Good Gun Deals This Week

EuroOptic said:

GPO Spectra 1-6x24i G4i
These GPO's are definitely worth a look as well, little less expensive than the leupold - punches right up there with Ziess and Schmdit Bender in glass quality

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Are you claiming that the GPO glass exceeds Leupold's glass?
Does GPO have a lifetime no-excuses warranty?

Altitude sickness said:

That’s a bold statement that a $400 or $700 rifle scope compares to a Schmidt and Bender

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Well, he compared GPO to "Ziess and Schmdit Bender", which are Cambodian copies of Zeiss and Schmidt and Bender. <joke>

Really nice Dakota 76, 404 DAKOTA $10,500. Looks new, beautiful wood, metal Dakota case, 8 boxes of factory ammo and Schmidt & Bender scope. Very nice.

BJH65 said:

Really nice Dakota 76, 404 DAKOTA $10,500. Looks new, beautiful wood, metal Dakota case, 8 boxes of factory ammo and Schmidt & Bender scope. Very nice.

https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-for-sale-online/rifles/dakota-arms-rifles/dakota-arms-african-model-76-in-404-dakota.cfm?gun_id=103805980

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It’s a 404 Dakota. That brings it down a tad in my opinion.

Gulf Breeze has a Dakota 76 404 Dakota on GI for $2k less and looks nicer, but again it's a 404 Dakota.

SCmackey said:

Gulf Breeze has a Dakota 76 404 Dakota on GI for $2k less and looks nicer, but again it's a 404 Dakota.

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The other comes with 160 rds of factory 404 Dakota ammo, a Dakota metal case and Schmidt & Bender scope. I think the ammo alone is worth 2k or more. I would consider a 404 Dakota if it came with a decent amount of ammo.

BTP-KennethWRoyce said:

Are you claiming that the GPO glass exceeds Leupold's glass?
Does GPO have a lifetime no-excuses warranty?

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The warranty is useless when the animal of a lifetime or more critically a use for self-defense, law enforcement, or military needs are at stake.

Equipment needs to work when it needs to work.

A warranty with “great customer service” is useless and of no value at that moment.

I will not use a Luepold at this point even if it was free.

The best customer service is to design it right, build it right, and quality control check it before sending it out the door so it will not need to come back.

Tex .416 said:

The warranty is useless when the animal of a lifetime or more critically a use for self-defense, law enforcement, or military needs are at stake.

Equipment needs to work when it needs to work.

A warranty with “great customer service” is useless and of no value at that moment.

I will not use a Luepold at this point even if it was free.

The best customer service is to design it right, build it right, and quality control check it before sending it out the door so it will not need to come back.

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Yet the US Military is often fielding and issuing Leupold scopes as are countless Law Enforcement agencies around the country. A step up and within certain circles of the Military Schmidt & Bender is being fielded/issued.

In my 15 or so years serving in the military and 7 since often dealing with mil/leo stuff I've yet to see GPO on a duty firearm and still continue to see Leupold as one of the predominant optics brands being purchased by agencies and departments. I will caveat that with, not all models from each manufacturer are created equal and not all are designed to withstand the rigors of duty use. I've had a Leupold fail but it wasn't a model designed for serious duty use and abuse

Tex .416 said:

The warranty is useless when the animal of a lifetime or more critically a use for self-defense, law enforcement, or military needs are at stake.

Equipment needs to work when it needs to work.

A warranty with “great customer service” is useless and of no value at that moment.

I will not use a Luepold at this point even if it was free.

The best customer service is to design it right, build it right, and quality control check it before sending it out the door so it will not need to come back.

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Has Leupold really so fallen in quality by now? If true, thanks, good to know. (I have a few <2010 Leupold optics which have held up well.)

It's tiresome how once-name brands slide downhill and are no longer trustworthy. As Jeff Cooper once observed, "There is hardly any product in the world that someone cannot make a little worse and sell for a little less, and he who makes price his only concern is the natural prey of this man."

When I began to see even Swiss products condescend to the "Common Man" and his budget, I mused that the World may not long survive....

Mtn_Infantry said:

Yet the US Military is often fielding and issuing Leupold scopes as are countless Law Enforcement agencies around the country. A step up and within certain circles of the Military Schmidt & Bender is being fielded/issued.

In my 15 or so years serving in the military and 7 since often dealing with mil/leo stuff I've yet to see GPO on a duty firearm and still continue to see Leupold as one of the predominant optics brands being purchased by agencies and departments. I will caveat that with, not all models from each manufacturer are created equal and not all are designed to withstand the rigors of duty use. I've had a Leupold fail but it wasn't a model designed for serious duty use and abuse

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I’m not vouching for GPO, just commenting on Luepold.

I truly hope they can turn themselves around.

Tex .416 said:

I’m not vouching for GPO, just commenting on Luepold.

I truly hope they can turn themselves around.

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Generally curious, which models have you had fail? What were the issues? Did they arrive defective or go out during use?

My preferred optic is an S&B, Swaro, or Kahles. I own a lot of Leupolds because putting an S&B on every gun would likely bankrupt me. Leupold is generally what I consider the “starting point” in both price and quality.

Mtn_Infantry said:

Yet the US Military is often fielding and issuing Leupold scopes as are countless Law Enforcement agencies around the country. A step up and within certain circles of the Military Schmidt & Bender is being fielded/issued.

In my 15 or so years serving in the military and 7 since often dealing with mil/leo stuff I've yet to see GPO on a duty firearm and still continue to see Leupold as one of the predominant optics brands being purchased by agencies and departments. I will caveat that with, not all models from each manufacturer are created equal and not all are designed to withstand the rigors of duty use. I've had a Leupold fail but it wasn't a model designed for serious duty use and abuse

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Its been many years since I fielded a scoped rifle "professionally"... but every rifle I fielded in both the military and in law enforcement wore leupold optics.. the M24's all had Leupold fixed 10x optics.. and the Rem 700P's wore Mk4 optics.. Ive literally put thousands of rounds downrange through those guns using those optics.. drug them through culverts, ditches, through fields, over rocks, etc..etc.. and straight up abused them.. and never once had one fail on me..

thats doesnt mean it cant happen...

but I'd challenge a hunter, even in the most challenging to terrain, to put the same kind of abuse on a scope (we would literally low crawl with the rifles for hundreds of meters through everything from drainage ditches to stony fields.. then shoot them in extreme heat, cold, wet, etc)..

Granted they arent S&B or IOR Valdata type tanks.. but in my experience they can take some serious abuse..

Im largely a zeiss and swaro guy these days.. but I still have several rifles that wear leupold.. and I continue to buy leupold products when they have something that fits a particular niche Im trying to fill or that is priced really well, etc.. Im pretty sure I'll continue to buy their stuff until I take a final dirt nap..

mdwest said:

Its been many years since I fielded a scoped rifle "professionally"... but every rifle I fielded in both the military and in law enforcement wore leupold optics.. the M24's all had Leupold fixed 10x optics.. and the Rem 700P's wore Mk4 optics.. Ive literally put thousands of rounds downrange through those guns using those optics.. drug them through culverts, ditches, through fields, over rocks, etc..etc.. and straight up abused them.. and never once had one fail on me..

thats doesnt mean it cant happen...

but I'd challenge a hunter, even in the most challenging to terrain, to put the same kind of abuse on a scope (we would literally low crawl with the rifles for hundreds of meters through everything from drainage ditches to stony fields.. then shoot them in extreme heat, cold, wet, etc)..

Granted they arent S&B or IOR Valdata type tanks.. but in my experience they can take some serious abuse..

Im largely a zeiss and swaro guy these days.. but I still have several rifles that wear leupold.. and I continue to buy leupold products when they have something that fits a particular niche Im trying to fill or that is priced really well, etc.. Im pretty sure I'll continue to buy their stuff until I take a final dirt nap..

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Same but I’ve had a commercial VX5 fail on me. Not swaying me from the brand given how they’ve withstood the rest of the abuse I’ve put them through. Now the guns i put them on are nicer and mine, so I typically try to take care of them a bit more.

Mtn_Infantry said:

Generally curious, which models have you had fail? What were the issues? Did they arrive defective or go out during use?

My preferred optic is an S&B, Swaro, or Kahles. I own a lot of Leupolds because putting an S&B on every gun would likely bankrupt me. Leupold is generally what I consider the “starting point” in both price and quality.

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Mark IV and VX3.

Tex .416 said:

Mark IV and VX3.

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New production Mark IV or old?
I’ve got zero experience with the VX3’s. I think I own 1 VX3HD I won from a banquet and it’s still in the box. My go to has always been the VX5 and VX6 line for hunting scopes.

Interesting looking gun. Don't know anything about it

Mtn_Infantry said:

New production Mark IV or old?
I’ve got zero experience with the VX3’s. I think I own 1 VX3HD I won from a banquet and it’s still in the box. My go to has always been the VX5 and VX6 line for hunting scopes.

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The Mark IV was around 2005.

The VX3 came on a .308 I bought used within the last five or so years. The target looked like it was hit with a shotgun. Swapped scopes and the rifle started shooting great without any other work. Sent the scope in for repair, then gifted it to a friend that was tight on money. He shoots less than five shots a year and it is working for him so far.

I hear you and concur on the cost of putting scopes on a bunch of rifles. I view NF NXS and NX8 as the beginning level of scopes I will trust to work when needed with good image quality.

Reliability is critical to me - above all other factors. All the rifles I think I am likely to shoot in the foreseeable future now have Pic rails. So moving scopes around is quick and easy.

I remember from prior discussions you mostly use S&B’s. They are superb without a doubt. I’ve not used a Kahles, but hear only good things about them. The single best scope I ever looked through is a Hensoldt military issue. The image was stunning and the turret adjustments felt like a precision instrument. The one for sale to civilians was over $12,000 so that did not end up in my safe. If you ever have a chance to handle one, do it. Truly on a whole different level.

Mtn_Infantry said:

Leupold is generally what I consider the “starting point” in both price and quality.

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I have (had?) the same philosophy without disappointment, but mine precede Leupold's reputed qualitative decline.

Tex .416 said:

I remember from prior discussions you mostly use S&B’s. They are superb without a doubt. I’ve not used a Kahles, but hear only good things about them.

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For my .450 Dakota 76 I was leaning toward a 1.5-6x S&B years ago but a friend in the optics world persuaded me into a Zeiss Diavari Victory 1.5-6x42 T* as then having a slight edge in glass quality. Even though I'd never had an S&B, I followed his advice. Great scope, though its only game yet has been a South Dakota cow bison in a near blizzard; I've used irons for the rest so far.

Tex .416 said:

I view NF NXS and NX8 as the beginning level of scopes I will trust to work when needed with good image quality.

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NF has my full attention. Probably my next optics purchase.

Tex .416 said:

The single best scope I ever looked through is a Hensoldt military issue. The image was stunning and the turret adjustments felt like a precision instrument. The one for sale to civilians was over $12,000 so that did not end up in my safe. If you ever have a chance to handle one, do it. Truly on a whole different level.

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IDK about that $12k model, but the Hensoldt 4x issued for G3 with 600m BDC is FMJ spot on at all ranges and great brightness for 4x. I was hitting 500yd Whittington fox profile steel so regularly it was boring. The rifle is 1MOA, and the glass brings that out.

MORAL: Spend a painful amount for excellent optics; they're a joy forever. As I read on some other forum: "The bitterness of poor quality is remembered long after the sweetness of low price has faded from memory."

Arent scopes mentioned above meant to be for differet purposes- Hunting, precision long range shooting, military?

Hensoldt,, for 12K good grief it better be out of this world.

SStomcat said:

Arent scopes mentioned above meant to be for differet purposes- Hunting, precision long range shooting, military?

Hensoldt,, for 12K good grief it better be out of this world.

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They are made for shooting. I like them because they are reliable and durable.