9.3x62mm vs. .375 H&H Mag

[WAB]

Well you are in total disagreement with a bloke I referred to in one of my earlier posts who has used both and claims the 9.3X62 in Not a 375 in use on animals and he has shot a metric shit ton of each game groups of pigs, horses and scrub cattle.

Well my data set isn’t huge but it includes Cape buffalo and a raft of lesser game with both cartridges. I have found them equal in field performance.

 

[geoff rath]

243WIN or 25-30BNW...either way, I'm not gonna be a happy camper.

Sadly Woodleigh don't make any 257 caliber bullets; a cause for much frustration for our mate Bob.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

So you are saying there is no difference between a 35 Whelen and a 375

@Rule 303
Loaded with projectiles of similar sds and velocities probably not.
Loaded to their potential yes.
Then the 375 wins hands down.

The old cordite load in the 375H&H the 300gn soft or sold was easily out done by the 9.3x62 in penetration stakes when loaded with a 320grain at 2,200 to 2,300fps . The Whelen with 310s is in the same boat.

In days of yore according to the 9.3x62 journal a lot of PHs preferred the penetration of the 9.3x62 over the 375H&H as the 375H&H drove the 300s of the day to fast causing them to over expand or in the case of the round nose solids bend and deflect off course after hitting large bones.
An RWS steel core solid in the 9.3x62 of the day would penetrate an elephant skull from side to side. The front on brain shot with the same bullet they would sometimes find it lodged in the spine.
The 9.3x62 journal is a real eye opener in what it will do.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

It will not match it on paper, to me that is irrelevant, the real question is, will it match it in the field. Having used both, I say the answer is a resounding YES!

@WAB
PAPER BALISTICS only tell part of the story. Bullet construction and the parachute affect of expansion change sds dramatically which then alters penetration.

A 458mag loaded with a 500gn soft nose penetrates less than a 45-70 loaded with the same bullet but the 458WM has a bucket load more enery. Energy don't kill penetration does.
This is going to create a shit storm of arguments.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

What if you shot Townsend @Bob Nelson 35Whelen in the arse with his own .25-20 using an 86gr. Woodleigh Hydro? Would he die or just crawl to get his .35 WHELEN? Ha! Ha! Ha!

@CoElkHunter
If'n y'all shot me in the arse with an 86gn hydro in my 25-20 it wouldn't even break the skin just piss me off and you would probably end up with a good smack in the ear.
Bob

 

[IvW]

9.3x74R in a Blaser O/U loaded with Rhino 300gr solids or controlled expansion bullets I would happily use on anything.....
SD is .320 loaded to 2300-2350fps it will kill anything with the right placement even elephant frontal.....

 

[IvW]

The balser offers you the ability to regulate the barrels, scope or red dot or open sights......accuracy will surpass any sxs configuration....

 

[Rule 303]

@Rule 303
Loaded with projectiles of similar sds and velocities probably not.
Loaded to their potential yes.
Then the 375 wins hands down.

The old cordite load in the 375H&H the 300gn soft or sold was easily out done by the 9.3x62 in penetration stakes when loaded with a 320grain at 2,200 to 2,300fps . The Whelen with 310s is in the same boat.

In days of yore according to the 9.3x62 journal a lot of PHs preferred the penetration of the 9.3x62 over the 375H&H as the 375H&H drove the 300s of the day to fast causing them to over expand or in the case of the round nose solids bend and deflect off course after hitting large bones.
An RWS steel core solid in the 9.3x62 of the day would penetrate an elephant skull from side to side. The front on brain shot with the same bullet they would sometimes find it lodged in the spine.
The 9.3x62 journal is a real eye opener in what it will do.
Bob

Bob my reply that you have answered was a bit tongue in check. Remember I pointed out that the difference between the 9.3X62 and the 375 is the same difference between the 35 Whelen and the 9.3X62. So if the 9.3X62 is the same as 375 and the 35Whelen must then be the same as a 9.3X62 ergo the 35 Whelen must be the same as a 375.

Now we know that is not the case, the 35 Whelen is not a 9.3X62 and a 9.3X62 is not the same as a 375 when both are loaded to their potential. You mention the hunters of your recon a X62 loaded with a 320 grain projectile and they are comparing this to a 375 with a 300 grain projectile not a 350 grain projectile. If we do comparisons then lets compare apples with apples.

Re the bit about the 300 grain projectiles from a 375 bending, I have not read this before but I would not be surprised as the 6.5X54 rounds did that. However you then mention the X63 was judged using steel cored solids, guess what happened when the 375 used steel cored solids. Like I said apples with apples. Just remember those writing the book on the 9.3 appear to have a product they want to push.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

9.3x74R in a Blaser O/U loaded with Rhino 300gr solids or controlled expansion bullets I would happily use on anything.....
SD is .320 loaded to 2300-2350fps it will kill anything with the right placement even elephant frontal.....

@IvW
What about a 35 Whelen with 310gn steel core solids with an SD of .346 at 2,300-2,400fps.
Bob

 

[IvW]

Will work not availible in RSA though.....and not 8n a Blaser O/U BBF either.....

 

[Bush Buck]

I have a CZ 550 in 9.3x62 and a Winchester M70 Alaskan in 375 H&H.

With factory ammo, the 375 is faster and shoots flatter.

With full pressure handloads the 9.3 is pretty close to a factory load in the 375.

On plains game, it doesn’t matter. On dangerous game, I have more confidence in a 375.

I have used both a good bit on feral hogs and there isn’t really any difference since both kill very quickly.

But on Buffalo I personally don’t see the need in going any smaller than a 375. Certainly not on anything bigger than a buffalo.

Suitable ammo is widely available all over Africa for the 375 as well.

I may use my 9.3x62 on Eland for which it seems absolutely perfect.

Hi Ruraldoc,

Which CZ 9.3x62 do you have?
I'm curious how you find the handling of the CZ 9.3x62 as compared to the Model 70 Alaskan in 375 H&H?
I've been surprised how handy the Alaskan is.

Thanks,
Bush Buck

 

[Ruraldoc]

I have a CZ 550 Classic which does not have the euro style stocks of most 550s.

Mine has a 23.6 inch inch barrel and is accurate with a conventional( not set) trigger.

The only thing I don’t like about it is that it came with no iron sights.

It is lighter, shorter and handier than my M70 Alaskan.

I think it is pretty close to being an ideal plains game rifle. I have only shot hogs with mine so far.

I think it’s about perfect for eland, as well as big cats and will probably take it to Africa on my next trip.

It is about as handy as a typical 30-06 sporter but packs a lot more punch.

I will probably use it for deer before our season ends this year in Alabama. More power than needed but I don’t expect to have to track one very far with it.

 

[Flewis]

I

Bob my reply that you have answered was a bit tongue in check. Remember I pointed out that the difference between the 9.3X62 and the 375 is the same difference between the 35 Whelen and the 9.3X62. So if the 9.3X62 is the same as 375 and the 35Whelen must then be the same as a 9.3X62 ergo the 35 Whelen must be the same as a 375.

Now we know that is not the case, the 35 Whelen is not a 9.3X62 and a 9.3X62 is not the same as a 375 when both are loaded to their potential. You mention the hunters of your recon a X62 loaded with a 320 grain projectile and they are comparing this to a 375 with a 300 grain projectile not a 350 grain projectile. If we do comparisons then lets compare apples with apples.

Re the bit about the 300 grain projectiles from a 375 bending, I have not read this before but I would not be surprised as the 6.5X54 rounds did that. However you then mention the X63 was judged using steel cored solids, guess what happened when the 375 used steel cored solids. Like I said apples with apples. Just remember those writing the book on the 9.3 appear to have a product they want to push.

I had the 300 grain 375s bend on buffalo follow up shots. Yeah it was 30 years ago but I still have less faith in the 375 than I once had. If legal I would take the 9.3 or 35w loaded right.

 

[IvW]

I

I had the 300 grain 375s bend on buffalo follow up shots. Yeah it was 30 years ago but I still have less faith in the 375 than I once had. If legal I would take the 9.3 or 35w loaded right.

That is a bullet issue not a caliber issue.....
But yes the 9.3's with the right bullet are more than capible...

 

[Flewis]

That is a bullet issue not a caliber issue.....
But yes the 9.3's with the right bullet are more than capible...

Yes I agree but when you have an issue it stays with you. There’s a reason the 375 is so well thought of and I still recommend them to anyone. I still have 2 and have owned 6.

 

[Ruraldoc]

I remember discussing rifles with my Outfitter/PH before going to Africa.

He does about 30 buffalo hunts a year and I asked him about three rifles for my upcoming buffalo hunt.

I asked him about the 9.3x62, he said it will work and many European clients use it.

I asked him about my 375 H&H and he said most of his hunters used it and it worked fine as well. He did add that it worked on everything in Africa.

But when I told him I had a 416 Remington in a Model 70 that been worked over by Dennis Olsen and that I shot it as well as the 9.3 and the 375, he said “Bring it, it’s a perfect buffalo rifle and cartridge”.

So I took the 416 and had a no drama one shot kill on a big bull. 3 weeks later my friend JHT had a double on two dagga boys with an identical 416, at less than 10 yards in thick brush on the last afternoon of a 10 day hunt.

I personally don’t want to pick a fight with a bull buffalo with anything smaller but lots of people have. Especially when accompanied by a PH with a large caliber stopping rifle.

I want to be able handle trouble myself if it comes. I did notice that Kevin Robertson had a client rifle in 9.3 which he loved but carried a 505 himself. Perhaps the most influential advocate for the 9.3 today, personally carried a bigger rifle.

 

[Tex .416]

The balser offers you the ability to regulate the barrels, scope or red dot or open sights......accuracy will surpass any sxs configuration....

Wouldn’t all well made bolt actions have better accuracy at all distances than SxS’s?

 

[rdog]

I understand where you’re coming from.

Part of how it may be done is to not seat the bullet in as deep as American manufacturers like to go.
Some of the old rounds, like the 8x57, the Europeans would just seat the bottom of the bullet right where the shoulder and the neck meet.
From what I understand, that can sort of be done with the 9.3x62 as well, because most rifle makers make them with very long throats, to keep the pressures down on the heavier projectiles, like 300 gr and above.
I hope that helps explain a little more.
Plus, some of the load data will be compressed in the 9.3x62 as well.


Hawk

As an old bloke that has been around the block a few times, & owns both a 9.3x62 & a 375 . Here is my take on this . the 375 has a heavier bigger dia bullet & more case capacity its got to be capable of better ballistics than the 9.3 . most 375s are on longer mag length actions = LOAL, the 9.3 is usually on the std 30/06 length mag boxes actions which governs the bullet seating depth & that can reduce the powder capacity in the case . Both are great cartridges ,loaded to safe pressures the 375 has more power.

 

[IvW]

Wouldn’t all well made bolt actions have better accuracy at all distances than SxS’s?

I am talking O/U vs SxS not bolt action......

 

[RayAtkinson]

Ive been hunting Africa and the NA continent for many many years and much of that with the 9,3x62 and I doubt that any one could tell the difference in killng effect between the 375 H&H and the 9,3x62. I settled on RL-16 and RL-17..