a Mathews Helium at 65#. Right through a rib like you have to expect. Interestingly enough the other buffalo hunter in camp was shooting the grizzlystix with Ashby broad heads that I had originally planned. He shot a buffalo at around 10 yards from a blind and put it exactly where his PH told him. He got maybe 6-8" of penetration. I went along on the follow up and he put him down with a rifle. I know this is just one instant, but I'm glad I went with what I did! Thanks again.

 

[rookhawk]

Thanks Bowhuntr64. I always appreciate your testing. I did a lot of research before building my setup for Cape buffalo in 2019. I was on the verge of going with grizzlystix arrows and Ashby broad heads. Let me say I have no skin in the game. I just wanted a combination that worked. For me there were two many instances of failure with that setup. I ended up going with a Easton FMJ 250 dangerous game arrow with Ironwill 250 grain buff broad heads. They had just come out but based on my other broad heads from them I felt good about it. I got approximately 24" of penetration on a 30 yard shot on my buffalo. That was out of a Mathews Helium at 65#. Right through a rib like you have to expect. Interestingly enough the other buffalo hunter in camp was shooting the grizzlystix with Ashby broad heads that I had originally planned. He shot a buffalo at around 10 yards from a blind and put it exactly where his PH told him. He got maybe 6-8" of penetration. I went along on the follow up and he put him down with a rifle. I know this is just one instant, but I'm glad I went with what I did! Thanks again.

Not trying to shift subjects, but I very much like your broadhead choice. But why the FMJs? They stole valuable FOC from you that could have been up front of the arrow instead?

 

[mdwest]

I’m not jpomazi … but I’ll take a swing at the FMJ question…

They are clearly a shaft that is absolutely loved by many and hated by many others… you have guys like Ranch Fairy that condemn them.. and guys like Cam Hanes that unequivocally swear by them…

They bend, they break, they are too heavy… seem to be the most common complaints…with “holy shit they are expensive” also being stated commonly..

While they are super consistent, super accurate, and properly heavy being the most common heralds…

There is no question that tons and tons of game have fallen to them all over the globe… and that guys with far greater credentials and experience than most of us here either currently use them or have used them in the past with great success… a search of YouTube will get you more videos than you can count of former Olympic archers, NASP champions, TAC winners, etc shooting FMJ at game during hunts..

No doubt FMJ are heavy… but even with a very long arrow (mine are 31” carbon to carbon) you can reasonably easily attain Ashbys magic 20% FOC value if you are shooting Ashbys magic 650gr target value in weight… my arrows for example are 656gr and 20.11 FOC shooting 5mm 250 spine FMJ shafts (non DG).. AAC 3” vanes, standard nock, 75 gr half out, and a 200 gr broadhead…

I absolutely do not claim expert archer status. I am a novice on my best day…

But if I’m adhering to Ashbys rules… I can do that with an FMJ… and if I’m relying on guys with a lot more experience and skills than I have for brand recommendations (John Dudley, Cam Hanes, my bow tech, etc).. the FMJ comes up over and over again..

That’s at least how ended up with FMJs…

All that said… once I burn through the $580 in FMJ built arrows that my wife and I have… I’m 90% certain I’ll be going to a 4mm Victory VAP… after more research and more math, etc I think that will be an even better option for me..

 

[SikaMDhunter]

I’m not jpomazi … but I’ll take a swing at the FMJ question…

They are clearly a shaft that is absolutely loved by many and hated by many others… you have guys like Ranch Fairy that condemn them.. and guys like Cam Hanes that unequivocally swear by them…

They bend, they break, they are too heavy… seem to be the most common complaints…with “holy shit they are expensive” also being stated commonly..

While they are super consistent, super accurate, and properly heavy being the most common heralds…

There is no question that tons and tons of game have fallen to them all over the globe… and that guys with far greater credentials and experience than most of us here either currently use them or have used them in the past with great success… a search of YouTube will get you more videos than you can count of former Olympic archers, NASP champions, TAC winners, etc shooting FMJ at game during hunts..

No doubt FMJ are heavy… but even with a very long arrow (mine are 31” carbon to carbon) you can reasonably easily attain Ashbys magic 20% FOC value if you are shooting Ashbys magic 650gr target value in weight… my arrows for example are 656gr and 20.11 FOC shooting 5mm 250 spine FMJ shafts (non DG).. AAC 3” vanes, standard nock, 75 gr half out, and a 200 gr broadhead…

I absolutely do not claim expert archer status. I am a novice on my best day…

But if I’m adhering to Ashbys rules… I can do that with an FMJ… and if I’m relying on guys with a lot more experience and skills than I have for brand recommendations (John Dudley, Cam Hanes, my bow tech, etc).. the FMJ comes up over and over again..

That’s at least how ended up with FMJs…

All that said… once I burn through the $580 in FMJ built arrows that my wife and I have… I’m 90% certain I’ll be going to a 4mm Victory VAP… after more research and more math, etc I think that will be an even better option for me..

I'd say these guys in the industry have or are receiving money and free stuff from Easton. They have been in the industry and know everyone. I'm sure they wouldn't shoot junk and Easton makes quality gear but the question should be is it the arrow for you.

There's give and take with choosing arrows. Smaller companies who rely on word of mouth and can only compete by making quality arrows are where I find good gear. They also come with quality control issues that the larger companies have fixed decades ago. But, when you call these smaller companies one of the people who actually make the arrows answers and generally takes care of the problem.

I'd honestly say as long as you are testing your set up that is all you can do. The sad fact of archery hunting is you wont know how effective your set up is until you use it on an animal. The best you can do is try to improve after each hunt and if at all possible record your shot, conduct a small breakdown of sorts after a shot. Did the arrow fly true, how was penetration, how did the animal react to the shot sound, was there blood trail, did you pass through bone, etc.

Archery is a long game.

 

[rookhawk]

I’m not jpomazi … but I’ll take a swing at the FMJ question…

They are clearly a shaft that is absolutely loved by many and hated by many others… you have guys like Ranch Fairy that condemn them.. and guys like Cam Hanes that unequivocally swear by them…

They bend, they break, they are too heavy… seem to be the most common complaints…with “holy shit they are expensive” also being stated commonly..

While they are super consistent, super accurate, and properly heavy being the most common heralds…

There is no question that tons and tons of game have fallen to them all over the globe… and that guys with far greater credentials and experience than most of us here either currently use them or have used them in the past with great success… a search of YouTube will get you more videos than you can count of former Olympic archers, NASP champions, TAC winners, etc shooting FMJ at game during hunts..

No doubt FMJ are heavy… but even with a very long arrow (mine are 31” carbon to carbon) you can reasonably easily attain Ashbys magic 20% FOC value if you are shooting Ashbys magic 650gr target value in weight… my arrows for example are 656gr and 20.11 FOC shooting 5mm 250 spine FMJ shafts (non DG).. AAC 3” vanes, standard nock, 75 gr half out, and a 200 gr broadhead…

I absolutely do not claim expert archer status. I am a novice on my best day…

But if I’m adhering to Ashbys rules… I can do that with an FMJ… and if I’m relying on guys with a lot more experience and skills than I have for brand recommendations (John Dudley, Cam Hanes, my bow tech, etc).. the FMJ comes up over and over again..

That’s at least how ended up with FMJs…

All that said… once I burn through the $580 in FMJ built arrows that my wife and I have… I’m 90% certain I’ll be going to a 4mm Victory VAP… after more research and more math, etc I think that will be an even better option for me..

Nice post. I like your future proposal of the 4mm VAPs very much. I like Sirius Archery’s shafts as well. My carbon lengths are even longer than yours and that’s why I’m always looking to take weight out of the middle. Since going to ethics insert/outsert systems, I’ve had no issues with arrow integrity at all. That’s drawn me to the conclusion the integrity all comes at the front end.

I keep trying to get a consensus opinion on “maximum relevant FOC” from qualified heavy arrow African archers and I can’t seem to find out what the number may be? Ashby keeps saying more and more is better, over 30% being amazing (not sure you nor I could ever achieve that at our lengths?).

The thing to beware with Cam Haynes and John Dudley as A.) they are american big game hunters, and B.) they are drawing crazy heavy bows, and C.) they are heavily sponsored as their livelihood, so they are going to represent products with the widest appeals which are not the products we would use at our size nor game interests. They are certainly the best bow instructors I’ve found so I watch them for “how to shoot” instruction rather than “how to build for Africa” stuff.

Ranch Fairy is good, but his subject matter is hogs so even that is a bit of correlation and experimentation. I will say his project dik-dik experiment was the starting point we used for small youth Africa setups and they did work out pretty well with one exception relevant to this thread: The Samurai broadheads absolutely stunk. Bent, broken tips, edge chatter even when going through impala ribs, and I had to fight tooth and nail to get them to give my kid his money back, ultimately filing a CC dispute during the 90 day AMEX return period.

 

[SikaMDhunter]

The Samurai broadheads absolutely stunk. Bent, broken tips, edge chatter even when going through impala ribs, and I had to fight tooth and nail to get them to give my kid his money back, ultimately filing a CC dispute during the 90 day AMEX return period.

I did a breakdown here on my experience with samurai broadheads with pictures.

GrizzlyStik Samurai Single Bevel

Had a successful aoudad hunt earlier this year followed by an early season white tailed doe in PA. I want to show the broadhead I used. Grizzlystik Samurai 200g single bevel broadheads. There are two version they make; one with advertised AUS 4 (420HC) steel (RED colored) and a stronger steeled...

www.africahunting.com

I did use the cheaper steel (red) broadheads but I was successful on an Aoudad. But those heads were one and done. Iron Will or Tuffheads for me, along with 4mm Orion from Sirius and Ethics Inserts.

For any interested I have a code for 10% off Sirius arrows. Family and Friends discount SAFF10. I do not get paid by Sirius.

 

[jpomazi]

Not trying to shift subjects, but I very much like your broadhead choice. But why the FMJs? They stole valuable FOC from you that could have been up front of the arrow instead?

Mdwest explained it pretty well. With my 75 grain insert and the 250 grain iron will buff broadhead my FOC was right at 20%. I only used the FMJ's on the Cape Buffalo, so I don't have a ton of experience with them. I can say they flew great and put my buffalo down with one arrow so mission accomplished.

 

[mdwest]

I'd say these guys in the industry have or are receiving money and free stuff from Easton. They have been in the industry and know everyone. I'm sure they wouldn't shoot junk and Easton makes quality gear but the question should be is it the arrow for you.

There's give and take with choosing arrows. Smaller companies who rely on word of mouth and can only compete by making quality arrows are where I find good gear. They also come with quality control issues that the larger companies have fixed decades ago. But, when you call these smaller companies one of the people who actually make the arrows answers and generally takes care of the problem.

I'd honestly say as long as you are testing your set up that is all you can do. The sad fact of archery hunting is you wont know how effective your set up is until you use it on an animal. The best you can do is try to improve after each hunt and if at all possible record your shot, conduct a small breakdown of sorts after a shot. Did the arrow fly true, how was penetration, how did the animal react to the shot sound, was there blood trail, did you pass through bone, etc.

Archery is a long game.

Cant argue with any of that.. I think you are spot on across all points..

Regarding small companies, (I apologize, I am taking us way off track of the original review of the 200gr grizzlystik discussion... but I'll keep the OP in mind and reference something else he has done.. )... Im using Crimson Talon single bevel Cleaver broadheads.. and loving them so far (although I recognize I am going to have to shoot a few animals with them before I can become a true believer).. They are locally made (literally less than a 20 minute drive from my house).. made of extremely high quality materials.. take a razor sharp edge.. and are flying consistently with my field points out to 30 yards (havent shot them further than that yet.. but I have no reason to believe they wont be consistent at any reasonable distance).. I found them by watching other reviews posted by @Bowhuntr64 ... gave a pack a try, and have been very, very impressed with them so far).. From what I can tell they will significantly out perform the Grizzlystik Maasai (very similar design) at about 1/3 the price.. the fact that they are locally produced makes them all that much more attractive to me...

 

[Bowhuntr64]

Cant argue with any of that.. I think you are spot on across all points..

Regarding small companies, (I apologize, I am taking us way off track of the original review of the 200gr grizzlystik discussion... but I'll keep the OP in mind and reference something else he has done.. )... Im using Crimson Talon single bevel Cleaver broadheads.. and loving them so far (although I recognize I am going to have to shoot a few animals with them before I can become a true believer).. They are locally made (literally less than a 20 minute drive from my house).. made of extremely high quality materials.. take a razor sharp edge.. and are flying consistently with my field points out to 30 yards (havent shot them further than that yet.. but I have no reason to believe they wont be consistent at any reasonable distance).. I found them by watching other reviews posted by @Bowhuntr64 ... gave a pack a try, and have been very, very impressed with them so far).. From what I can tell they will significantly out perform the Grizzlystik Maasai (very similar design) at about 1/3 the price.. the fact that they are locally produced makes them all that much more attractive to me...

Great to hear that. Thank you for sharing.

 

[mdwest]

Nice post. I like your future proposal of the 4mm VAPs very much. I like Sirius Archery’s shafts as well. My carbon lengths are even longer than yours and that’s why I’m always looking to take weight out of the middle. Since going to ethics insert/outsert systems, I’ve had no issues with arrow integrity at all. That’s drawn me to the conclusion the integrity all comes at the front end.

I keep trying to get a consensus opinion on “maximum relevant FOC” from qualified heavy arrow African archers and I can’t seem to find out what the number may be? Ashby keeps saying more and more is better, over 30% being amazing (not sure you nor I could ever achieve that at our lengths?).

The thing to beware with Cam Haynes and John Dudley as A.) they are american big game hunters, and B.) they are drawing crazy heavy bows, and C.) they are heavily sponsored as their livelihood, so they are going to represent products with the widest appeals which are not the products we would use at our size nor game interests. They are certainly the best bow instructors I’ve found so I watch them for “how to shoot” instruction rather than “how to build for Africa” stuff.

Ranch Fairy is good, but his subject matter is hogs so even that is a bit of correlation and experimentation. I will say his project dik-dik experiment was the starting point we used for small youth Africa setups and they did work out pretty well with one exception relevant to this thread: The Samurai broadheads absolutely stunk. Bent, broken tips, edge chatter even when going through impala ribs, and I had to fight tooth and nail to get them to give my kid his money back, ultimately filing a CC dispute during the 90 day AMEX return period.

Cant argue against any of your points either.. I think you are likely very much spot on on all of the above..

Part of what I have been enjoying about archery is also what is most frustrating... the journey of getting to accurate, deadly capability at reasonable hunting distances (50 yards or less?) is incredibly challenging.. Its not nearly as simple as buying an off the rack Ruger American in 308, slapping a $199 vortex scope on top of it, and hitting the range with a $29 box of ammo.. and voila! 30 minutes later you are deadly to 200 yards on just about anything that walks the planet that weighs 600lbs or less..

There is a whole lot more involved.. and EVERYTHING really does matter.. its not just quality of equipment, design and engineering of the individual pieces of equipment, etc.. its also how each piece of equipment integrates with the other... The bow matters, the string matters, which cam you have matters, how its tuned matters, the sight matters, the rest matters, etc..etc.. and thats completely separate from the arrow.. where every component matters.. but even after building the perfect arrow, there is no guarantee that perfect arrow is perfect for your bow...

Sure you can much like the ruger american analogy go to Cabelas and buy a "hunt ready" Diamond Edge for $399.. buy some basic arrows, practice for a couple of weeks, and be able to reliably kill a whitetail out to 20 or maybe even 30 yards if youre good enough... but if you start talking distances any further than that, or any game that is notably more difficult to kill.. all of the minutia starts to add up quickly.. (making things super fun.. and super frustrating.. all at the same time)..

I admit I have gone deep down the rabbit hole lately.. and Im going to end up with tons of extra "stuff" just laying around before its all over with... extra releases, extra sights, extra arrows, extra broadheads (and field points), etc.. hell.. Ive even swapped out peeps twice already (first guy told me "go with a big peep.. faster target acquisition!".. then the next guy told me "think in terms of a rifle peep... smaller is better.. more precise.. easier to make longer shots more accurately".. to which I realized I had been suckered in my first line of thinking.. the second line was far better for my intended application...)...

The good news is in a matter of just a few months I have seen shots go from "thats adequate for hunting and taking a shot out to 30".. to "thats pretty damn good.. I'd be perfectly comfortable loosing an arrow at kudu sized game out to 50"... all of the tweaking, tuning, and practice is paying off demonstratively.. And I've gotten a lot of very good information from the more experienced guys here that have kept me from following too many wrong paths and kept the learning curve steep in a positive direction... (thank you guys for that!)

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

The good news is in a matter of just a few months I have seen shots go from "thats adequate for hunting and taking a shot out to 30".. to "thats pretty damn good.. I'd be perfectly comfortable loosing an arrow at kudu sized game out to 50"...

I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and say you are probably good beyond 50 inches........

 

[mdwest]

I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and say you are probably good beyond 50 inches........

maybe 60... but not one inch further than that!