Post-apartheid South Africa is world's most unequal country

I agree with what has been said on a large scale here but on an individual by individual basis less so.

I grew up in what most people would consider low middle class type situation. We weren't homeless but we had very very little. My parents separated and went down different paths. My father today has got himself to a good position, my mother last I heard was still much the same. Now my brother and i worked our arses off, with support from our father and today I'd consider us both successful. My brother has his own business, i got a loan from the govt to do my tertiary education and now work for the government. I'll never be in a position to hunt LDE or probably even a free range buffalo but I have got a decent house, a wife and a son, we can afford to holiday and have nice things which is to say we live comfortably.

Having said that, i know several people, one in particular that I am friends with who grew up in a wealthy family and has the work ethic of a sloth. He's set to inherit a successful business, though he's smart enough to not stuff it up. There was certainly no working hard to get there snd he will end up far wealthier than anyone else in our friendship group. He's also the first to say poor people need to just try harder.

I'm lucky i grew up in a country where it was possible to get where I did, but somewhere less able or willing to support people in need would have been so much harder. Which is why I see how easy it is for the perpetual poverty some people find themselves in to exist.

True people need to help themselves, but it also needs a better system of management and as long as you have corrupt governments there's little hope.

sgt_zim said:

I would love to agree with this sentiment, but history demonstrates it as overly optimistic.

When politicians promise "free stuff," it plays well to people who do not think things through. There is no such thing as something for nothing, and they never consider the ultimate cost to themselves down the road. "Free" today comes with strings attached, and one day, the guy on the other end of the line is going to start reeling it in.

A healthy civilization is not, and should not be, measured by what the wealthy have, nor by what the poor lack. In every civilization that has ever existed in man's history, there were Haves and Have-nots. "How large is the middle class, and what do they have relative to the wealthy?" is the real question. When the middle class is small, or even non-existent, you may know that larceny and murder are the rule.

When "the mob" approves (or doesn't disapprove) of theft, you end up with Somalia. When the government does it, you end up with Venezuela or PRC or USSR or NAZI Germany or Cuba or NK. And in all those instances, the great mass of people went along with it because they were not incredulous when told they were going to get something for nothing. They all lied to themselves, told themselves what fine raiment the king was wearing when he was indeed wearing no clothes.

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Perhaps but I wouldn’t count out the power of the human spirit. But time will tell. People will choose the easy path only to be disappointed and in the end realize that their situation is theirs and theirs alone to improve.

Top 20 failed states, Africa tallies 15 of them and it's not getting any better. In 2010 there were 12. Civil wars, starvation, genocide and corruption are a way of life. What the civilized world sees as dysfunction, a large part of the African population see normality. Been this way for tens of thousands of years. Ironic that the West throws money at the "problem" thinking it will get better when in reality, it only makes for more corruption. Once the Chinese suck all the natural resources out of the continent, they'll all be back to cooking over buffalo and elephant shit.

CAustin said:

Perhaps but I wouldn’t count out the power of the human spirit. But time will tell. People will choose the easy path only to be disappointed and in the end realize that their situation is theirs and theirs alone to improve.

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You are probably my age, or perhaps within a couple years of it. Life has never been perfect anywhere, not even in the states. But there was a time here where people mostly minded their own business, where they understood TANSTAAFL, that if they wanted something, they had to work for it.

I still believe in the goodness of man, but I also believe that when "goodness" becomes a self-sacrifice, people will go into self-preservation mode.

Hard, inflexible ethics are the foundation of prosperity, IMO. And those ethics have to be shared very broadly. I'm not certain what the tipping point is, but I believe we've gone past it already.

sgt_zim said:

and how are the black africans in RSA by way of comparison to other african nations?

"working hard" does not mean anyone should have a high income or be wealthy. that's the thoroughly discredited Marxist "Labor Theory of Value."

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Boy, tell me about it.

Rick Cox said:

Boy, tell me about it.

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If "working hard" means a person should earn a lot of money, I should go to the gym every day and kill it on weights and aerobic for 10-12 hours. That should guarantee me a great income.