An African Dilemma......Hmmm....What to Use?

8x68

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I would take #3 and #7 but the above suggestions I think would work as well. Nice battery of rifles!
Thanks. There are more but I couldn't get them all in the picture. Got a Win M70 Alaskan in 338 Win Mag. I do have a 243 that I'm refinishing the stock on as well as a Sako Hunter in 270 Win. 300 Win Mag or 300 WBY work work as well for PG. Yes I have thems as well.
 

8x68

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By your screen name, take #2 and the #3 - #8 Your choice.
Given your name and choices I'd go with #2 and #3.
.....or 8, 6, 5, 7 .... LOL
Ever since I bought the 8x68S 30 some years ago (and yes I still have the original rifle) I've always thought and still believe it's an outstanding calibre. It doesn't get the accolades it deserves.
I'd probably go with the 7x57 and 8x68 for plains game, and 404 Jeffery for DG. Yes I love my 375 H&H but would feel a bit more comfortable with a larger diameter bullet.
 

8x68

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Some great choices! I'm currently having a similar dilemma on a smaller scale

Got a 7x64 and 9.3x62 and trying to work out what would be a good dangerous game rifle...

Of your choices I'd probably go No. 1 and No. 6

No.1 as a Brno 7x57 is just a total classic and very effective (plus easier to get ammo for that 8x68)
No.6 As I am developing a soft spot for 404 Jeff and if taking a Brno surely the other thing you should take is a Winchester M70

(Cheeky question: was the M70 your bear rifle?)
Actually haven't had the opportunity to hunt bear with it. I like big calibres. Working my way up to something along the lines of a 505 Gibbs. I might take the 458 Lott and have it rebarelled to 505 or 475 A&M magnum.
My 404 is exceptionally accurate. Will shoot 3 shot groups less than an inch off the bench at 100yds. I should see what it does at 200yds just for the heck of it.
 

Scrumbag

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Well, it's a great rifle and enjoy using it. I wish I lived with your kind of gun laws!
 

Scrumbag

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Well the RCMP is trying very hard to create the beginning's of a police state.

Keep at them! Our lot (UK) Police have made a total mess of our system, so much so even they can't live with it! Keep up the fight!
 

Alexandro Faria

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I'm going to be boring and a kill-joy, I apologise in advance.

There has been suggestion to take the 7mm and either the holland or rigby, which is sound advice indeed! However, I would like to suggest that you take the .375 H&H and the .416 Rigby, for the main reason that you can shoot a springbok with a .375, you can't shoot a buff with a 7mm. I get that you want something that isn't going to kick you to mars while shooting plains game, especially over distance, but in the event that your DG rifle is no longer an option, it's nice to know that you have another rifle that you know that can do the same job.
The last thing you want when a buff or ele takes issue with you in thick bush is a rifle that you aren't familiar with. I would suggest having a decent scope on the .375 H&H and a load of around 230-250gr and use that for your plains game, then have your .416/.450 rigby with either open sights or a low mag scope with the heaviest bullets your gun can shoot accurately for DG and bushveld.

If I could have things my way, I'd add a 500/416 to my .375 and that's all I would use for hunting springbok up. I have no issue with recoil, plus having a gun fit you perfectly really goes a long way to making it a pleasure to shoot. Then add to it a good 12 gauge for birds and either a centrefire .22 or a 6mm for pests and tiny antelope (duiker, steenbok) and your sorted for everything on this planet.

Either way, enjoy it!
 

Stefano Malinverni

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I think that you need a .338-06, depending on your targets #1 and #3, if not hunting buff, #1 & #8 if buff and heavier are on yur hunt.
 

Philip Glass

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Keep it simple, although I know it's hard to do, and just take the .375 unless you are after elephant.
Regards,
Philip
 

IvW

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One of these days before I get to the point of being non functional I would like to hunt Africa. Here is my dilemma....I have too many choices of rifle. I want to hug them all and bring them all but that would be most silly and expensive. Hunt choice would be a plains game safari, and then a DG hunt.
So what would you bring?
From top to bottom we have the following buffet of choices.
#1 BRNO 600 in 7x57
#2 BRNO 602 in 8x68S
#3 CZ 550 FS in 9.3x62
#4 BRNO 602 in 375 H&H (yes recoil pad will be replaced)
#5 CZ 550 in 416 Rigby
#6 Custom M70 in 404 Jeffery
#7 CZ 550 in 450 Rigby
#8 BRNO 602 in 458 Lott (again recoil pad will be replaced)
Not built yet but almost...Custom CZ 550 in 358 Norma Mag.
View attachment 157020

Very nice collection in the right calibers.

Quite easy to recommend from such a fine collection:

If hunting plains game in bush veldt area 7 x 57mm loaded with 170-175 gr bullets.
If hunting plains game in bush veldt area includes Eland replace 7 x 57mm with 9.3 x 62mm 286 or 300gr.
If hunting PG in more open area, Kalahari and also including Eland, 8 x 68S also with heavy for caliber bullets.
DG-if hunting only the cats, 375 H&H with 300 or 350 gr bullets.
DG-if you include buffalo then replace the 375 h&H with the 404 Jeff or 416 Rigby(400 or 450 gr bullets)
DG-If Elephant is included it will have to be the 450 Rigby for me
 

PeteG

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Very nice collection in the right calibers.

Quite easy to recommend from such a fine collection:

If hunting plains game in bush veldt area 7 x 57mm loaded with 170-175 gr bullets.
If hunting plains game in bush veldt area includes Eland replace 7 x 57mm with 9.3 x 62mm 286 or 300gr.
If hunting PG in more open area, Kalahari and also including Eland, 8 x 68S also with heavy for caliber bullets.
DG-if hunting only the cats, 375 H&H with 300 or 350 gr bullets.
DG-if you include buffalo then replace the 375 h&H with the 404 Jeff or 416 Rigby(400 or 450 gr bullets)
DG-If Elephant is included it will have to be the 450 Rigby for me
So to be safe, get them all ;):D:ROFLMAO:
.
.
.
Except the 375 of course:A Stirring::E Big Grin::E Happy:
 

Velo Dog

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Very nice collection in the right calibers.

Quite easy to recommend from such a fine collection:

If hunting plains game in bush veldt area 7 x 57mm loaded with 170-175 gr bullets.
If hunting plains game in bush veldt area includes Eland replace 7 x 57mm with 9.3 x 62mm 286 or 300gr.
If hunting PG in more open area, Kalahari and also including Eland, 8 x 68S also with heavy for caliber bullets.
DG-if hunting only the cats, 375 H&H with 300 or 350 gr bullets.
DG-if you include buffalo then replace the 375 h&H with the 404 Jeff or 416 Rigby(400 or 450 gr bullets)
DG-If Elephant is included it will have to be the 450 Rigby for me


Hello 8x68,

With apologies to thi9elsp who, rightfully thinks at least one of my other topic AH posts, was too long;
(I'd say that many of my posts are definitely "too long" and if this is one is so, please do skip over it and read something shorter - LOL ?)

But for those who have approximately 2 or 3 minutes to spare:
I'm definitely +1 with IvW's sage advice on your question.
However, if IvW's pretty much perfect advice somehow falls short of your plans and / or your personal taste, (there definitely is no crime in having your own ideas), then I suggest that you just bring that super accurate .404 you have there.
Even if the first safari is "only" for non-dangerous animals, that MOA shooting .404 will not fail you.
I would just make sure my iron sights were regulated spot-on for my ammunition at 100 paces and then I'd put a low powered scope on it, in very stout low rings that, are detachable without tools IE: lever rings, G&H all steel "side mount", (and some folks like "pivot mounts but I have no experience with them) or, the very best of them all but quite expensive; German claw mounts.

As well as providing a measure of comfort any time you see fresh lion spoor in the sand, there is just something about a .404 Jeffery.
At first, ammunition for the ".404 Nitro Rimless Jeffery" was available with two bullet weights, not just the iconic 400 grainers, soft and solid at an advertised 2100+ fps which, made it so effective on everything, including grumpy elephants at close range (usually solids but not absolutely always for elephant hunting).
Also, "tropical packages" of .404 ammunition were commonly available "back in the day", with 300 grain semi-spitzer expanding, advertised at 2600 fps, "for thin skinned animals", according to the maker's labeling.

The lighter bullet load was however dropped, evidently because many hunters were in too much of hurry or maybe too smart, etc., to be bothered reading what was printed on the ammunition tins and boxes.
This resulted in "average" people (un-like all of us above average folks within this forum of course), using the 300 gr soft on thick skinned, heavy dangerous game, with very predictable failures.
Well anyway, if you hand-load, perhaps you could develop a 2600 fps / 300 gr load for your rifle to use if only hunting for "plains game".
Hawk Bullets Inc., makes them with your choice of jacket thickness.
I'd want the thickest jacket available, because if my .423 diameter bullet failed to expand on a duiker or impala, so what, I expect with the blunt shape they already leave the muzzle with, it'd put them down very fast anyway.

More importantly, if you are to hunt eland, zebra, waterbok and such large-ish animals, the thick jacket will be to your substantial advantage.
Not sure if Woodleigh makes their excellent bonded core / soft nose .423 caliber bullets, in a .300 gr or not but if they do, it would I presume be a real dandy, (as are their 400 grainers in this caliber).
Like yourself, I am possessed of various caliber "controlled round feed" type rifles, including a .416 Rigby and so for comparison sake, Woodleigh makes a very fine 340 gr bonded soft for so called "plains game" ...... admittedly though, I have not brought my .416 to Africa (yet).

All that being said, even the tried and true heavier "dangerous game" bullet at 400 grains will surely be just fine on non-dangerous game as well (I would suggest Swift A-Frame for buffalo, by the way).
In Africa (Alaska as well) the hunting culture does not even blink, any time a fellow uses his favorite dangerous game caliber on smallish / non-dangerous animals.
In such environs, this is so common as to be almost not worth mentioning.

Cheers,
Velo Dog.
 
Last edited:

rookhawk

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@Velo Dog has some great .404 insights.

In addition, I'd point out there was a "shortcoming" of the .404 that in part gave rise to the .416 as the preferred gun. The problem was/is that mild to moderate 400gr loads didnt' always have the oopmh needed to penetrate a body shot on an elephant so many people chocked the .404 up to being "just another .375HH".

Today, there is a 450gr loading available from Norma and several firms are making 450gr solids for this fine rifle. The 404 with the 450gr bullet is a formidable penetrator and a vast improvement over a .375HH allowing not just brain, but also body shots on elephant and other dangerous game.

A .404 with quick detach scope regulated for 300gr softs, and iron sights regulated for a 450gr solid would make it a reasonable switch hitter for plains game and dangerous game in one package.

I personally like the best tool for the job so I'd do what I suggested above with a three gun safari: 7x57 (175gr partitions) for plains game. .404J with 450gr bullets for dangerous game. The .375HH in the backup category with 10 rounds of solids and softs in 300gr in case something causes either primary weapon to fail you on safari.
 

Ray B

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this Saturday (3/18) I'm taking a bunch of rifles for a rangeday with some other instructors- one of the items on the list is to shoot the 404, sighting the open sights for 75 yards with 450 gr Woodleighs and the QD scope (pres a 2-7x Leupold) for 2o0 yards with 350 gr woodleighs. I plan on breaking the rifle in this Fall on elk. We'll see how it works as a switch hitter.
 

K-man

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If I may lend a machete to your intellectual thicket, sell half your rifles at a tidy profit, go on three safaris. Just make sure you keep the .375. I have never felt undergunned with mine, and that includes a extremely angry cow elephant at 40 yds, lion at 40 yds , cape buff at 70 yds and kodiak bear at 60 yds. All one shot kills.
 

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