Small or Large Outfits-which one does one pick?

[FallowJaeger]

My question is this, what is the preferred method of picking an outfitter/PH. Do folks like to work with a large outfitter that has many PH's working and there are many other hunters in camp or do folks want a more personalized experience choosing to go with outfitter/PH where they are with you in the field and you/your party are the only ones in camp. What are the pros and cons of each? Thank you for any feedback.

 

[revturbo9967]

The size of the outfit shouldn’t matter as much as reputation. There are plenty of bad, small operators as well as large. The amount of other clients in camp is a personal preference. Some large operations will have many hunters in at a the same time which many do not like. Some small operators in SA will not have their own property to hunt and will need to take you from ranch to ranch in order to get the game you’re looking for.

Personally, I want to be the only one in camp unless I know the other hunters very very well.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

I have stayed with property owners at their home and I VERY much preferred that over the lodge experience. I rarely even have a beer these days so hanging around the lodge's bar at night isn't a big drawing card for me. The campfire scene isn't terribly important either. My hearing is not the greatest and I'm usually too tired at the end of the day to be much for conversation. Eating definitely is way down the list. I'm happy enough with just a ham sandwich for lunch. I do enjoy trying the wild game for dinner, more so than big beef steaks or seafood. Nice thing about staying with the farmers is I usually am fed local fare. Something good but not fancy ... and new to me. Also, staying at the farmhouse means no long commute to hunting property from the lodge. I don't mind the drives because I get to see new country, historic towns, etc., but I prefer to be hunting as much as possible.

 

[JimP]

I have hunted with both and personally I really don't have a preference.

The small outfit had a great amount of land. They were small enough that they hired outside PH's if the needed more for a larger group. THE PH that I had with that outfitter was outstanding. He knew the area along with other areas that we hunted.

The larger outfitter was a lot like the small one. My PH with them had only guided for them for a short time but he was also outstanding.

 

[Berettaco]

Hard to say - lots of variables. I guess it would largely depend on the amount of personal attention each can provide. I’ve hunted with large and small outfits and there’s pros and cons for each. Im happy as long as they meet the basic requirements I ask for - if they go above and beyond then that cements future hunts and recommendations to other hunters.
Large outfits may have more properties, multiple lodges and lots of other hunters around where the smaller outfits may not. This is not an absolute statement - as I said there are lots of variables.
Personally I have had much more enjoyable experiences with the smaller outfits - you get to know the owner/outfitter/operator and are treated more like a friend than a checkbook. I

 

[WoodFire]

My personal experience has been better with smaller outfitters. You will matter a lot more to a smaller outfitter being a larger percentage of their revenue and reputation for the year. I think this is just human nature/economics. However, make sure you are getting what you want in terms of available land, species, amenities, etc. I also highly recommend communication with your actual PH (if it's not the outfitter/owner) before committing. There are some combinations of PH/client that aren't a good match. This can be difficult to judge ahead of time but it's impossible if you don't get to meet/speak with them. Just my .02.

 

[Rare Breed]

My question is this, what is the preferred method of picking an outfitter/PH. Do folks like to work with a large outfitter that has many PH's working and there are many other hunters in camp or do folks want a more personalized experience choosing to go with outfitter/PH where they are with you in the field and you/your party are the only ones in camp. What are the pros and cons of each? Thank you for any feedback.

It is a personal thing. For me on my Safaris I do not want large groups. I like the personal experience. I have been by myself several times with no one but me in camp and this year excited to hunt with three other friends but it will still be just us. I find I get more out of the total experience that way with no surprises in camp with people I do not know. I like like minds hunting together

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

I have hunted with three small outfitters, one of them twice! The best where I hunted twice was @Tally-Ho HUNTING SAFARIS . I developed personal relationships with Stuart the owner, and @rudi nel the PH. My wife and I both have a great rapport with Chef Kharen, and my wife and Stuart’s wife exchanged gifts and got to know each other. I met Stuart’s daughter and PH, Kaitlyn (sp?) who is a very fine person.

I hunted another small outfit where I very much liked the PH, trackers, skinners, but not the owner. Definitely not the owner. I wish he’d have stayed away. Then there was another small operator who constantly bitched about using too much Internet, cost of petrol, his staff and so on.

For me, one of three small outfitters was a great experience. Another was okay, and the last was not. I imagine a larger outfit would have been on par with okay small outfitter. Lots of good things but a bad thing or two.

Another small outfitter who deserves mention is @Lex Strauss SAFARIS . I've gotten know via PMs and What's App conversations. Another is Lon Denny of @Tokoloshe Safaris. Both Lon and Lex are definitely worth considering.

This Africa Hunting forum is perhaps the best tool for finding the outfitter large or small where one will experience their best hunt! How you may ask? Easy, by reading other member’s hunt reports, and then contacting those members. Phone conversations reveal much, much more than do emails and PMs.

 

[R.M.C.]

I've only been once and I chose a place that books one party at a time, I did not regret it. I have no problem meeting other hunters or whatever but for a once (or twice hopefully) in a lifetime hunt, I want all hands on deck making sure my hunt is going well. I always found it relaxing that the whole schedule of the camp revolved around what time we happened to get back from hunting. I've done bear hunts in Maine with twenty something hunters per week and had a great time so I'm sure its more than likely you'll have a good time no matter what you choose. I went with Moretla safaris in Limpopo, they're a husband/wife team of PHs that just book one group. Good luck with your research.

 

[Tundra Tiger]

I think there are several factors but maybe two that address what you ask.

First, like @revturbo9967 said, you want someone with a stellar reputation. Frankly, IMHO, we have so many reputable outfitters on here that it really shouldn't be a problem to find one.

After that, I'd say it's "what kind of person are you"? There was a recent thread on here about a particular outfitter, and it seemed to me that they cater to larger groups. That was fine with some and not with others. For gregarious sorts, that's probably just what they want, as long as other criteria are met. Me? I am a card carrying introvert. I am fine on solo hunts, so outfitters with fewer clients is what I want. This past trip for me, due to a late cancellation by another party, was terrific: just little ol'me. My first trip it was me and two brothers from Mississippi. That was fine as well; it was a delight to get to know them. (BTW... my two were with @GAME 4 AFRICA SAFARIS)

So... what's your preference? Are you a people person? Or more of a loner?

 

[Rare Breed]

I have hunted with three small outfitters, one of them twice! The best where I hunted twice was @Tally-Ho HUNTING SAFARIS . I developed personal relationships with Stuart the owner, and @rudi nel the PH. My wife and I both have a great rapport with Chef Kharen, and my wife and Stuart’s wife exchanged gifts and got to know each other. I met Stuart’s daughter and PH, Kaitlyn (sp?) who is a very fine person.

I hunted another small outfit where I very much liked the PH, trackers, skinners, but not the owner. Definitely not the owner. I wish he’d have stayed away. Then there was another small operator who constantly bitched about using too much Internet, cost of petrol, his staff and so on.

For me, one of three small outfitters was a great experience. Another was okay, and the last was not. I imagine a larger outfit would have been on par with okay small outfitter. Lots of good things but a bad thing or two.

Another small outfitter who deserves mention is @Lex Strauss SAFARIS . I've gotten know via PMs and What's App conversations. Another is Lon Denny of @Tokoloshe Safaris. Both Lon and Lex are definitely worth considering.

This Africa Hunting forum is perhaps the best tool for finding the outfitter large or small where one will experience their best hunt! How you may ask? Easy, by reading other member’s hunt reports, and then contacting those members. Phone conversations reveal much, much more than do emails and PMs.

For specifics I can personally recommend both TSALA and Game 4 Africa as well as Dalton & York. CMS is well thought of as well

 

[MarkB]

My preferred method of picking an outfitter is pick the most honest one. I have asked for a camp with my party only on all safaris, with the small outfitters this has always been fulfilled, with the larger ones it was promised but NOT delivered. With the PH and my group in camp it becomes much more enjoyable for me, no drunk egos, no loud camps and a safari as I ask for.

My best hunts were with PH's who welcomed me as family, into their homes, eating with their loved ones, me helping and discussing plans. This happened in Namibia but Wayne @NYAMAZANA SAFARIS in Zim holds first place.

For me when I end a safari I always feel saddened its over but when you "bond" with the PH or outfitter it feels that much more special. Smaller outfits have promised, delivered and met that for me.

MB

 

[Tanks]

Until last year I never shared a camp with non-family, and that was one hunter who was hunting a lion etc.. I prefer to be the only one in camp. One good thing about CMS is that at Dande they have multiple camps, so they can isolate the hunters. The 500K+ acres is large enough that the PHs can co-ordinate and not run into each other.

Nyakasanga was where I shared a camp and I had no issues.

One thing, if you ask to be by yourself then tip the camp staff and skinner accordingly. In my case that is 9 people including the trackers and the PH. I also tip the park ranger and game scout based on the work they do. At Dande they worked just as hard as the trackers setting up baits and carrying meat. At Nyakasanga, that ranger was just along for the ride.

Below the game scout is carrying meat, and the ranger the whole backskin of the buffalo. It was a bit over two miles to the truck. They (including the trackers) made two trips to get everything in.

 

[375Fox]

I think it really depends on the hunt you’re looking for. If I’m looking for a private land hunt in South Africa or Namibia, I’d generally prefer to hunt with a smaller outfitter and have a more personalized hunt. I think they generally have access to the same quality properties that larger outfitters do for plains game. Some of the bigger outfitters do have better access to big 5 areas. I like being able to plan my hunt with who I’ll hunt with and having camp to myself. If I’m looking at hunting concession areas outside South Africa, I think the bigger outfitters with multiple camps are the better choice. You will typically still have camp to yourself, maybe one other hunter. Being able to change camps mid-hunt can mean the difference of a successful hunt and an unsuccessful hunt in a concession area if the game has moved across the river. I also think the bigger outfitters generally have secured the best areas because they can afford them. There are a lot of variables that go into deciding. There are pros and cons to both. I’d say the cons generally increase as the number of hunters in camp grows though and in concession areas the number of cons increase with decreasing prices. Just have to pick a balance for what you want.

 

[Mark Biggerstaff]

So far for me in five trips it has all been the smaller camps. Where I or my group were the only ones in camp and on the property.
I can get along with about anyone but haven't shared a camp with someone outside my group in Africa. I have here in the states and will never again. I can't tiller at the ones who are loud and heavy drinkers. That's one reason I stick to smaller camps and personalize service. I do tip camp accordingly also.

 

[Hogpatrol]

I've only hunted small, family run outfits and really enjoy that sort of venue. As far as others in camp, I can generally get along with everybody and can find something in common to kibitz about, mostly hunting and firearms.

 

[revturbo9967]

So far for me in five trips it has all been the smaller camps. Where I or my group were the only ones in camp and on the property.
I can get along with about anyone but haven't shared a camp with someone outside my group in Africa. I have here in the states and will never again. I can't tiller at the ones who are loud and heavy drinkers. That's one reason I stick to smaller camps and personalize service. I do tip camp accordingly also.

One of my worst hunts ever was in an elk camp in Colorado with 7 other fellows twice my age. Most could hardly walk through a Walmart without taking a breather let alone hunting elk at 11k feet. It was a disaster of a week, but I learned a ton about what I didn’t want on a hunting trip. I will never hunt with people I don’t know ever again, unless it was extreme circumstances.

 

[Dinsdale]

I think it really depends on the hunt you’re looking for. If I’m looking for a private land hunt in South Africa or Namibia, I’d generally prefer to hunt with a smaller outfitter and have a more personalized hunt. I think they generally have access to the same quality properties that larger outfitters do for plains game. Some of the bigger outfitters do have better access to big 5 areas. I like being able to plan my hunt with who I’ll hunt with and having camp to myself. If I’m looking at hunting concession areas outside South Africa, I think the bigger outfitters with multiple camps are the better choice. You will typically still have camp to yourself, maybe one other hunter. Being able to change camps mid-hunt can mean the difference of a successful hunt and an unsuccessful hunt in a concession area if the game has moved across the river. I also think the bigger outfitters generally have secured the best areas because they can afford them. There are a lot of variables that go into deciding. There are pros and cons to both. I’d say the cons generally increase as the number of hunters in camp grows though and in concession areas the number of cons increase with decreasing prices. Just have to pick a balance for what you want.

Lot of merit in this post.

I’ve shared camp in Zim with CMS on Dande 2 times now. One with an employee of a major bullet manufacturer( brought a guest) and another with a retired Air Force officer ( brought his wife). Had a very good experience with each; and having a huge concession to our selves; we never ran into each other except dinner and maybe a brief exchange in the morning.

Even had the guest come along on our truck to shoot a baboon with my PH as thats what we were doing for the day; and we had a great time. Made a terrific shot using my rifle on a huge male perched on a termite mound. He was going to sit in camp as they were humping long miles tracking elephant and we were just relaxing taking a drive to spot and stalk something if we were interested. I remember that hunt as much as any of my own from the trip.

Rather enjoyed meeting those folks and their PH’s, that was good exposure too.

I have booked SA and Namibia with smaller outfits where I was the only one in camp for the same reasons as some posted. I did a couple caribou hunts with many hunters in camp and one of those was a disaster of loud mouth drunks. Not interested in big camps with many groups.

 

[TKessel]

Just my two cents, I prefer small operators, even in the states.
My wife and I are outfitters here in the states for the past 22 years.
I had a client ask me a question years ago and once I got to thinking about his question, we revamped our whole business plan. His question was “ Which one of the guides here would you personally hunt with?”
I pointed to my number one and he said “ok that’s who I’m hunting with, as I’m paying the tab for the group I brought you!”
The hunt went well and the last evening he came to settle up and asked if I was going to ask him why he didn’t want to hunt with the outfitter?
He went on to explain that he knew I was the owner and if he hunted with me, I would probably be partially distracted while hunting because I would be thinking about other things such as, are the other guides doing well, is the cook in the bottle, is the camp getting organized as needed etc….

Once I sat and thought about what he said, I truly understood and he was correct. We changed our business model and very rarely will mix any groups, and my wife and I handle everything from start to finish on all our hunts. We feel it’s a better atmosphere and we get to know all our clients.
This is what we look for when we personally hunt with an outfitter.
Hope I didn’t get long winded, I’m sure some big outfits work and do well, but it’s not for me.
Tom

 

[steve white]

Depends...for example if I were after leopard. If ONE guy runs the operation, and if he has a client the week before you arrive, HE HAS HAD NO FREE TIME TO KILL BAIT OR HANG IT FOR YOUR HUNT!! Grrrrr. Doesn't matter if you have paid for it in advance, there is only one of him, and you show up to nothing prepared and very little chance of success. Plus, he probably cannot AFFORD to make things right if things go wrong, or even hire someone else to help in advance so things don't go wrong in the first place. So, it might work out--but with a larger outfit there are more to take up the slack and get it done for you.