Federal .308 deconstruction...dang!

[Deepfork]

I have a few boxes of Federal .308 150gr Power Points. I'm never going to use them so I started breaking down the cartridges for components. These two boxes looked exactly the same, its possible I bought them a different times.

One box is loaded with 46.5gr of the powder on top, ball or flattened ball?

Second box loaded with 45.6gr of the stick powder on the bottom. This was a compressed load, powder came at least halfway up the neck.

The crimp on the box with the stick was crazy tight, totally different from the other box.

Now I understand why some sight in again when they buy factory ammo from a different lot that what they have been shooting. No way bullets from these two boxes were going to act the same.

You would think if Federal had any of their recipes figured it would be the .308 150gr PP!

Anyway, another example of why to avoid factory ammo, or stock up from the same lot.

 

[RIDE-RED350r]

I don't buy very much factory ammo but I have noted some pretty significant inconsistency at times when I have.

Awhile back I bought a couple boxes of 308 Win mainly to start building a stash of brass to reload for my first 308 rifle. Had some spicy rounds in that box, 160gr bullets clocking near 3000fps over the chrony, from a 20" barrel. A primer blew out of a case and lodged in the trigger group preventing me from pulling the trigger again (AR-10)
I stopped firing when that occured and pulled the rest.

I like the ammo I make much better

 

[mdwest]

I pretty much only buy cheap ammo to obtain inexpensive components these days (it’s sometimes cheaper to buy a box of Winchester white box or federal blue box than it is to buy brass alone…

 

[Firebird]

When I do buy factory ammo which is rare but on occasion, I will buy 3-4 boxes and make sure it’s the same lot number. Helps me avoid the issues you mentioned and if it doesn’t work, selling factory ammo is not a problem

 

[R.M.C.]

I've noticed similar stuff with federal in particular. I used to shoot a lot of the blue box soft points and there were two "kinds". One with blue primer sealer on it and one with red sealer. They shot a few inches different from each other and I learned to separate them and sight in with just the blues or reds, whatever I had more of. I've never taken any factory loads apart but would not be shocked if they were quite dissimilar. I still have a few boxes of the reds but now I try to buy 5-10 boxes at the same time and place to minimize the chances of different batches.

 

[JimP]

Most of the time factory ammo is consistent enough for a hunting round, which is their primary purpose. Now if you want to talk target and just punching holes in paper then you might want to resight in for each different lot number that you purchase.

Years ago I was able to purchase some Federal Premium round for my 7mm Rem mag for a real good price so I bought a case of them. Quite a few of my reloading buddies laughed at me for doing so but they are the ones that come to me for a box of them every now and then just so they have something to shoot and get the brass.

 

[Rare Breed]

I have a few boxes of Federal .308 150gr Power Points. I'm never going to use them so I started breaking down the cartridges for components. These two boxes looked exactly the same, its possible I bought them a different times.

One box is loaded with 46.5gr of the powder on top, ball or flattened ball?

Second box loaded with 45.6gr of the stick powder on the bottom. This was a compressed load, powder came at least halfway up the neck.

The crimp on the box with the stick was crazy tight, totally different from the other box.

Now I understand why some sight in again when they buy factory ammo from a different lot that what they have been shooting. No way bullets from these two boxes were going to act the same.

You would think if Federal had any of their recipes figured it would be the .308 150gr PP!

Anyway, another example of why to avoid factory ammo, or stock up from the same lot.


View attachment 542067

Good reason why I reload that and cost savings

 

[pilar]

When I do buy factory ammo which is rare but on occasion, I will buy 3-4 boxes and make sure it’s the same lot number. Helps me avoid the issues you mentioned and if it doesn’t work, selling factory ammo is not a problem

I do the same buy a flat/ 10 boxes same lot# , NORMA has been very consistent ammo
I haven’t tried any Norma mono yet

 

[Firebird]

And I prefer Norma brass to fc brass the ammo in the blue box gets loaded into

 

[Inline6]

Our favorite ammo manufacturer (Hornady) shooting our favorite round (6.5CM). Was hitting a 5/8" horizontal piece of rebar 3 times in a row at a match. That was 2009/2010 time frame.

Federal GMM 185s out of my 308 AI had an SD of 3.5fps for 10 rounds. This was a case of ammo I purchased last year.

Factory ammo is better than most people give it credit, especially with today's technology.

@Deepfork one thing to consider is the covid shortage. Manufacturers were trying to get ammo on the shelf, they suffered the same problem we do. Lack of components, they had to make adjustments on the fly to get it to work. As far as different powders and charge weights. Different powders have different burn rates(I'm sure everyone knows this). As long as the velocities are the same the bullets should hit within 1MOA of one another. I would believe testing was done prior to going on the shelf.

 

[Hunt anything]

Did you shoot any from the different boxes to see if they shot differently? Just curious.

 

[Deepfork]

Our favorite ammo manufacturer (Hornady) shooting our favorite round (6.5CM). Was hitting a 5/8" horizontal piece of rebar 3 times in a row at a match. That was 2009/2010 time frame.

Federal GMM 185s out of my 308 AI had an SD of 3.5fps for 10 rounds. This was a case of ammo I purchased last year.

Factory ammo is better than most people give it credit, especially with today's technology.

@Deepfork one thing to consider is the covid shortage. Manufacturers were trying to get ammo on the shelf, they suffered the same problem we do. Lack of components, they had to make adjustments on the fly to get it to work. As far as different powders and charge weights. Different powders have different burn rates(I'm sure everyone knows this). As long as the velocities are the same the bullets should hit within 1MOA of one another. I would believe testing was done prior to going on the shelf.

Probably right on the COVID point. I bought the stuff when it was hard to find anything, kind of buying whatever I could find during that time like everyone else.

 

[Deepfork]

Did you shoot any from the different boxes to see if they shot differently? Just curious.

Nope, wish I had!

 

[Inline6]

Our favorite ammo manufacturer (Hornady) shooting our favorite round (6.5CM). Was hitting a 5/8" horizontal piece of rebar 3 times in a row at a match. That was 2009/2010 time frame.

Federal GMM 185s out of my 308 AI had an SD of 3.5fps for 10 rounds. This was a case of ammo I purchased last year.

Factory ammo is better than most people give it credit, especially with today's technology.

@Deepfork one thing to consider is the covid shortage. Manufacturers were trying to get ammo on the shelf, they suffered the same problem we do. Lack of components, they had to make adjustments on the fly to get it to work. As far as different powders and charge weights. Different powders have different burn rates(I'm sure everyone knows this). As long as the velocities are the same the bullets should hit within 1MOA of one another. I would believe testing was done prior to going on the shelf.

The Hornady ammo story, probably should have the distance called....it was 350 yards. Sorry brain was faster than the fingers.

 

[deewayne2003]

Not surprised; and as said before you should check zero between lots as well as buy your ammo in large lots when possible.

 

[NDWoods]

I LOVE LOVE LOVE Barnes TSX ammo. Two lots of 375 H&H had different COLOR primers and a few inches different POI at 100 yds.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I have a few boxes of Federal .308 150gr Power Points. I'm never going to use them so I started breaking down the cartridges for components. These two boxes looked exactly the same, its possible I bought them a different times.

One box is loaded with 46.5gr of the powder on top, ball or flattened ball?

Second box loaded with 45.6gr of the stick powder on the bottom. This was a compressed load, powder came at least halfway up the neck.

The crimp on the box with the stick was crazy tight, totally different from the other box.

Now I understand why some sight in again when they buy factory ammo from a different lot that what they have been shooting. No way bullets from these two boxes were going to act the same.

You would think if Federal had any of their recipes figured it would be the .308 150gr PP!

Anyway, another example of why to avoid factory ammo, or stock up from the same lot.


View attachment 542067

@Deepfork
That's why I reload. Always consistent.
Bob

 

[Inline6]

@Deepfork
That's why I reload. Always consistent.
Bob

Yes and no, you still have to check your powder when the lot numbers change. Same load different lot and I gained 150fps heavy bolt lift and groups the size of a golf ball at 100 yards. Adjust charge to match previous velocities back to sub .25moa. Until I was half way through the 8# jug. Then I had add the original weight of the powder charge to get my velocities back up. Craziest experience I have had while reloading in the 33 years I have been doing it.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Yes and no, you still have to check your powder when the lot numbers change. Same load different lot and I gained 150fps heavy bolt lift and groups the size of a golf ball at 100 yards. Adjust charge to match previous velocities back to sub .25moa. Until I was half way through the 8# jug. Then I had add the original weight of the powder charge to get my velocities back up. Craziest experience I have had while reloading in the 33 years I have been doing it.

@Inline6
That's why I buy 4kg containers. That gives my close to 1,000 round before I have to worry.
If I buy powders that are different lots I get a big container and mix them together to give me the same lot and work my load up.
Bob

 

[Hunter-Habib]

I bought 3 boxes of Federal 7x57mm Mauser 175Gr Classic Hi-Shok soft point factory loads in 1996 (new imports, so the ammunition was supposed to be fresh).

I tried them out and found out that 18 cartridges out of a 20 round box were prone to misfiring. Other purchasers of these Federal cartridges were also complaining of frequent misfires and hang fires.

I still kept two of the faulty boxes of cartridges as a souvenir (and someday, I might decide to pull the bullets & brass and reload them with new powders and primers).

By contrast, I still have a few loose rounds of the old Winchester Super X 175Gr soft nosed factory load for the 7x57mm Mauser (which got discontinued in 1999). Not only have they never misfired, but their chronographed velocity is still pretty damned close to the advertised velocity of 2450 fps.

Now, I don't mean to burn Federal at the stake. Absolutely not. I've successfully shot most of my African Cape buffalo with Federal Premium Trophy Bonded Bear Claw soft point factory loads in .375 Holland & Holland Magnum. And I'm absolutely in love with this cartridge.

But Federal does sometimes leave a lot to be desired with some of their products.