Re-stocking vs Stock Extension

[SCmackey]

I recently purchased a Belgium double rifle in 470 NE made in 1956 by FAUL. Metal work is in great shape, but stock needs some love. Was cut short to 14 in LOP including ~1" of recoil pad. Gun has pretty nice wood that needs to be refinished; at the very least. Griffin & Howe suggested a stock extension that would be nearly invisible, but also looking at a complete re-stock project with Wenig using a nice piece of Bastogne walnut. My goal is to have something I feel good about owning/using and potentially recouping most or all of my investment. Interested in knowledgeable opinions on these types of projects. Thanks!

 

[Shotgun Coach]

Please be careful
I have seen some jobs that required a re-regulation after a full stock replacement some did not. Just a heads up.

 

[SCmackey]

thanks

 

[BonUm16]

If you are considering an extension, I’d suggest at least talking to Mark Larson.

Home | mysite

www.marklarsongunart.com

I know Craig Libhart was scaling back to at least semi-retirement. If willing, I’d suggest him over Wenig’s. Craig’s just on the other side of the river from me. Does excellent work and is a heck of a nice guy as well.

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Art and culture gallery located in Bainbridge

www.susquehannastockworks.com

Wouldn’t even talk to G&H about any of the work.

 

[93marlin]

I own an 1896 JP Sauer double rifle. At some point in the last 129 yrs it had an extension added, total LOP is now 14.75 inches.
To my way of thinking, it adds to the value and history of the rifle.
Plus it fits me better than any other rifle that I have ever handled.

 

[deewayne2003]

I had an ebony extension fitted for my .470 by Shurley Custom in Uhland Texas.

They can do anything with wood.

 

[Philip Glass]

I recently purchased a Belgium double rifle in 470 NE made in 1956 by FAUL. Metal work is in great shape, but stock needs some love. Was cut short to 14 in LOP including ~1" of recoil pad. Gun has pretty nice wood that needs to be refinished; at the very least. Griffin & Howe suggested a stock extension that would be nearly invisible, but also looking at a complete re-stock project with Wenig using a nice piece of Bastogne walnut. My goal is to have something I feel good about owning/using and potentially recouping most or all of my investment. Interested in knowledgeable opinions on these types of projects. Thanks!

It would be so nice to be able to select a new piece of wood and get the perfect LOP. I need to do this as well. I hate all the black spacers on my guns!

 

[rookhawk]

I recently purchased a Belgium double rifle in 470 NE made in 1956 by FAUL. Metal work is in great shape, but stock needs some love. Was cut short to 14 in LOP including ~1" of recoil pad. Gun has pretty nice wood that needs to be refinished; at the very least. Griffin & Howe suggested a stock extension that would be nearly invisible, but also looking at a complete re-stock project with Wenig using a nice piece of Bastogne walnut. My goal is to have something I feel good about owning/using and potentially recouping most or all of my investment. Interested in knowledgeable opinions on these types of projects. Thanks!

I cannot see a path forward where one recovers a restocking investment. A good restocking, including forend, for a boxlock action these days runs about $6000. Finding a stock blank that has the grain flow to endure 470NE is not easy either, you’ll need to look at dozens of blanks that would be fine for a shotgun to find one suitable for a NE rifle.

The big question is how much length of pull do you actually require? You can probably get that existing stock refreshed and a 1.25” pad should bring you to 14-3/8”-ish LOP. You can build up a spacer and 1.5” with pad at 14.75”. If you cover that in pigskin leather and line it correctly, it doesn’t look hideous to the eyes and would run you less than a $1000 w/ stock refreshed.

There is a trend in shade tree gunsmithing of an add-a-butt-to-me where they remove the butt, save the wrist, and mortise in a new butt. Saves a fortune, costs only about $2000. Don’t do it. It will never survive the recoil forces of a double rifle.

 

[Muskox]

Here is my 2 schilling.

1. Never heard of that maker, and it's Belgian not British. So what is the actual value of that rifle? I don't know, until you put a new stock on it and sell it neither do you. The odds are very high it will not be worth the cost of the new stock, if you have one built and it doesn't end up being a nice looking or more importantly feeling rifle.

2. What will it actually cost? You would be lucky if they pantographed your stock or used a 3D imager to copy your stocks design and then cut it with a CNC machine for $2500-3500. A traditional stock maker would charge another $3000-7000.

3. So then the question is what is it really worth to you?

4. I am in the midst of rebuilding a Heeren single shot. I got the gun for $850. It needs a new barrel, as the caliber is painfully not going to work, and a new stock. I expect to have $3000 in this project myself, but it isn't a 470 that will break your face if the stock comes apart. Nor will it be used on a dangerous game hunt. This is the problem with dangerous game rifles, they can't sorta work.

5. G&H is far from a shade tree gun plumber. I would trust their judgement. Wenig makes shotgun stocks for people that shoot 10,000 rounds a year. I would actually trust their judgment as well.

 

[deewayne2003]

Shurley Customs | Worlds finest custom made shotgun stocks

Tommy Shurley has a laser replicator and does rifle and shotgun stocks.

 

[rookhawk]

Shurley Customs | Worlds finest custom made shotgun stocks

Tommy Shurley has a laser replicator and does rifle and shotgun stocks.

The reason these laser replicators don't work so swell is simple. You cannot take a gun stock of say 14" with a given LOP and cast and simply extrapolate it to 15.5". The Drop at Heel and Comb are not going to be the same extrapolations as a stock gets longer.

That's why custom fittings and custom gunstocks are essential to take a gun made for a 1900s British Pygmy that can then be transformed to fit a 21st century American a full 18" taller.

A French or Belgian double rifle as indicated by the OP generally cannot endure a restocking and come out "at par or ahead". The critical consideration is if the original stock can be lengthened to work out okay because it would cost 1/10th the cost of a restocking, whereas a full restock may make the gun worth pennies more than it does with its original stock yet it will cost -$6000+.

 

[93marlin]

Just a thought....I looked up the German translation of FAUL.
It warrants a look. I'm just sayin'

 

[deewayne2003]

The reason these laser replicators don't work so swell is simple. You cannot take a gun stock of say 14" with a given LOP and cast and simply extrapolate it to 15.5". The Drop at Heel and Comb are not going to be the same extrapolations as a stock gets longer.

That's why custom fittings and custom gunstocks are essential to take a gun made for a 1900s British Pygmy that can then be transformed to fit a 21st century American a full 18" taller.

A French or Belgian double rifle as indicated by the OP generally cannot endure a restocking and come out "at par or ahead". The critical consideration is if the original stock can be lengthened to work out okay because it would cost 1/10th the cost of a restocking, whereas a full restock may make the gun worth pennies more than it does with its original stock yet it will cost -$6000+.

I stand with my statement that they can either lengthen it by extension or make a new stock.

He’s fitted for and built stocks for world champions in both benchrest and skeet.

 

[SCmackey]

Just a thought....I looked up the German translation of FAUL.
It warrants a look. I'm just sayin'

"Fabrique d’Armes Unies de Liège or "FAUL" for short

 

[Kevin Peacocke]

You can't make s silk purse out of a sow's ear, as the saying goes. If this is a top-end double rifle, fit a fine stock that fits you. If it is a lesser make, but perfectly workable fit a lesser fancy wood stock that fits you, via a replicator or whatever. The operative words here are 'fits you'. You are clearly not satisfied by extensions or gashes, do it properly at the appropriate level or you will not be happy.

 

[rookhawk]

You can't make s silk purse out of a sow's ear, as the saying goes. If this is a top-end double rifle, fit a fine stock that fits you. If it is a lesser make, but perfectly workable fit a lesser fancy wood stock that fits you, via a replicator or whatever. The operative words here are 'fits you'. You are clearly not satisfied by extensions or gashes, do it properly at the appropriate level or you will not be happy.

The math doesn't work that way in the US, @Kevin Peacocke . If we go to the lumber yard and get a block of pine for $10, It's $3000 of labor to fit that stock in a grotesque manner. It's another $1000 for a fore end. (these are boxlock prices, sidelocks are more) Of course you can get a straight grained piece of adequate American Black Walnut, California Claro, or Bastogne for $1000-$1500 more for the wood. If you want perfect grain flow, symmetrical pattern, and you want it in English or French Walnut, the blanks are going to start at around $1500 on up to $4000.

Any way you slice it, a restock of a double rifle done properly to handle the recoil of a large bore NE caliber, you're going to be down 2-3 years wait time on average and minimum $4000, probably more like $6500 dollars for a so-so stocking.

It is always best to deal with an extended and leather wrapped pad to make a gun servicable rather than to restock a double rifle. Otherwise, best to sell the gun on down the river to the next shorter guy and find a different gun. You cannot come out on top getting a gun restocked as an "investment" which is how I read the OP's intentions of "not losing money".

I've had but one gun restocked and it was four agonizing years wait and it was $6000. (ten year old story) But then again it was a gun I paid $6000 that was worth $35,000 restocked and was wholly worthless as a box of parts without that new stock. That is a rare scenario where the aggravation was worth the trouble. It was also a famous gun of the highest known quality with all the best features, photographed in books, and owned by a famous Nawab in princely India before partition. None of the aforementioned example would apply to a F.A.U.L. double rifle that would likely be a working man's double worth little more than the cost of a stocking.

 

[MacJenkins]

The math doesn't work that way in the US, @Kevin Peacocke . If we go to the lumber yard and get a block of pine for $10, It's $3000 of labor to fit that stock in a grotesque manner. It's another $1000 for a fore end. (these are boxlock prices, sidelocks are more) Of course you can get a straight grained piece of adequate American Black Walnut, California Claro, or Bastogne for $1000-$1500 more for the wood. If you want perfect grain flow, symmetrical pattern, and you want it in English or French Walnut, the blanks are going to start at around $1500 on up to $4000.

Any way you slice it, a restock of a double rifle done properly to handle the recoil of a large bore NE caliber, you're going to be down 2-3 years wait time on average and minimum $4000, probably more like $6500 dollars for a so-so stocking.

It is always best to deal with an extended and leather wrapped pad to make a gun servicable rather than to restock a double rifle. Otherwise, best to sell the gun on down the river to the next shorter guy and find a different gun. You cannot come out on top getting a gun restocked as an "investment" which is how I read the OP's intentions of "not losing money".

I've had but one gun restocked and it was four agonizing years wait and it was $6000. (ten year old story) But then again it was a gun I paid $6000 that was worth $35,000 restocked and was wholly worthless as a box of parts without that new stock. That is a rare scenario where the aggravation was worth the trouble. It was also a famous gun of the highest known quality with all the best features, photographed in books, and owned by a famous Nawab in princely India before partition. None of the aforementioned example would apply to a F.A.U.L. double rifle that would likely be a working man's double worth little more than the cost of a stocking.

Your experience is very similar to mine in buying doubles for the last 18-20 years. Except I have never found a rifle deal like your restock deal. Good Job!

I've passed on hundreds of "Good" deals because of incorrect fit for me. I need a minimum of 15" LOP as 15.25" is perfect.

Never once I have found a deal good enough that I felt a $6-8K restock and years of wait made the deal palatable. For me life is too short, move on and find another.