375 H&H vs 416 Rem vs 416 Rigby

[zephyr]

+1 on the Win as mentioned earlier I have bought two new Win Mod 70 for semi custom guns, could not be happier with the mechanics..

 

[bebo]

I'm in love with my Winch 70 Safari Express 416 Rm + Leupold 1.25-4x24 ....
Load : 400 & 300grs ... I have had 3 rifles .37 H&H ( Rem 700, Ruger, Winch 70) but now I 'm a fan of the 416Rm,
cheaper than the 416 Rigby and more available than the 416 Ruger....

 

[Desert Dog]

I'm in love with my Winch 70 Safari Express 416 Rm + Leupold 1.25-4x24 ....
Load : 400 & 300grs ... I have had 3 rifles .37 H&H ( Rem 700, Ruger, Winch 70) but now I 'm a fan of the 416Rm,
cheaper than the 416 Rigby and more available than the 416 Ruger....

Have the exact gun (but with a Leupold VX6 1-6 firedot). Just a fantastically rugged, accurate, and functional rifle for the money.

Yep, the .416 Rem is supper versatile, efficient, and easy to load. I wouldn't hesitate to hunt plains game with it if that was my option. I prefer the 350gr TSX with H4895 in this caliber for an all-around load; flat shooting for a big bore, and really thumps on impact. Probably the limit of what most would consider a moderately recoiling cartridge. Definitely a step up from the H&H.

 

[colorado]

do CZ make a 416 Rem ?

Check out the Win Mod 70 in 416 Rem , fantastic rifle , well balanced and great value for money.

What he said ...

 

[wesheltonj]

My two cents. I have a SAKO Classic in 375 H&H. It's about a pound too light, but the wood is beautiful and its a SAKO; and its only $2100 and not 9K. That would be the way to go if you really want a SAKO. Mine is topped with a Leica ER 2.5 -10x42 scope with a target turret for elevation. That said, never turned the dial when I was in Africa, shots were just too fast, to adjust. I was lucky just to range them with my Geovids. See my post above.

With the 375, with Norma ammo, you can shoot either 300g Oryx or 350g Woodleigh bullets, more then enough to kill anything that moves.

 

[bebo]

 

[Mark R]

I love my Model 70 in 416RM and contrary to other opinions here I find it very versatile, at least out to 200m. I took my rifle on a cape buff/plainsgame hunt in 2014 and it very effectively took care of a bull and cow buff up close (40m) as well as a couple of impala out over 160m off the sticks. I used 400gr Woodleigh Hydro's on the buff and 400gr Woodleigh PP for the rest. The 416's certainly carry more authority than the 375H&H on the big and bite back animals.

Cheers,
Mark.

 

[Dwight Beagle]

A couple of comments were made about the OP's size and how it would help him handle recoil when stepping up to a harder recoiling rifle. In my experience, albeit limited, I've never noticed a relationship between a persons size and the ability to handle recoil.

 

[Nicholas Barcomb]

A couple of comments were made about the OP's size and how it would help him handle recoil when stepping up to a harder recoiling rifle. In my experience, albeit limited, I've never noticed a relationship between a persons size and the ability to handle recoil.

I'm 5'3" and don't have a problem with heavy recoil. Just have to find ways to dampen it a bit. Also, never mind the fact that I have a lot of recoil absorbent material rolling around my mid section these days!!!!

 

[James Cook]

I have a 375H&H so am partial to it. It's a great caliber. Do not own a 40 caliber or up. Having shot a 416 Rigby, don't plan to own one. The recoil difference in 375 H&H and 416 Rigby is significant. Rather shoot something I can hold'er on it, than shoot a gun running from it.

 

[zephyr]

I have a 375H&H so am partial to it. It's a great caliber. Do not own a 40 caliber or up. Having shot a 416 Rigby, don't plan to own one. The recoil difference in 375 H&H and 416 Rigby is significant. Rather shoot something I can hold'er on it, than shoot a gun running from it.

 

[zephyr]

Desert Dog ..
'Gotta ask how did you take your picture, very well done..

 

[Desert Dog]

Desert Dog ..
'Gotta ask how did you take your picture, very well done..

HAHAHA. Just laid the rifle on the tile in my bathroom with a couple rounds in the cartridge belt, and took a pic with my cell phone (Galaxy S7 Edge).

 

[Paul Homsy]

First, welcome to the site.

Second, as noted, you will need a new rifle if the hunt is to be legal. Even though a .300 Win Mag in the right place will do all the damage you need, with lion, you don't want to fool around. A wounded lion will almost always head into the thickest stuff around to wait for you. I say almost always, because when it doesn't, it charges right away. Either way, you haven't done your part of the job and others will likely end up at some risk. Not a situation a hunter should ever want to put himself or others in.

Third, so if this is the case, what's the right gun? I have a .375 H&H, a .404 Jeffery and a .416 Rigby. In my experience - and I've used all three in Africa on lion, elephant and buffalo - I've always felt a bit undergunned with the .375. It's a wonderful gun, the recoil is very manageable, and I just used it on a small nocturnal species hunt (with solids) to avoid destroying the little guys. It also did exceptionally well on a giraffe. A versatile gun. More versatile than the .404 and the .416.

Having said that, both the .404 and the .416 shoot 25% more lead (400 gr vs. 300gr), and just pack more punch. They aren't as versatile as the .375 in that you wouldn't normally use them on plains game, at least not at any distance, while you certainly could with the .375, but when you need the extra punch, you have it. And it's nice to have it on dangerous game, which tends to be shot fairly up close and personal. If you are recoil sensitive, then the .404 would be a great choice. If not, well, then it's up to you. The .416 - whether Rigby or the others - hits harder, and recoils harder. But with a good, well balanced gun, it's certainly manageable. You're a big guy, so I assume recoil isn't an issue. As between the Rigby and the others, I'd pick the Rigby only because of the romance of the old cartridge.

Finally, if you get a .375 now, you will like might well want something bigger down the road. You say you have no intention of hunting elephant or hippo. I said the same thing once, and now I have more rifles than I need! And it seems you've got the bug already. So if you are or expect to be limited in the number of guns you can afford, I'd go for the bigger gun now. That would give you a great plains game rifle and a wonderful dangerous game rifle.

And there's nothing wrong with that.

Hank, I agree with everything you said. I just wanted to add a small note on your comparison to the 416. The 400 grains bullet is actually 33% heavier than the 300 grain in 375 using the step up from 300 to 400 grains as a basis while the 375 is actually 25% lighter than the 416 using the 400 grains as a basis. I think your post is excellent and true to everything otherwise.

 

[Paul Homsy]

Gentlemen, hello this is my first time to this forum and I'm excited to be here. I've been scrolling the last few days just reading. Signed up today because I have a mighty task at hand.

A little about me I'm 43 years old. I've hunted mainly in Canada & across North America. I've hunted almost all the deer species except for moose and elk but they are on my list. I've hunted whitetails in the south all my life.

In 2014 my dad and I got the itch and we went to Africa for a father son plains game hunt and it was an incredible experience. I'm 6 feet tall 280 lbs broad shoulders and pretty muscular legs. I shot my 325 wsm with factor 200 grain accubonds, it put everything we shot on its ass including a huge blue wildabeest. All one shot kills.

I just booked a lion and plains game hunt for May 2018 and my heart is pounding. The biggest gun I own is my 325 wsm. Should I buy the 375 H&H or 416? I have no interest in ever hunting an elephant or hippo. Buffalo and crocodile are down the line later. But I figure if you're going to shoot a lion drop a serious hammer if I can shoot it straight.

I'm willing to spend up to 1,500 to 2,500 for a nice dependable rifle. I'm a little prejudiced. I only try to hunt with Zeiss optics, Swaro or high end Leopold stuff.

I love Sako for the smooth actions but I'm not spending 9,000 for a safari gun I also love Coopers but not spending 6,500 on these 416s or 375s. One more thing will barrel length matter? I'm accustomed to shooting 24 inch and 22 inch barreled rifles.

Whats good gentlemen and what can I do with this budget? Hunting is a passion for me! I'm a pretty successful business guy in my personal life and I've been a pretty successful hunter as well, because I'm very good at being humble, shutting up and listening to those who've been there done than. Sorry to ramble looking forward to answers.

I think you've received great and accurate opinions to your post already. The 375 H&H is a superb round, so is the 416, I've only shot a Rigby in 416 and several other more potent calibers up to the 460 Weatherby. In my opinion the 375 H&H or 416 Rigby are both excellent additions to your arsenal, they both have their virtues. The difference in potency is substantial and while one can be used as an excellent all around, the 416's additional potency is something you may appreciate to have in your hands while hunting tough dangerous game. You can do it with the 375, it's been done numerous times and very well at that but the extra punch and frontal area of a 416 is comforting and extremely efficient particularly for the game you mention you would be after. As a rule, it isn't what can be killed by a particular caliber under near ideal field conditions that should guide your choice but what can be more efficient if dangerous game charges in close quarters and has to be stopped. That potential always exists.

The 416 Rigby is perfect for hot climates, it operates at low pressure which isn't necessarily true for other 416s. The recoil of the 375 H&H is extremely manageable and the step up to a 416 while significantly more substantial is also quite manageable. In my experience, the size of the shooter matters less than shooting stance and stock fit which can't be stressed enough. A stock that fits you makes a world of difference. A slight person is pushed back more than a heavy person who in turn tends to absorb more of the recoil. Build isn't the issue, regular practice in field positions is. I like to have shot around 200 rounds in a new heavy rifle before I feel truly comfortable with it. Some people who shoot large bores more regularly may need less but I think from personal experience that part of the practice is getting acquainted with the general feel of a firearm.

 

[fourfive8]

Winchester 70- 416 Rem w/ Leupold 1.5-5. This rifle was made in about the last year or two Winchester was in New Haven, Conn. This rifle and cartridge has performed flawlessly on both dangerous game and plains game. The 370 gr North Fork CPS or FPS bullet over Varget to 2350 fps is very temperature insensitive and is relatively low pressure (something like 48 kpsi). The combination is super accurate and no need for an over-sized cartridge like the Rigby designed around very temperature sensitive 100+ year old cordite powder technology.

Note the scope is rotated 90 degrees to the left for a very practical reason- especially for a dangerous game bolt gun.
I mount scopes this way on many of my hunting rifles.

 

[Paul Homsy]

Very nice set up ! I like the scope mount as well.

Thank you for the information about temperature sensitivity or lack of in the 416 Remington. I realize the Rigby was developed a long time ago for its use with cordite and that the Remington is very efficient.

Thanks again !

 

[Paul Homsy]

A couple of comments were made about the OP's size and how it would help him handle recoil when stepping up to a harder recoiling rifle. In my experience, albeit limited, I've never noticed a relationship between a persons size and the ability to handle recoil.

I agree entirely with you. Shooting form, stance and all important stock fit are more relevant than the size of the shooter.

 

[SETH RINGER]

TAKEN BUSHBUCK TO ELEPHANT WITH THE TRIED AND TRUE .375 H&H (THOUGH I DID FEEL UNDER GUNNED ON THE JUMBO), STEPPING UP, .416 RUGER WOULD BE MY "MODERN" CHOICE.

 

[Paul Homsy]

Seth, thank you for the input. Much appreciated. The Remington is definitely every bit as efficient as the Rigby and I agree that as a modern choice, it makes perfect sense. I read and heard that it did not take high energy high pressure loads in hot climate as well as the Ribgy and at times could pose problems with extraction. Obviously any round loaded too hot can pose the same problem...

Cheers,

Paul