Plains Game Magnum?

[Timbo]

Perhaps it's a part of the nostalgia of hunting Africa, or that I like stalking in close just as much as placing the shot, but IMHO for PG I'm on the side of using those standard classic calibres which have stood the acid test of time: having the range and authority to do the job over the decades as they still do today. So depending on what PG I'm after, I'd use either my .30/06 (with Woodleigh 180gr PPSNs) or my 9.3x62 (with Woodleigh 286gr RNSN). Both have taken game up to and including buffalo (water and cape respectively) without fuss.

I appreciate those who prefer Magnum calibres, and why - such as hunting game which inhabits wide open, flat, grasslands or prairies - where it's nigh on impossible to close the range. But even if I was faced with such a hunting proposition, I'd still opt for my '06 with maybe a 150 or 165gr bullet, and put in some practice with it, at range, beforehand.

 

[RayAtkinson]

Depends where your hunting PG, In some areas its not too uncommon to run into a Lion, Buffalo Hippo or elephant, and your packing a 243 or even a 30-06, I have had that happen and a buff or lion iwth a snare on its leg is damn hard to kill full of adrenaline....Id suggest a .338 or 9.3x62 at least and a 375 wouldn't hurt my feelings....Thats the africa I know and love...In parts of Africa any deer rifle will get PG. I like a 7x57 or 30-06..

Im not fond of head shots, it easy to misjudge or slip a shot and break a jaw, a neck shot can easily miss the jugular or the spinal cord and back bone by being off an inch..Good way to waste a trophy fee IMO..I have used both on cull hunts and so far so good but I get close and use a rest of some sort, still don't care for it..

 

[Philip Glass]

So you say don't take a 270 but then give advise on a 308 Win. ?????????

Never take a .270.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

@phillips Glass.
I agree leave the 270. A 308 properly loaded will handle 99% of plains game with ease

 

[chonk34]

I took a .338 WM and had pretty good success. My dad took a 7mm RM and also had good success. We both used Barnes ammunition. The animals I shot tended to leave plenty of blood, and some of the smaller animals really got torn apart by the bullets. My dad's bullets tended to punch right through without a lot of blood. Everything he shot died in short order due to shot placement, but we surmised that a tracking situation would be more difficult with his gun than with mine. I added a slip-on recoil pad to the .338 as it kicked a bit too much in its natural state, leading me to flinch. No such problems with it after I added the Limb Saver.

 

[WAB]

I’ve not found the 7x57 wanting on PG up to and including zebra, wildebeest and kudu. Unless you are shooting at very long distances, I really don’t see the point of a magnum. If I’m worried about big nasties in the area, I carry a bigger rifle. In my case that’s a 9.3x62, .375 H&H or .458 Lott.

 

[Fastrig]

I’ve not found the 7x57 wanting on PG up to and including zebra, wildebeest and kudu. Unless you are shooting at very long distances, I really don’t see the point of a magnum. If I’m worried about big nasties in the area, I carry a bigger rifle. In my case that’s a 9.3x62, .375 H&H or .458 Lott.

9.3x62 paired with a 7x57 or 7x64 I think should pretty much take care of just about all the Africa and North American critters, with or without claws, no magnum needed. I do like my 300 win mag a lot, but it’s a toss up between it and my 9.3x62 as to which is my favorite. I’m looking for a 7x64 barrel for my Merkel to pair with the 9.3x62 barrel in a two barrel/scope travel case. Figure if that pair, with quality ammo, can’t drop what I’m hunting, it’s the shooter‘s problem. For a magnum pairing I’d go 300 WM and 375 H&H for the same reason, unfortunately Merkel doesn’t make a 375 H&H for the Helix (which I don’t understand).

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

9.3x62 paired with a 7x57 or 7x64 I think should pretty much take care of just about all the Africa and North American critters, with or without claws, no magnum needed. I do like my 300 win mag a lot, but it’s a toss up between it and my 9.3x62 as to which is my favorite. I’m looking for a 7x64 barrel for my Merkel to pair with the 9.3x62 barrel in a two barrel/scope travel case. Figure if that pair, with quality ammo, can’t drop what I’m hunting, it’s the shooter‘s problem. For a magnum pairing I’d go 300 WM and 375 H&H for the same reason, unfortunately Merkel doesn’t make a 375 H&H for the Helix (which I don’t understand).

@Fastrig
@Skinnersblade
Mate that's why I have trimmed to my custom rifles.
The lowall in 22K Hornet covers the little critters
My 25 covers most other game
And the 35 Whelen covers every I want to hunt.
All fit like a pair of old comfortable slippers and all sub MOA. Don't need any more. Took me 30 years to work it out tho and I had fun in the meantime working out what I didn't want or need.
Bob

 

[C.W. Richter]

I think PG is a wide open generalization. dik-dik or Lord Derby Eland? Mtn. Nyala at 600 yds? A hot 6.5/7/30 for Small stuff, a hot 338, 358, 9.3 or 375 for Med-Big stuff (PG.) .22 WMR might be best for the pygmy antelope (in restrospect,) although they recommend FMJs or solids for "preservation of the far side." Using heavy-for-caliber high SD bullets on the Med-Lg stuff is always a good idea no matter what caliber/cartridge you select. Really liking the 7x57 AI these days (which is nearly on-par w/ a 7 mag, and you can use std 757 ammo in a pinch) and .338 A-Sq for the larger stuff (but have used a .375 for such in the past.) You'll find that your .375 or .416 immediately becomes your favorite caliber when you run into a 750 lb 72" kudu or 2,400 lb monster blue bull eland while buffalo or elephant hunting!

 

[C.W. Richter]

Update, i went to South Africa January 2020. I hired a 7mmRM as i had never used one. A Sako with a Swarovski scope.
10 one shot kills including 2 Kudu
I sold that Ruger somewhere along the way, a mk1 tang safety. Howl me down.
I recently got a secondhand Tikka in .300wm walnut stock. Kicked the snot out me over the bench sighting in with original T3 recoil pad. I put my laminate stock with a limbsaver on and that took the sting out of it.
Hoping to hunt next with it week. Well i will at least get a walk in.

What bullet type/weight were you shooting? That's most important. 160 gr.?

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I think PG is a wide open generalization. dik-dik or Lord Derby Eland? Mtn. Nyala at 600 yds? A hot 6.5/7/30 for Small stuff, a hot 338, 358, 9.3 or 375 for Med-Big stuff (PG.) .22 WMR might be best for the pygmy antelope (in restrospect,) although they recommend FMJs or solids for "preservation of the far side." Using heavy-for-caliber high SD bullets on the Med-Lg stuff is always a good idea no matter what caliber/cartridge you select. Really liking the 7x57 AI these days (which is nearly on-par w/ a 7 mag, and you can use std 757 ammo in a pinch) and .338 A-Sq for the larger stuff (but have used a .375 for such in the past.) You'll find that your .375 or .416 immediately becomes your favorite caliber when you run into a 750 lb 72" kudu or 2,400 lb monster blue bull eland while buffalo or elephant hunting!

@ C. W. RICHTER
Man If'n any one ran into a 750lb 72 inch Kudu they would be the envy of the every hunter or PH.
I told my phone I would like a 60 inch Kudu. He laughed and said so would he. He also told me if we found one that big I could shoot it for free.
Bob

 

[C.W. Richter]

Once upon a time, the area between what is now the BVC and Beitbridge, Zim used to be referred to as Kuduland (or Greater Kuduland). My opinion was all the great chow they had eating at the citrus plantations and other farms and/or living to old age-and I saw Monsters (even spooked one into the sunset walking with my back against a cliff next to the PH-I moved forward ever so slowly to peer at what he was looking at down below the Kopje from us and 60-some inches of V-Perfection lived another day!) 'Have additionally seen some monsters taken in C.-S. Namibia. 'Had to settle for 54" after the above issue in '07, (even found similarly-sized pick-up heads) but always looking!!! We ran into a bachelor group in the Caprivi (2019) with a big one but never caught up (I think they swam across the Zambezi to safety in Zambia!)

 

[Cam Moon]

@Graham Hunter I'm wondering the same thing as you regarding @Divernhunter , @Philip Glass , and @Bob Nelson 35Whelen and them saying that a .270 isn't good, but a .308 is just fine.
I don't get it, but they (at least one of them seems quite knowledgeable from my experience) might know something that we don't. I actually really quite like the .270.

 

[CBH Australia]

What bullet type/weight were you shooting? That's most important. 160 gr.?

They were Hornady SST. His reloads, not sure on bullet weight .
I have 180gn sst that I will be using in my .300wm, I got them cheap and they have been sitting in the cupboard for ages. It’s time to hunt more.

@Graham Hunter I'm wondering the same thing as you regarding @Divernhunter , @Philip Glass , and @Bob Nelson 35Whelen and them saying that a .270 isn't good, but a .308 is just fine.
I don't get it, but they (at least one of them seems quite knowledgeable from my experience) might know something that we don't. I actually really quite like the .270.

View attachment 367501View attachment 367502

They are taking the piss or pulling your leg. I doubt any of them are serious .270 haters.
It is a time honoured cartridge that is known on many continents.
It’s highly regarded in Australia but the .308 would be more common and that has made it more popular for availability and economy in terms of ammo pricing.

Now which of those thre fellas is “The Knowledgeable One” ???

 

[CBH Australia]

@Cam Moon
That shows a lot of detail and is interesting. I don’t have a chronograph or ballistics program but I am a reloader and I enjoy comparing the specifications.

I read a really good article once called “Zero at 25” it was interesting in that when they crunched the numbers and wrote it up the difference in trajectory’s and performance were not that far apart generally speaking. The way they presented their findings was showing that cartridges like .30-30 and 7.62x39 are not so much the “Rainbow Trajectory” that many might think.

Yes obvious differences as shown in your table but for an average hunter at average ranges a half inch variance in drop at 300 might not matter to a person who is not calculating precisely or adjusting elevation with an adjustable scope to put it dead on at a known or measured distance.

I just found it interesting. My .308 is hitting 2” high at 100, that should be about right at 200 and drops off after 230, generally speaking based on information I have read/heard. That might work for just hunting and get us by under most conditions,
Long range hunting is becoming a thing and for precise shots at 500+ then all of the variables need to be considered for that specific cartridge/components and game. Shot placement is crucial but many cartridges are capable out to 200 for a competent shooter.
I have never owned a .270 and always had a view that 7mm-08 was versatile. There are many here who would promote 7x57 or 7x64. I would consider a 7x64 if I wanted something else.
The 7mm-08 has some slight ballistic advantage over .308 I think and you show the .270 to do the same. 140gn in my 7mm-08 has worked well on pigs but .308 might Ben the most common used on pigs in Australia with many shooters using them everyday on pigs in Australia including the professionals or government agency shooters.

 

[bruce moulds]

They were Hornady SST. His reloads, not sure on bullet weight .
I have 180gn sst that I will be using in my .300wm, I got them cheap and they have been sitting in the cupboard for ages. It’s time to hunt more.

They are taking the piss or pulling your leg. I doubt any of them are serious .270 haters.
It is a time honoured cartridge that is known on many continents.
It’s highly regarded in Australia but the .308 would be more common and that has made it more popular for availability and economy in terms of ammo pricing.

Now which of those thre fellas is “The Knowledgeable One” ???

no question.
Bob.
bruce.

 

[Fastrig]

@Cam Moon
That shows a lot of detail and is interesting. I don’t have a chronograph or ballistics program but I am a reloader and I enjoy comparing the specifications.

I read a really good article once called “Zero at 25” it was interesting in that when they crunched the numbers and wrote it up the difference in trajectory’s and performance were not that far apart generally speaking. The way they presented their findings was showing that cartridges like .30-30 and 7.62x39 are not so much the “Rainbow Trajectory” that many might think.

Yes obvious differences as shown in your table but for an average hunter at average ranges a half inch variance in drop at 300 might not matter to a person who is not calculating precisely or adjusting elevation with an adjustable scope to put it dead on at a known or measured distance.

I just found it interesting. My .308 is hitting 2” high at 100, that should be about right at 200 and drops off after 230, generally speaking based on information I have read/heard. That might work for just hunting and get us by under most conditions,
Long range hunting is becoming a thing and for precise shots at 500+ then all of the variables need to be considered for that specific cartridge/components and game. Shot placement is crucial but many cartridges are capable out to 200 for a competent shooter.
I have never owned a .270 and always had a view that 7mm-08 was versatile. There are many here who would promote 7x57 or 7x64. I would consider a 7x64 if I wanted something else.
The 7mm-08 has some slight ballistic advantage over .308 I think and you show the .270 to do the same. 140gn in my 7mm-08 has worked well on pigs but .308 might Ben the most common used on pigs in Australia with many shooters using them everyday on pigs in Australia including the professionals or government agency shooters.

Try out a 338 Federal....what the 308 grows up to be Love the 308 but the 338 takes things to the next level without having to go with a magnum. The 7x64 will pretty much match the 7mm rem mag out to 400 or so, which is why I’m looking for a barrel for my Merkel in it.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

@Graham Hunter I'm wondering the same thing as you regarding @Divernhunter , @Philip Glass , and @Bob Nelson 35Whelen and them saying that a .270 isn't good, but a .308 is just fine.
I don't get it, but they (at least one of them seems quite knowledgeable from my experience) might know something that we don't. I actually really quite like the .270.
View attachment 367501View attachment 367502

@Cam Moon.
Comparing the 270 with a 150grain and a 308 with a 150 grain is like comparing a 243 to a 25 ought six. Not really a valid experience.
The 270 has more powder capacity and is capable of driving the bullet faster. Load the same weights in the 270 and the ought six then the ought six at 3000fps wins.
Out to 300 yards there isn't enough difference on game to worry about. Once you get to 400 yards the 270 is ahead of the 08, it shoots flatter and hits harder at that range. In reality how many of us actually shoot game past 250 to 300 yards. In over 40 years of hunting I could honestly say there would only have been half a dozen times I've shot game at 300 yards and beyond. Most have been less than 200 yards. Varmiting is a different story it gloves off to see how far I can hit them, especially cats.
The 270 is good but in OZ the 08 is more popular.
Bob

 

[Fastrig]

@Cam Moon.
Comparing the 270 with a 150grain and a 308 with a 150 grain is like comparing a 243 to a 25 ought six. Not really a valid experience.
The 270 has more powder capacity and is capable of driving the bullet faster. Load the same weights in the 270 and the ought six then the ought six at 3000fps wins.
Out to 300 yards there isn't enough difference on game to worry about. Once you get to 400 yards the 270 is ahead of the 08, it shoots flatter and hits harder at that range. In reality how many of us actually shoot game past 250 to 300 yards. In over 40 years of hunting I could honestly say there would only have been half a dozen times I've shot game at 300 yards and beyond. Most have been less than 200 yards. Varmiting is a different story it gloves off to see how far I can hit them, especially cats.
The 270 is good but in OZ the 08 is more popular.
Bob

Prefer 180 grain rounds in the 308 (same in the 300 win mag). Heavy for caliber but I don’t shoot past 250 with a 308 so don’t really worry about it. 180 grain ammo hits really hard inside 250 and things don’t normally move again once they do. With a 300 win mag, the 180 grains are flat smoking, group very well, and hold the wind better than the other weights I’ve tried.

 

[colorado]

If you misunderstood my meaning was that if I had nice timber .375H&H I would not want to take it to Alaska, not if I could justify an all weather rifle. I know the chambering is a classic and the cartridges can be found there from reading.
Is use a .308 a lot, l like my 7mm-08 it rolls pigs easy they are fairly close in comparison but I can’t load a heavy projectile in the .308 if need.

If I ask the question what is the perfect cartridge or the ideal I will get varying answers. I have a .458wm timber stock. I don’t need it for what I do but I got a deal on it New at the time. I wanted a safari rifle in the safe. In hindsight I’d prefer a .375H&H, it may be more versatile for me. I see one advertised. It could easy be the one rifle I need for Africa

I work remote so I have time to research

If I Head to Africa to cull plains game I may only have one rifle, and I’m not oppposed to getting it before I go. I know I can group with my .300wm but I probably want to restock it or change to another flat Shooting magnum.

I generally shoot within 200m. I shot targets at a measured 400 with direction on holdover.

I usually head shoot for pest management if I can take the shot. Average size pigs drop to a chest shot if required. Most animals drop to a well placed shot from a .223 but I’m not using that.

The .338wm is well priced but I sort of believe that the smaller 2 may get more use and even use on Dingoes past 200m when I’m is that area .

Just looking for others thoughts and experience.

Here's a Rem XCR II (Synthetic stock and TriNyte coated) in 375 Weatherby with a 24" barrel (that started out as a 375 H&H). Weighs 7 1/2 lbs with Tally steel QR rings, and Leupold 2x7 firedot scope. Spent 6 days in the rain on a September brown bear hunt in Upper Togiak lake. Only rust at the end was exterior part of the bolt striker (not sure why that wasn't coated). It did just fine.