Africa...when will you be priced out??

deewayne2003 · May 20, 2026

DrBob said:
I had just returned to Alaska after my first hunt in Africa (Zim).... I bumped into a group of hunters from the Lower 48 in the waiting line in the airport. They had been skunked.... the ADF&G closed the season while they were still in the field. Alaska is essentially a one species per hunt proposition for outsiders. When I get my moose tag, I pick up a grizzly tag just in case. Sadly, I told the hunters that they should hunt next in Africa... multiple species.. higher percentage of success... lower cost.

What you stated above is the exact reason I went with a Tuskless hunt instead of a AK brown bear hunt.

I got a tuskless elephant, a massive Chobe Bushbuck, a trophy Impala, caught a giant Vundu catfish + private air charter from Harare to camp and back for an all in cost that was 50% less than a AK brown bear hunt outfitter cost alone.

Foxi · May 21, 2026

Tundra Tiger said:
Yes Foxi, that is why I moved here. For most things permitss are free - my only cost is a hunting license and whatever travel cost me to get where I am going. Heck, in our area you can shoot 2 brown bears a year and don't even need a permit. The NR costs are what mystify me, and people pay up.

wow.
2 Brownbears for free.You are joking,or?
Have you ever done it and in which area is that ?

375Fox · May 21, 2026

Foxi said:
wow.
2 Brownbears for free.You are joking,or?
Have you ever done it and in which area is that ?

You do realize all hunting in US is technically free aside from cost of hunting license and tag? A state resident can take advantage of a lot of opportunities in the state they live. There are some restrictions for non-residents.

deewayne2003 · May 21, 2026

JoeSoap said:
Thanks for your input! One other question for you, as I see you are from Texas, or others from Texas, I saw someone post earlier in the thread about hunting whitetail in Texas costing $12K and I am horrified as I am in Texas and was wanting to hunt a Whitetail as a first timer. I see them all the time along the road at night, can’t I just shoot one of those for free?

Ok maybe discharging a rifle along the road at night isn’t such a good idea …but surly there are ranches to go which are much cheaper than 12K? Especially if one is happy to hike around and accept fate if one is lucky enough to find one. The guiding I need is to learn to field dress a deer where I do it myself and someone instructs.

@JoeSoap

Texas is different than the western states, Texas being settled before the west was explored by the US so private ownership had been established, hence why 90%+ of land in Texas is privately owned.

There is little public hunting opportunities in Texas and those that exist are usually flooded with hunters; so in my lifetime getting access to private land comes down to friends, family & leases.

Having said that, Texas does have opportunities for lottery draw system for different hunts hosted on both public and private land; these hunts are for everything from whitetail to exotics.

If you’re looking for a guided whitetail hunt at affordable prices, look for cull hunts; some of these cull hunts offer bucks bigger than 90% of deer hunters will ever shoot.

Tundra Tiger · May 21, 2026

Foxi said:
wow.
2 Brownbears for free.You are joking,or?
Have you ever done it and in which area is that ?

Nope, not joking. For residents 2 brown bears per season at no cost and requiring no tag.

I have not yet taken advantage - I need to.

Game Management Unit 17 in the SW corner.

0002S · May 26, 2026

It costs what it cost and I can when I can. If I can’t, so be it. I’ve been lucky enough to do what I have done so far. Most never get to do it at all.

Prices will come down as the boomers age out of the physical ability to hunt.

eatmore-pbj · May 26, 2026

0002S said:
It costs what it cost and I can when I can. If I can’t, so be it. I’ve been lucky enough to do what I have done so far. Most never get to do it at all.

Prices will come down as the boomers age out of the physical ability to hunt.

This boomer is just about at my physical limit. Just came back from JNB in premium economy and my back is ruined. I must go first class now and just looked a first class ticket with United is $ 10,800 in mid August. Thats my financial limit also.

0002S · May 26, 2026

eatmore-pbj said:
This boomer is just about at my physical limit. Just came back from JNB in premium economy and my back is ruined. I must go first class now and just looked a first class ticket with United is $ 10,800 in mid August. Thats my financial limit also.

This is the problem for most people.

Two years ago I decided that continuing to travel and hunt was going to require a complete physical makeover of my body. Either I changed it or it was going to become severely limiting. I lost 100lbs and started to work out again. I change my diet and physical activities. I can’t cheat death, but i got tired of helping it. It has made a huge difference on multiple levels. There are a lot of bucket list hunts that have physically opened back up to me.

I fly Qatar business, on a two stop w/long layover (by choice), and it’s currently at or under 5K, 9 months out. I only get Euro mounts now unless it way up in the record books. Even still most hunts, all in, are 20K-30K. That is a lot of guided fishing. I find certain parts of Europe still affordable. Most US hunts are getting priced to a point I question their worth to me.

There are quite a few hunts that I’m priced out of. There are starting to become a lot more, that have lost appeal, based on the current prices.

This is just my opinion. Once the boomer, once in a lifetime, hunters live out their dream, the demand will slow. Gen X is small. They hunts more than Millennials and Gen Z. There is going to be less and less demand as time goes on.

Mtn_Infantry · May 26, 2026

0002S said:
This is just my opinion. Once the boomer, once in a lifetime, hunters live out their dream, the demand will slow. Gen X is small. They hunts more than Millennials and Gen Z. There is going to be less and less demand as time goes on.

There’s going to be less demand numbers wise but fragmentation of hunting land and thereby access is vanishing faster than the boomer generation. As large chunks of land disappear to support increased housing, shopping, data centers, etc the remaining demand is the same or increasing despite a reduction in the actual number of hunters. As land fragments animal populations change or disperse and so do tag numbers.

Look at what’s happened with western hunting. Can’t tell me it’s the boomer generation doing back country public land pack-in elk hunts that helped eliminate OTC Elk Tags in Colorado. No it’s increased pressure and demand from Gen X, Millennials, and Gen Z on the shrinking resource of huntable public land.

deewayne2003 · May 26, 2026

Mtn_Infantry said:
There’s going to be less demand numbers wise but fragmentation of hunting land and thereby access is vanishing faster than the boomer generation. As large chunks of land disappear to support increased housing, shopping, data centers, etc the remaining demand is the same or increasing despite a reduction in the actual number of hunters. As land fragments animal populations change or disperse and so do tag numbers.

Look at what’s happened with western hunting. Can’t tell me it’s the boomer generation doing back country public land pack-in elk hunts that helped eliminate OTC Elk Tags in Colorado. No it’s increased pressure and demand from Gen X, Millennials, and Gen Z on the shrinking resource of huntable public land.

As for the availability of public land draw tags in western states, yes boomers are having a negative effect; it's just the Sierra Club faction of the boomers who are doing so.

You have to realize that animal rights activists got into the lotto system over a decade ago, they apply for the same lotteries as hunters and if they get drawn they simply don't use the tag; so the western tag lotto situation has had an external variable that many have no clue about for years on end now and these activists know the game and have been racking up preference points too.

375Fox · May 26, 2026

deewayne2003 said:
As for the availability of public land draw tags in western states, yes boomers are having a negative effect; it's just the Sierra Club faction of the boomers who are doing so.

You have to realize that animal rights activists got into the lotto system over a decade ago, they apply for the same lotteries as hunters and if they get drawn they simply don't use the tag; so the western tag lotto situation has had an external variable that many have no clue about for years on end now and these activists know the game and have been racking up preference points too.

Sounds like they are paying a lot of money into state game agencies just for biologists to decide the harvest needs to be higher. If this is a significant thing it’s a waste of their time over long term.

deewayne2003 · May 26, 2026

375Fox said:
Sounds like they are paying a lot of money into state game agencies just for biologists to decide the harvest needs to be higher. If this is a significant thing it’s a waste of their time over long term.

Since when did animal right activists start making logical decisions or worry about long term consequences?...... and it doesn't have to be the western tags either!

Mtn_Infantry · May 26, 2026

deewayne2003 said:
As for the availability of public land draw tags in western states, yes boomers are having a negative effect; it's just the Sierra Club faction of the boomers who are doing so.

You have to realize that animal rights activists got into the lotto system over a decade ago, they apply for the same lotteries as hunters and if they get drawn they simply don't use the tag; so the western tag lotto situation has had an external variable that many have no clue about for years on end now and these activists know the game and have been racking up preference points too.

I’m keenly aware of the activists also competing for tags. It’s why many states elected to shift away from a small upfront application fee and full payment after drawing, to applicants having to pay 100% of the tag cost up front and getting reimbursed when they don’t draw. That and figuring out with all that money they were holding they could make a bit off the interest.

The competition with activists is stiffest in states that have random draws with no points. Which is why some states also started to require a non refundable license purchase to apply.

@375Fox rarely are game departments increasing their tag numbers much. The expense of game counts in the remote areas is a lot especially with increased fuel, maintenance and labor costs. Unfortunately Fish and Game Departments are relying more and more on hunter surveys and success rates in their units as a means to gauge populations rather than do their job

375Fox · May 26, 2026

deewayne2003 said:
Since when did animal right activists start making logical decisions or worry about long term consequences?...... and it doesn't have to be the western tags either!

View attachment 766703

Again though, that’s a 1 year disruption on a new hunt. They’ll issue more tags the next year to compensate. I don’t think they are having any effect on established western draw hunts.

375Fox · May 26, 2026

Mtn_Infantry said:
@375Fox rarely are game departments increasing their tag numbers much. The expense of game counts in the remote areas is a lot especially with increased fuel, maintenance and labor costs. Unfortunately Fish and Game Departments are relying more and more on hunter surveys and success rates in their units as a means to gauge populations rather than do their job

I think it’s also because this proposed strategy has very little effect on their management goals. As frustrating as it is for hunters to apply for points and tags, I don’t see an anti-hunting organization coordinating an effort to apply. Unless however, it’s very easy and low cost to do, like the Florida $5 bear example, but that was also a new hunt that got a lot of public attention.

Pennsylvania’s elk hunt would be a very easy tag to disrupt if anti-hunting organizations were actually buying licenses and playing the points game, but hunter success is over 80% and over 90% on bulls. That says the individuals drawing the tags are actual hunters.

LivingTheDream · May 26, 2026

I know there was a few anti's that would do this on eastern lottery hunts. Wouldn't say it was coordinated but they would show up (to date this a bit, it was when they would put names in a hat).

I think there was some coordination when they opened the grizzly lottery in Wyoming before the courts shut it down.

It does happen but think it is rather small scale.

Mtn_Infantry · May 26, 2026

375Fox said:
I think it’s also because this proposed strategy has very little effect on their management goals. As frustrating as it is for hunters to apply for points and tags, I don’t see an anti-hunting organization coordinating an effort to apply. Unless however, it’s very easy and low cost to do, like the Florida $5 bear example, but that was also a new hunt that got a lot of public attention.

Pennsylvania’s elk hunt would be a very easy tag to disrupt if anti-hunting organizations were actually buying licenses and playing the points game, but hunter success is over 80% and over 90% on bulls. That says the individuals drawing the tags are actual hunters.

I think it used to happen more in a few western states with examples I’ve heard being cited for Sheep, Moose, Bison and Grizzly hunts and traditionally in the resident pool. Typically it happens the first couple years a hunt is introduced (like WY Grizz), or happens in states that don’t have points. I was shown an example in Idaho years ago.

When states went to having to prepay these tag it hurt their operating budgets and entries they could get for their dollars. Wyoming on Bison and Goat, or when they tried to do the Grizzly Hunt (you now need to prepay these tags and a Non Res Bison tag is $6,017)

Idaho on Sheep/Moose/Goat (you now need to pre-pay this tag).

Reason being if an anti’s budget was hypothetically $20k and they could buy a license at a few hundred dollars (non res) or cheaper as a resident, and an entry at a hundred dollars it wouldn’t take much to disrupt the odds (especially with residents where costs are significantly less). Should they draw it’s not hard to “fundraise” the $200 for a resident tag or $2,600+ for a non res tag among their supporters. Now that they need to pay the license plus entire tag fees up front it’s less entries or worthwhile if their hypothetical $20k budget.

Another tag I’ve heard rumors of them swaying the odds because of the low cost barrier to entry are east cost moose tags like Maine, Vermont, and New Hampshire. Not sure they’re building points rather than adding a ton of additional names to jack with the odds/number of applicants and potentially discourage new applicants from applying

375Fox · May 26, 2026

Mtn_Infantry said:
I think it used to happen more in a few western states with examples I’ve heard being cited for Sheep, Moose, Bison and Grizzly hunts and traditionally in the resident pool. Typically it happens the first couple years a hunt is introduced (like WY Grizz), or happens in states that don’t have points. I was shown an example in Idaho years ago.

When states went to having to prepay these tag it hurt their operating budgets and entries they could get for their dollars. Wyoming on Bison and Goat, or when they tried to do the Grizzly Hunt (you now need to prepay these tags and a Non Res Bison tag is $6,017)

Idaho on Sheep/Moose/Goat (you now need to pre-pay this tag).

Reason being if an anti’s budget was hypothetically $20k and they could buy a license at a few hundred dollars (non res) or cheaper as a resident, and an entry at a hundred dollars it wouldn’t take much to disrupt the odds (especially with residents where costs are significantly less). Should they draw it’s not hard to “fundraise” the $200 for a resident tag or $2,600+ for a non res tag among their supporters. Now that they need to pay the license plus entire tag fees up front it’s less entries or worthwhile if their hypothetical $20k budget.

Another tag I’ve heard rumors of them swaying the odds because of the low cost barrier to entry are east cost moose tags like Maine, Vermont, and New Hampshire. Not sure they’re building points rather than adding a ton of additional names to jack with the odds/number of applicants and potentially discourage new applicants from applying

I’m not saying it’s not possible. Definitely in the case of Wyoming grizzly hunt where they could possibly reduce tags while fighting in court or in the case of resuming Florida black bear hunting where it only cost $5 (if correct) to enter. However, I think it’s very small impact overall especially on any established hunts. Deewayne said activists know the game and are racking up preference points. It was said in reference to elk hunting and western draws. I think that was reaching pretty far. If it was an issue sounds like western game agencies took some steps to mitigate it already.

375Fox · May 26, 2026

Mtn_Infantry said:
Look at what’s happened with western hunting. Can’t tell me it’s the boomer generation doing back country public land pack-in elk hunts that helped eliminate OTC Elk Tags in Colorado. No it’s increased pressure and demand from Gen X, Millennials, and Gen Z on the shrinking resource of huntable public land.

I fully agree with this point. There doesnt appear to be any shortage of younger hunters wanting to do elk hunts. When tags are sold and there are no hunters on public land I might believe the anti-hunting tag conspiracy, but I see no reason to think it has an impact now.

Mtn_Infantry · May 26, 2026

375Fox said:
I’m not saying it’s not possible. Definitely in the case of Wyoming grizzly hunt where they could possibly reduce tags while fighting in court or in the case of resuming Florida black bear hunting where it only cost $5 (if correct) to enter. However, I think it’s very small impact overall especially on any established hunts. Deewayne said activists know the game and are racking up preference points. It was said in reference to elk hunting and western draws. I think that was reaching pretty far. If it was an issue sounds like western game agencies took some steps to mitigate it already.

Yes I think many agencies have taken steps to mitigate it as much as possible. I could see it happening on a small scale with residents.

IMO activist groups would be better off purchasing land traditionally open for hunting or leased to state agencies for hunting similar to what they’re doing in African countries.

Africa...when will you be priced out??

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