How safe are safteys?

Gsxrmike

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Never put absolute trust in any safety. Years ago I was practicing cycling a Model 70 I was planning to take to Africa. I was at home using snap caps.
I flipped off the three position safety and I heard the firing pin drop. Scariest snap I ever heard. I tried it numerous times and about once out of every 6 tries it would “fire”. I took it to a gunsmith to get the safety replaced. Always make sure the gun is pointed in a safe direction when you disengage a safety.
 

CBH Australia

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A4B35D06-FA52-4ED7-8D2F-9F1AB6D8E756.jpeg
I caught this Double Rifle safety demonstration by a PH in a recent video uploaded to AH.



View attachment 337415
 

Opposite Pole

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This is why I really like the Blaser and Krieghoff systems of decocking.
Not sure if there are other companies making a similar system on a double rifle.
Probably why the Blaser S2 and K-double guns command the price they do as well.

What is interesting is that there are several Kiplauff rifles available with a similar system.
They are available from Merkel (K5), Haenel (Jaeger 9) and I'm sure a few others.
Wonder why they don't offer this on a double.

Some other break action single shots with decocker are Krieghoff Hubertus, Blaser K95, and all of the gorgeous Johann Fanzoj ones. I’m sure there are more. The design is beginning to be used by other manufacturers too, Steyr uses it for bolt action now as well.

I can’t bring myself to trust a safety. It’s a mechanical feature and mechanisms fail sometimes. I have witnessed a gun go off when the safety was being switched off with a finger well outside the trigger guard. It was at the range with the rifle resting on a sand bag and pointing towards the targets. Other safety rules were followed and no one was hurt. Except the rifle owner that is, he got absolutely terrified. I mean he was unable to shoot anymore that day his hands were shaking so much. So shocking was the experience to him he now only chambers a round when he’s about to fire and preaches to everyone to do the same. Granted we do not deal with DG here.

I carry my O/U shotgun broken and slam it shut when about to fire. I have missed a pheasant once because of it. I think it’s a worthwhile trade off knowing I won’t hurt someone.

Once the primer ignites things cannot be stopped. As mentioned before in this thread and number of others, the real safety is in between the shooter’s ears.
 

BeeMaa

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Some other break action single shots with decocker are Krieghoff Hubertus, Blaser K95, and all of the gorgeous Johann Fanzoj ones. I’m sure there are more. The design is beginning to be used by other manufacturers too, Steyr uses it for bolt action now as well.

I can’t bring myself to trust a safety. It’s a mechanical feature and mechanisms fail sometimes. I have witnessed a gun go off when the safety was being switched off with a finger well outside the trigger guard. It was at the range with the rifle resting on a sand bag and pointing towards the targets. Other safety rules were followed and no one was hurt. Except the rifle owner that is, he got absolutely terrified. I mean he was unable to shoot anymore that day his hands were shaking so much. So shocking was the experience to him he now only chambers a round when he’s about to fire and preaches to everyone to do the same. Granted we do not deal with DG here.

I carry my O/U shotgun broken and slam it shut when about to fire. I have missed a pheasant once because of it. I think it’s a worthwhile trade off knowing I won’t hurt someone.

Once the primer ignites things cannot be stopped. As mentioned before in this thread and number of others, the real safety is in between the shooter’s ears.
I knew about the Blaser K95 and Krieghoff Hubertus.
Only reason I left them out is the OP said "all makes except Keighoff and Blaser..."
Been lusting after a K95 for quite a while.

I understand that rifles are mechanical and mechanical parts do fail.
However when uncocking the Blaser rifle, you can feel the spring decompress.
I feel confident carrying the rifle with the chamber loaded and decocked.
 

bruce moulds

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there seem to be different safety rules by some in some parts of Africa.
pictures abound of guys standing with the butt on the ground and 1 or 2 hands on the muzzle(s).
pictures and videos of muzzles swinging or pointing at people with no apparent concern by either party.
this includes innocent trackers!
what other workplace would allow such disregard for worker safety?
a lot of the unawareness of muzzle pointing equates to the over the shoulder muzzle forward carry.
if you are the guy in front, not so much an issue.
when a gun does off, it is a fraction of a second thing, and the result can be awfully permanent, even if it does not result in death.
you cannot un do it.
the pictures we see of such transgressions of basic safety seem to reinforce in some minds that safety does not REALLY matter.
being safe is a responsibility that goes with firearms handling, and does not detract from the experience in any way.
there is no room in this job for playing with yourself.
most responsible shooters avoid being with those who are not, and there is no 1/2 way in safety.
safety is the crux of the matter, but this comes from respect for others in many ways.
bruce.
 

Bearbait1

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I thought it was just customary to point your rifle at others while hunting in Africa. Watching African hunting shows they don’t go 5 minutes without someone pointing their rifle at someone else.
 

Bearbait1

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As a teenager I was hunting quail with a sxs 20ga and after shooting and reloading I closed the action and 1 barrel fired. My dad was sure I must have hit the trigger so he tried it and the same thing happened. One of the firing pins was stuck in the fire position so it would automatically fire when the action was closed.
 

Opposite Pole

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I understand that rifles are mechanical and mechanical parts do fail.
However when uncocking the Blaser rifle, you can feel the spring decompress.
I feel confident carrying the rifle with the chamber loaded and decocked.

Yes but the Blaser design is not a safety but a decocker. I typically carry my R8 with a round chambered as I do my Krieghoff double. Both are safe as they are not cocked. I still follow usual safety rules and avoid pointing the gun at anyone. The safety of my other firearms however, I do not trust. This is just my opinion on the matter. Perhaps this is all in my head but even with handguns I comfortably carry my P229 round chambered and hammer down, but couldn’t bring myself to carry a G19 with a chambered round and ended up selling it.


Been lusting after a K95 for quite a while.

Good to know it’s not just me ;-]
 

IvW

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I thought it was just customary to point your rifle at others while hunting in Africa. Watching African hunting shows they don’t go 5 minutes without someone pointing their rifle at someone else.

Not with me they wont...loaded or not...
 

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Hmmm surprised I am the first one to address this but here goes. I don't trust safeties on most guns, but there are exceptions. Here is a gunsmith perspective

The vast majority of safeties are simply devices that keep the trigger from being pulled. Included in this list are most (but not all) boxlock rifles and shotguns, most bolt action rifles and the occasional sidelock shotgun.

Most sidelock shotguns and rifles have not only the trigger blocking mechanism but also a hammer blocking mechanism often called an "intercepting sear". On a typical SxS the "safety" that you work with your thumb simply slides a block over the trigger to prevent an accidental pull. Internally there is a "hammer block" that prevents the hammer from hitting the firing pin unless the trigger is pulled simultaneously. Always an exception. I have two FAMARS Castore sidelock hammer guns and neither has the "intercepting sear". I also have a very high grade Francotte sideplated boxlock that has intercepting sears.

The only thing that keeps the hammer from falling on any gun is the contact between the sear and the hammer. This contact point is no thicker than you thumbnails. So just imagine that your nails are pressing the edges against each other, you move one and it loses contact and bang. If you drop the gun there is nothing (on most guns) to keep the sear from disengaging and allowing the hammer to fall.

So for me a trigger block is only slightly more effective than the trigger guard. An intercepting sear is a real safety device.

Still carry my guns open until needed. Many don't have a "thumb safety". I shoot mostly damascus hammer guns.

Bill
 

IvW

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IvW

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Only real safety devise is between your ears......
You point any firearm loaded unloaded on safe irrespective of what safety it is you will have it from my side paying client or not.....
 

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