6.5 Creedmoor for hunting

[Daisy]

Id be interesting in your results with the GameChanger tipped bullet.
Target bullets for hunting is the downfall of the Creed like Mr Glass says.

We hunt for meat so losing a large percentage of a small Springbuck is an issue.

I guess the hard part is it comes from both sides. Half say you have to wear panties to shoot it. The other side said the damage is too great!

 

[shark_za]

I stand up to pee, I shoot a 6.5x55

But the 6.5 Creedmoor can pretty much match it with good bullets.
Once the mindset of target bullets is dropped.

 

[Mauser78]

I stand up to pee, I shoot a 6.5x55

But the 6.5 Creedmoor can pretty much match it with good bullets.
Once the mindset of target bullets is dropped.

But this is a Mauser, so its creed for men LOL

 

[Mauser78]

so that sounds very cool and I would love to try it!

However. The average traveling hunter won’t experience anything like that. 99.9% won’t run out of distance with a 6.5cm.

It is something different, the shooting is nice, but overall I still have mix feelings about it, since I am used to normal walk and stalk hunting.

 

[Philip Glass]

I have to say I’ve never understood this thought process. Damage is part of what kills. I’ll sacrifice a little meat for a quick kill.

It's kinda hard to sew up those holes for a trophy mount. They are just as dead with my .300 and less damage. That is my point from years of hunting with different calibers.

 

[SaintPanzer]

To be clear, my issue with the Creedmore is not that there is anything wrong with it, it's that as a target rifle (with high BC, lighter weight bullets) it's not suitable for hunting, and as a hunting rifle with the higher weight bullets, it doesn't do anything a 6.5X55 doesn't do. So I can't wrap my mind around the marketing hype. It just strikes me as a nasty, flash, gimcrack thing that I don't need.

Full disclosure: my whitetail rifle is a 6.5X54. Now, as much as I love that rifle, it has its limitations. The 160 grain bullet is effective (on a lot of things) but its blunt nose not only means it drops quickly, but also loses velocity quickly. I "know" intellectually it can be effective on any of the Hochwild I hunted in Europe, but it does not meet the game laws in places like Germany or Poland that need 2,000 joules at 100 meters. The 140 grain bullets have a higher BC, and will do that, but I just haven't played with them enough. I'm playing with the 156 grain Oryx "just to see what I can do with it".

Honestly, I am not that recoil sensitive, so I rely on my .30-06 for most of the things the Creedmore can do. I mean, they were shooting 1,000 yard matches at Camp Perry with the '06 way before anyone thought of a Creedmore, and if that means I have to think a little more about elevation changes on the scope before firing, well, I'm not going to hunt at 1,000 yards, so why worry? Maximum Point Blank Range is a thing. As the guy said in Fast Times at Ridgemont High: "Learn it. Know it. Live it."

I've often said my ammunition choices include the .45 ACP (1911), 9X19 mm (1908), .30-06 (1906), 6.5X54 (1903) 9.5X57 (1910), and I'm starting to play with 7X57 (1892). I'm starting to consider a .300 H&H, but I'm really not sure I'm ready for anything as modern as 1925. If I'm going to get on the belted magnum bandwagon, maybe I should start with a .275 H&H Magnum first.

There's old school class for you: a traveller rifle with a .275 H&H for deerstalking, and a .375 barrel for everything else in the world. One receiver, two barrels. I need to look into that. But I think only Hawk Bullets and Woodleigh would make the appropriate .287" bullet. Maybe I'll just neck it down to .284" and call it good.

 

[Daisy]

To be clear, my issue with the Creedmore is not that there is anything wrong with it, it's that as a target rifle (with high BC, lighter weight bullets) it's not suitable for hunting, and as a hunting rifle with the higher weight bullets, it doesn't do anything a 6.5X55 doesn't do. So I can't wrap my mind around the marketing hype. It just strikes me as a nasty, flash, gimcrack thing that I don't need.

Full disclosure: my whitetail rifle is a 6.5X54. Now, as much as I love that rifle, it has its limitations. The 160 grain bullet is effective (on a lot of things) but its blunt nose not only means it drops quickly, but also loses velocity quickly. I "know" intellectually it can be effective on any of the Hochwild I hunted in Europe, but it does not meet the game laws in places like Germany or Poland that need 2,000 joules at 100 meters. The 140 grain bullets have a higher BC, and will do that, but I just haven't played with them enough. I'm playing with the 156 grain Oryx "just to see what I can do with it".

Honestly, I am not that recoil sensitive, so I rely on my .30-06 for most of the things the Creedmore can do. I mean, they were shooting 1,000 yard matches at Camp Perry with the '06 way before anyone thought of a Creedmore, and if that means I have to think a little more about elevation changes on the scope before firing, well, I'm not going to hunt at 1,000 yards, so why worry? Maximum Point Blank Range is a thing. As the guy said in Fast Times at Ridgemont High: "Learn it. Know it. Live it."

I've often said my ammunition choices include the .45 ACP (1911), 9X19 mm (1908), .30-06 (1906), 6.5X54 (1903) 9.5X57 (1910), and I'm starting to play with 7X57 (1892). I'm starting to consider a .300 H&H, but I'm really not sure I'm ready for anything as modern as 1925. If I'm going to get on the belted magnum bandwagon, maybe I should start with a .275 H&H Magnum first.

There's old school class for you: a traveller rifle with a .275 H&H for deerstalking, and a .375 barrel for everything else in the world. One receiver, two barrels. I need to look into that. But I think only Hawk Bullets and Woodleigh would make the appropriate .287" bullet. Maybe I'll just neck it down to .284" and call it good.

6.5 creedmoor not suitable for hunting? Do you really believe that?

 

[C.W. Richter]

I'd use it on long-range rock hyrax in an appropriately set up gun! I'd go bigger for Impala on up. But, you'll have tracker(s)! Use heavier, more traditional hunting bullets that will work at needmore velocities (even the Hornady 160 SPs will do, but Woodleighs, Nos PTs) and keep the range more limited than the typical bigger boy rounds for PG. Not what pretty marketing stories tell you. My (3,150 fps) 264 WSM just cut the mustard IMO (using 140s-160s) on med-sized PG. Consider handloads/custom handloads. Damage is caused by high velocity (NO) and too low a bullet SD (I'd say the typ. 130ish slug is a bit light for PG. The 0.29-0.3+ SDs work best in .264" (140s-160s)-they penetrate and kill sans all the damage. I laugh when i see 120s gr 6.5 (virtually varmint SD/military but will work on thin-skinned deer) bullets sold for hunting (they make things smaller these days to spare costs, hype it up and make profits. Wake up! I believe it was initially made for an AR-10 (good idea in that case), and then re-purposed as the latest whizbang 6.5 sold like coca-cola en masse. "Use More Gun" and "Any Shot You Want" are more my creed! GL Took this giant at 300 yds and a hotter 6.5, as it was in attack formation...per Capstick, it was just a matter of when it was going to come! As I recall, the only animals "damaged" were far hides of dik-diks taken with hotter 6.5s at too close a range. (Not a big deal in the end, as the taxidermist will feature the near side on mounts. They do make solid/FMJ bullets for 6.5 and that's what I'd use for any future such occasions. We did switch to DG 375 solids for future such hunts and it worked out well! Solids are best if pelt preservation is your passion, but using proper heft bullets in the much lower V creedmore should work out ok (like a more traditional 6.5 cartridge).

 

[C.W. Richter]

Here you can see the differences amongst the range of 6.5 cartridges (and it's vast.) Primarily for longer range, but also terminal energy at any range (which translates better for larger animals.)

 

[Daisy]

Here you can see the differences amongst the range of 6.5 cartridges (and it's vast.) Primarily for longer range, but also terminal energy at any range (which translates better for larger animals.) View attachment 687124

I don’t but Into the terminal energy thing. But even if you did you didn’t include increased recoil with heavier bullet and increased case capacity.

 

[SaintPanzer]

6.5 creedmoor not suitable for hunting? Do you really believe that?

That's not what I said. What I said was: "as a target rifle (with high BC, lighter weight bullets) it's not suitable for hunting, and as a hunting rifle with the higher weight bullets, it doesn't do anything a 6.5X55 doesn't do."

In other words, THIS bullet is not suitable for hunting:

6.5 Creedmoor 120 gr ELD® Match - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

...

www.hornady.com

This bullet is a 129 grain bullet, and yes, it's suitable for whitetail:

6.5 Creedmoor 129 gr. InterLock® American Whitetail® - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

...

www.hornady.com

For those who do not want to click on the link, it's a 129 grain pill leaving the muzzle at 2820 fps, and still moving at 2232 fps at 300 yards.

Hornady doesn't sell a 140 grain Creedmore, except as a custom. I'm picking on Hornady to keep things comparable.

THIS bullet https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/rifle/6-5-x-55-swedish-mauser-140-gr-sst-superformance#!/
Leaves the muzzle at 2735 fps, and is moving at 2237 at 300 yards.

 

[Daisy]

That's not what I said. What I said was: "as a target rifle (with high BC, lighter weight bullets) it's not suitable for hunting, and as a hunting rifle with the higher weight bullets, it doesn't do anything a 6.5X55 doesn't do."

In other words, THIS bullet is not suitable for hunting:

6.5 Creedmoor 120 gr ELD® Match - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

...

www.hornady.com

This bullet is a 129 grain bullet, and yes, it's suitable for whitetail:

6.5 Creedmoor 129 gr. InterLock® American Whitetail® - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

...

www.hornady.com

For those who do not want to click on the link, it's a 129 grain pill leaving the muzzle at 2820 fps, and still moving at 2232 fps at 300 yards.

Hornady doesn't sell a 140 grain Creedmore, except as a custom. I'm picking on Hornady to keep things comparable.

THIS bullet https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/rifle/6-5-x-55-swedish-mauser-140-gr-sst-superformance#!/
Leavesi the muzzle at 2735 fps, and is moving at 2237 at 300 yards.

I personally like a heavier bullet, but that 120 eldm would do what @Philip Glass was speaking of earlier…..blow too big of a hole in your deer.

 

[Safari Dave]

There is nothing wrong with the cartridge, even though I would like to "make light of it," because of it's
stupid rise to royalty in the "hook & bullet" press.

Long before it ever came along, there was the 6.5 x55 Swedish, .264 Winchester Magnum, 6.5 Carcano, and the .260 Remington.

For some reason that I can't understand, the 6.5 "manbun" won the 6.5mm race, and it seems to be here to stay.

IMO, in Hornady factory loadings.

For large animals - use 143 g ELM-X
For smaller animals - use 140g ELD-M

 

[Russ16]

I love the 6.5x55 and other classic cartridges. I’ve also read and listened to a lot about the creedmore. It seems there is some science in the case design that lets it be a tad more efficient and more importantly easier to build accurate rifles for.

All the things that people liked about the other 6.5 family can be applied to the creedmore. Combine that with accurate rifles that are readily available lead to its popularity I believe.

 

[Mauser78]

There is nothing wrong with the cartridge, even though I would like to "make light of it," because of it's
stupid rise to royalty in the "hook & bullet" press.

Long before it ever came along, there was the 6.5 x55 Swedish, .264 Winchester Magnum, 6.5 Carcano, and the .260 Remington.

For some reason that I can't understand, the 6.5 "manbun" won the 6.5mm race, and it seems to be here to stay.

IMO, in Hornady factory loadings.

For large animals - use 143 g ELM-X
For smaller animals - use 140g ELD-M

Even the EldX at shorter ranges acts tike a ballistic tip. It might work for its intended use = Extreme long distance, but I haven't seen that, at ranges under 300yards it doesn't hold up.

 

[Daisy]

Even the EldX at shorter ranges acts tike a ballistic tip. It might work for its intended use = Extreme long distance, but I haven't seen that, at ranges under 300yards it doesn't hold up.

I don’t want my bullets to hold up on non dangerous game. I want them to shatter and explode. But that’s just me.

 

[Russ16]

Even the EldX at shorter ranges acts tike a ballistic tip. It might work for its intended use = Extreme long distance, but I haven't seen that, at ranges under 300yards it doesn't hold up.

All about matching to the game. The ballistic tip in a 30-06 is my all time favorite Texas whitetail bullet.

 

[375Fox]

I don’t want my bullets to hold up on non dangerous game. I want them to shatter and explode. But that’s just me.

That philosophy might work well on deer, but it will cause some long days on large PG such as zebra, kudu, blue wildebeest especially if not fully broadside in the open.

 

[C.W. Richter]

I don’t but Into the terminal energy thing. But even if you did you didn’t include increased recoil with heavier bullet and increased case capacity.

look at the E chart attached above (it's >1,000 ft/lbs of Energy more at the muzzle). Indisputable. And, it's a 6.5 for God's sake (130-160 gr bullets.) We're not talking big boy .338 or DG gun here. They are a PLEASURE to shoot. IF recoil bothers you, get a larger/larger surface area pad, make the gun heavier (Hg reducers, all steel mounts, bipod, full mag/cartridges on sling or stock, quality big scope, etc.) I use a brake on the long range shooters simply to be more accurate (put everything in your/terminal performance favor) for those shots, but it's not absolutely necessary from a felt recoil perspective. Needmore is DONE at 400 yds. Bigger cased 6.5 chart below (You should ideally have 1,800+ fps and 1,000 ft-lbs to cleanly kill an animal-perhaps more with respect to more heavily constructed African PG.) Just look at the differences!

As you can clearly see, the big boy case extends the range of the gun nearly 3x. While I don't advocate taking 1,100 yd shots (on game other than varmints), we are quite capable (with properly constructed/set-up gun w/ handloads or TOP quality $100/box ammo. Also bear in-mind this is with factory Hdy bullets. Bergers would perform even better and the numbers would increase and extend the range. Simply put, a true magnum 6.5 has the same energy (and similar drop) of the needmore does at its muzzle, at 600 yds! We've made some spectacular shots w/ the 6.5 WSM and 6.5-300 Wby (up to 760 yds in TX on Aoudad) where I'd not be comfy using the creedmore much beyond 1/3 that distance. You'd probably see a little better performance (ballistically and terminally) by using the 140s and up (and limiting the range, esp. in Africa.) The beauty in the 6.5 is its ballistics (on par with the 338), and the creedmore simply doesn't capitalize upon that. It's a widget with limitations profitably sold to the masses. Even the PRC or RPM is a substantial upgrade, with insignificant add'l. recoil. GL Enjoy! -Just a few more things the MSM doesn't tell you

 

[Daisy]

That philosophy might work well on deer, but it will cause some long days on large PG such as zebra, kudu, blue wildebeest especially if not fully broadside in the open.

It didn’t with my elk with 140gr from 6.5. Also didn’t with my kudu or gemsbuk or Wildebeast with a federal fusion, but I was using a 308.

It’s just a difference of how I look at what ammo to use. No big deal. I know i am in the minority here.