Critique my rifle choice (s)? Looking for experienced advice?

graybird

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You could look at building a 9.3x62 or 375 H&H as your small rifle and I would look at either the 404 Jeffery or 416 Rigby as my large rifle.

If you're thinking of going the Remington action route, just have the Sako extractor installed.
 

sestoppelman

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To my mind, the .375 will never qualify as a small rifle! Even the 9.3 is really a little much to be so. Small rifle would be something in the 7x57 to 300 Win mag. The .375 really is best considered as the one rifle candidate. If it goes, everything else stays home if there is any DG on the list. If not, take the light rifle. Or the light and heavy.
 

enysse

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To my mind, the .375 will never qualify as a small rifle! Even the 9.3 is really a little much to be so. Small rifle would be something in the 7x57 to 300 Win mag. The .375 really is best considered as the one rifle candidate. If it goes, everything else stays home if there is any DG on the list. If not, take the light rifle. Or the light and heavy.

I would have to agree 100 percent.

But if someone wanted to bring as their smallest gun the 375 H&H, because they are going on a dangerous game hunt and wanted bring 2 guns then it might make sense.
 

graybird

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If I were planning on hunting in country with critters that could bite and stomp me to death, I would ensure my "light" PG rifle could get my hind end out of a pickle should one of the above said animals typically referred to as DG decide to wanna dance. :cool:
 

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Hi again IronCowboy,

The reason I mentioned the Ruger 77 Magnum is because these past couple years, I have noticed several of them for sale, 2nd hand at gun shows.

Two of my friends own a total of 3 of same and are very happy with them.

One guy has a .375 and a .458 Lott, the other just has the .375 version and no other.

They look like reasonably well made controlled round feed rifles and although I have not fired theirs, they both say that they (all 3 rifles) are quite accurate.

I just thought I'd suggest that you could re-work an existing rifle, as a way to have a semi-custom safari rifle, without spending a large fortune building a custom rifle from scratch.

Upgrading used rifles has worked well for me.

Cheers,
Velo Dog
 

Norwegianwoods

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Yes I am height challenged and not especially long arms. All of the scopes on my rifles are set with forward bell not far from the edge of the ring.

Try to take off the recoil pad of one of your guns and see if the length of pull fits you better then.

If I were planning on hunting in country with critters that could bite and stomp me to death, I would ensure my "light" PG rifle could get my hind end out of a pickle should one of the above said animals typically referred to as DG decide to wanna dance. :cool:

I was only armed with a 30-06 when me and my unarmed PH met some buffs at 30-40 meters in some thick bush when I hunted PGs in 2011.
It was a fun experience and I didn't feel being in danger at all while we slowly walked away from them.
 

baugust

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This Extract from Northwest Magnum sums up the .460 debate..... I would say!


460 Weatherby Magnum

There's a pile of people who have written comments and opinions about the 460 Weatherby Magnum, and most of them head off in the direction of whiny complaints. Too powerful. Too loud. Too much recoil. African guides don't like them. Blah, blah, blah. My thoughts are that the vast majority of the writers have never seen, let alone fired, a 460. I also suspect that there have been at least a few amateur hunters who have gone to Africa with one, only to flame out when they needed to perform. A powerful rifle can't make up the differential gap between totally unprepared and fully capable. Unprepared wannabe hunters should stay home and watch football on television.

Let's set the record straight... A lot of other very powerful rifles weigh as much or more than a 460 Weatherby. The 460 moves 450- to 600-grain .458" bullets much faster than any other commercial rifle; or, when loaded down, moves them at a somewhat reduced speed at significantly lower pressure. Read the loading books and you'll see that a 460 can easily be loaded to the level of performance of a 458 Lott. Even more, the 460 is a very accurate cartridge. So far, what's not to like?

As far as recoil goes, it's way too much without the muzzle brake. Leave it on. As for the noise, well-heeled professional hunters should be fitted with appropriate hearing enhancement-and-protection devices, as should the hunter. In actual testing using three decibel-measuring instruments located at increasing distances, we confirmed that rifles with muzzle brakes are appreciably louder to the shooter, but are not necessarily louder in all circumstances. At distances of 50 to 100 feet, depending on the rifle, the intensity of the report had moderated to about the same level as the rifle without the brake in place. It's very much a matter of the direction and/or diffusion of the blast. In any event, hearing protection should always be used when you're near guns being fired. Think about it; how much is your hearing, and the lack of permanent ringing, worth to you? When rafting white water, wear a life jacket. When driving your car, wear your seatbelt. When shooting or being near shooting, wear hearing protection. How difficult is all of this to understand?

The 460 is not an uncontrollable monster. There are almost always some videos on YouTube that show them being shot. Take a look; I think you'll see that it's no big deal. The big deal is the outstanding power and accuracy at a very reasonable price.

Since my first one in 1968, I have owned eight 460 Weatherby Magnum rifles built by Weatherby. I still have three of them, including a beautiful AAA+ French walnut stocked Safari Custom. Good loads shoot three shots in about an inch. Try that with any $50,000 double rifle. They're incredible! Friends and acquaintances love to shoot one so they can say they've shot the world's most powerful rifle. Some might argue today that it still holds that distinction, but it remains the general perception to the majority.

A couple of years ago, I saw a non-commercial video of a Cape buffalo hunt in Africa. The PH (professional hunter) was clearly not pleased that his client was carrying a 460 Weatherby. It was a Mark V DGR (black synthetic stock)) that already had the muzzle brake removed at the PH's request. The hunt for the renegade bull ended when it unexpectedly charged out of some brush at the left. The hunter swung the 460 and popped him. That was it. The bull went down in a heap right there, and took just a brief moment to finish dying. I was surprised at how hard it was hit, but don't know what bullet was used. The successful outcome didn't make the PH any happier. Worse, I think. Maybe the hunter should have hit the bull with the 300-grain bullet of a 375 H&H, followed by a few people being run over. It's interesting... Take a 300-grain bullet and drive it at 2550 fps. That's okay. Even driving a .416-inch diameter bullet at 2550 is okay. The not okay starts with a .458-inch bullet being driven at 2550 fps. I wish someone would explain this to me.

You hear stories about several shots being needed on some Cape buffalo. It has happened with most any of the buffalo-capable cartridges; 470 N.E., 500 N.E., 505 Gibbs, 577 N.E., 458 Lott, 375 H&H, 416 Whatever, and so on. It's best to have that first shot hit the right spot, because the adrenaline in a Cape buffalo goes from zero to sixty in about one second.

Some writers say that bullets can't stand up to the velocity of the 460 Weatherby. Maybe some can't, but I don't believe this of the better choices. For example, pay attention to what Hornady has done with their dangerous game bullets to make them even more reliable. Besides, the "too fast" argument doesn't hold up if it doesn't also apply to the 375s and 416s. Those who believe the "too fast" argument can either load down a little or back up a hundred yards. Mostly, I think there's a lot of discussion because people like controversy. The 7mm Mauser fan might complain about the 7mm Remington Magnum. "All that power and velocity isn't necessary!" It's garbage. If somebody wants a 460, that's their choice. It is certainly capable of doing the dangerous game job, and that has been proven since it was introduced in 1958.

I bet not too many people with a 460 Weatherby drive a minivan.

JDC

.
Northwest Magnum.com
 

Norwegianwoods

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The abomination called a muzzle brake, will never come close to any gun I will own.
 

enysse

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The author forget to mention all the foot pounds of energy being generated and the related recoil. All he mentioned was you could load it down, which is true, but how many guys do it?

As for the 460 having killing power, I would never doubt it!!!
 

JacoS

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I also refuse to fire it with a muzzle break, I firmly believe that any shooter that can comfortably fire and handle a lott can do the same with a 460 that is all to be said about the recoil....

It is an incredible stopper, the weatherby bolt (which is a one piece bolt) is quite simply put one of the strongest actions ever commercially produced..

They have never and I have never heard of any extraction problems on them.

As a dangerous game rifle the bolt throw is much lower which allows for faster loading.

the cartridge speaks for it self.... as you correctly say many wine and complain simply on hear say.. I am 262lbs and the recoil does not phase me in the least...

Of course it will kick the plaque of a 180lbs guy's teeth. but so will a 416 rigby at full load and most definitely so will a 500 Jeffrey and a 505 gibbs.

:) I love this it is way off thread but I like it!!!! :)

My best always
 

enysse

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Jaco, I'm 5' 10" and I weigh 180 lbs., that is why I'm worried about my teeth :).
 

peras

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I find it strange that the 500 Jeff is talked about as"manageble"recoil but the 460 gets slammed. Well fitted and correctly loaded the 460 is without doubt one of the greatest DG calibers, and definitely not the recoil demon as perceived by many.
 

JacoS

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Jaco, I'm 5' 10" and I weigh 180 lbs., that is why I'm worried about my teeth :).

Crap Enysse that's what 2 feet less than 6 foot (BRICKBURN!!! :) :) :) ) you can shoot mine you'll like it... it fits me well... :)

Could not agree more Pieter its not like guys hate the 500 A square, or Jeffrey, or 505 gibbs but demonizing the 460's seem to be a favourite.. :)
 
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baugust

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The abomination called a muzzle brake, will never come close to any gun I will own.
View attachment 26410
This break was custom made for my .460WM. The purpose is to reduce muzzle lift and ensure a quicker alignment for a second shot....it is no loader then with the break off as the blast is diverted upwards away from the shooter and anyone else not in a tree. It does make a difference in the recoil so it serves two purposes. Agree aesthetically the rifle looks better without it..
 

Big5

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. . . . I firmly believe that any shooter that can comfortably fire and handle a lott can do the same with a 460 that is all to be said about the recoil.

. . . . its not like guys hate the 500 A square, or Jeffrey, or 505 gibbs but demonizing the 460's seem to be a favourite.. :)


Jaco's statements sum things up very well in my opinion. Virtually all of the criticism I've ever heard about the .460 WBY's recoil is from people who have never fired one. They demonize it on rumor alone.
 

sestoppelman

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View attachment 26410
This break was custom made for my .460WM. The purpose is to reduce muzzle lift and ensure a quicker alignment for a second shot....it is no loader then with the break off as the blast is diverted upwards away from the shooter and anyone else not in a tree. It does make a difference in the recoil so it serves two purposes. Agree aesthetically the rifle looks better without it..
Have you ever stood near it while someone else fired it?
 

Norwegianwoods

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Crap Enysse that's what 2 feet less than 6 foot (BRICKBURN!!! :) :) :) ) you can shoot mine you'll like it... it fits me well... :)

Could not agree more Pieter its not like guys hate the 500 A square, or Jeffrey, or 505 gibbs but demonizing the 460's seem to be a favourite.. :)

I guess a big reason for that was the making of some guns with the same crap factory stocks that was on the 2 I have tested.
I don't think the ones that made that have ever fired it themselves, and for sure not without a muzzle brake.
If they had, the guns would never leave the factory.
The stock design was totally wrong for a hard recoiling cartridge.

Maybe I should do as Royal27 said earlier in this thread and buy one, restock it and use it as a target rifle :)
One I know has tried to sell me one for years.
 

baugust

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Yes ...in fact I have a 375 H&H Sako mannlicher carbine with a 20" barrel and that is much loader tan the .460WM
 

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I'm not a "big guy" either, at 5'10" and a muscled 195lbs... But I haven't had issues with the .458Lott, .416Rig, or .375H&H - given a proper recoil pad on the buttstock. Haven't played with a .460Wby though.

I also agree that muzzle brakes are four letter words - except for on target or colony vermin, where having zero muzzle rise is actually worth something. Definitely not as recoil mitigation to protect my shoulder.

So I'm now kicking between rebuilding a used Ruger Magnum to .458Lott or .416Rem (might consider a 460 ;) ), rebuilding a .416Ruger on a new Ruger Hawkeye, or building a .458L or .416RM on a Brno/CZ Magnum action. Guess I better get to gathering parts ;)
 

enysse

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I'd say build a 416 Rem, just because I'm biased and own one :biggrin:
 

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