Youth hunt stolen

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by John J, Jul 13, 2018 at 12:11 PM.

  1. John J

    John J AH Senior Member

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    It seems every year since the Colorado dept of Wildlife became Dept of Parks and Wildlife, the website is ever changing and over complicated to navigate. This year you have to establish an account, password protected and the only payment collected is the application fee. If you draw your account is charged at that time. I was having problems logging into my son's account so I stopped by a DPW office to see what he drew. They told me unfortunately there was no funds in my account when they went for payment. I had no idea what the lady was talking about then it hit me. A while back my account had a fraudulent charge in Arlington TX. The bank shut down my account. I was not in the same state as my bank and couldn't get a new card so they mailed me one. Two weeks later all was good, my money was returned and account reactivated. Turns out that was the time DPW wanted money for the antelope tag my son drew. No payment, no tag. I had nothing to say I was beside myself there was nothing they or I could do. My son took it in stride he said it was ok. We will see if there is any leftover antelope tags in a few weeks when they become available. My work schedule has me off for once during a hunting season. The more I thought about it the more pissed and upset I became. The SOB that used my account has no idea they stole time away from my son and I. We planned going after elk with an OTC bull elk tag and he now has 2 preference points for mule deer. We will see how his season shapes up, as all is not lost. John
     

  2. rookhawk

    rookhawk AH Elite

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    That's a really unfortunate blow for any father. John J I'm really sorry to hear of your misfortune.

    It can be a case study that whenever possible, for every transaction, always, to use a major credit card to diminish *some* of these risks. It still really, really sucks to have your son lose out on a hunt like this.
     

  3. Hogpatrol

    Hogpatrol SILVER SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    Yep, that sucks big time. Only so many days to hunt and enjoy the company of your offspring. It seems the more these eggheads try and simplify things, the more they complicate them.
     

  4. cagkt3

    cagkt3 PLATINUM SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    Hate to hear that
     

  5. CAustin

    CAustin AH ENABLER BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Ambassador

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    There is always some technical glitch waiting out there to jump up and bite us. Im sorry this happened to you sir but what can you do?
     

  6. John J

    John J AH Senior Member

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    Even if there are no leftover tags available I will still be out there with him. I'll be home that weekend, we can look for coyotes they are usually running around.
     
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  7. MS Hitman

    MS Hitman BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Enthusiast

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    That does suck big time. Too bad that fellow can't be rehabilitated with a stout oak limb and rope.
     

  8. enysse

    enysse AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    I hate sounding like sour grapes but most of the western states in the USA use non-residents like an ATM.....I find it highly dissatisfying. They spend a lot of time marketing hunting opportunities but then give out very few tag and charge a non-resident 10X what a resident pays.
     

  9. Hogpatrol

    Hogpatrol SILVER SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    Roger that. At some point in the very near future when the boomers stop hunting, the wolves and coyotes will hunt and take them for free.
     
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  10. markferrigno

    markferrigno AH Veteran

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    Colorado (CPW) is a mess. In 2018 they finally went to an electronic system for tag payment/refund. Last year, when I (naturally) didn't get drawn they mailed out refund checks. (after charging my card) Yes checks, like it is 1980. That must have been VERY cost effective. I am surprised I didn't have to fax in my draw requests.

    The entire state is crawling with Mule Deer but good luck getting a tag. Here in Colorado Springs there are daily Deer strikes. They estimate the Deer population at 18-20 per square mile. A healthy population is 2-3 per square mile. Gov solution is not more hunting, that would make sense. No they want to pay "Sharp Shooters" (what the hell are those anyway) to kill the Deer. Why let hunters hunt when we can pay to cull and waste the Deer and use taxpayer dollars to do it.

    No OTC Deer tags. This must be one of the few states a resident can't just buy a Deer tag and hunt. The entire hunt system is a disaster.

    The prices they charge for non-residents, esp. Elk are insane but the system for residents is terrible. It is like Deer are made of Gold and must be protected at any cost. CPW is terrible organization and terribly run. They spend their resources trying to "violate" everyone (we know you are guilty of something, we just need to find it)

    They are already stressing about the declining number of hunters and loss of revenue. They just doubled the price of a Waterfowl Stamp starting next year and indexed future increases to inflation. But, when you need a lawyer and a PHD to figure out the draw system these are the side effects. (they hold seminars on how to navigate the draw system. If you need a seminar it is too complicated)

    Hunters have had enough.
     
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  11. JimP

    JimP AH Elite

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    When dealing with any of the states that require a CC to be charged after drawing the tag you need to be up on what is going on with that card so that when the time comes it is valid. Some states will try calling you if the charge is denied while other find that it is your responsibility to change the card to be charged if something happens to it where it is no longer valid. For this reason I just use one card for all my applications and know that if I do get a different CC number that I need to correct the CC number for where I have either a upcoming charge or monthly reoccurring charges.

    As for the deer in Colorado Springs the problem is private property where the owners will not allow you to hunt or have it leased out to outfitters for the big dollars that paying hunters will pay. It is the same all along the front range of Colorado, I know of some great bucks just to the west of Denver but you are never going to be able to access that property to hunt them. That is the main reason that there are a lot of deer in those areas, when they don't get hunted the population grows
     

  12. Hogpatrol

    Hogpatrol SILVER SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    Damn, that sounds like Pennsylvania. Still have to apply by snail mail for antlerless tags and then they snail mail them back to you. Like I said, once the boomers are gone, hunting in the U.S. will effectively be a rich man's sport.
     

  13. markferrigno

    markferrigno AH Veteran

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    Private property or not my original point stands, they hold on to those Deer tags like they are the Crown Jewels. You can't get an OTC tag, good luck on the draw. Private property owners have nothing to do with how CPW hands out tags......

    I am ok with Private Property owners managing game like they do in Europe. Own the land, own the game. Then the game have value and they get managed properly. The system we have now, the King owns all the game and occasionally lets us peasants hunt them. They have no value to the state, so management is poor. How can any entity manage all game populations for a state the size of Colorado, or any state for that manner.
     
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  14. Scott CWO

    Scott CWO AH Veteran

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    John,
    Let me know if I can help. I have some landowner vouchers for Pronghorn available in unit 87 and unit 105. We usually use them for guided hunts but if your budget is limited, maybe we can work something else out? In unit 87, I have a 22,000 acre ranch and in unit 105, I have 8,000 acres. Send me a PM.

    The CPW is supposed to be sending out an email to successfully drawn hunters with invalid credit cards so my advice is for everyone to monitor their emails closely. Maybe yours was missed or went into your spam filter? Who knows.
     
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  15. Scott CWO

    Scott CWO AH Veteran

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    Mark,
    Mule deer tags in CO haven’t been OTC since 1998. Certain units are managed for high quality bucks and can take several preference points to draw but there are many areas where they can be drawn with a few or even zero points but you have to travel away from your home sometimes depending on where you live. You can’t always expect to hunt out your back door if you live in a unit with very low tag numbers.

    Overall, mule deer cannot support the hunting pressure that whitetail deer can withstand. Even with limited tags, our statewide mule deer populations have decreased from over 600,000 to just over 400,000 in just the last several years due to habitat loss, predation and severe winters in parts of Western Colorado. Your problem near COS of too many deer is not indicative of the whole state. I know the regs inside out and backwards so if you need help before applying in 2019, give me a shout. I would be happy to assist.
     
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  16. John J

    John J AH Senior Member

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    Scott CWO thank you very much for the offer I'll keep you in mind. I will keep an eye out for an email from CPW and see if there are any leftovers available. Ever since Gov Hick combined Parks and DOW it has been a mess. I usually hunt deer and elk outside the springs and the "problem" is private land. DOW even has a study posted that private land owners need to open up to hunters in the area. Landowners say to many animals tearing up fences ect and public hunters say lack of animals. But I can't blame the landowners for not opening up and or being leery of the public. Look at some of the shooting areas that are trashed up that way. It may be more kids camping, shooting and making a mess than hunters but I feel its a blemish to us all I that respect.
     

  17. markferrigno

    markferrigno AH Veteran

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    Thank you for the offer, but it goes back to m original point. If the average hunter can't figure out how to apply for tags,what the regs are, etc. then the system is too complicated and it needs to needs to be fixed.

    I have no idea how the state determined the total Mule Deer population decreased 200K in several years but that number seems inflated. How can they even count the state-wide population? Seems like they just make it up.......If CWD is to blame then it seems to me more hunting is answer as less dense deer populations will help prevent the disease from spreading.

    Where is the loss of habitat? Why aren't Elk, Bear and Mountain Lion affected? Why only Mule Deer?

    If predators are such an issue than why isn't CPW out there shooting Mountain Lions instead of deer?

    I hunted Elk in Craig last year, I never saw so many Mule Deer in my life. Every street, every lawn, the Walmart parking lot, on the side of every road, every patch of green had a Mule Deer on it, all times of the day. Mule Deer, like rats in NYC. I can't say how the rest of the sate is but between CoS and Craig there seem to be plenty of Mule Deer, yet Draw only.
     

  18. JimP

    JimP AH Elite

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    I live just west of Vail in unit 44 and I would love to see where you are seeing that many mule deer. 30 years ago there were a lot more than there is today but now you are hard pressed to just take a drive and see 20 or more. I have also driven through the Craig area and it is much the same, that is unless you hit it just right when they are grouped up headed to their wintering grounds or are on their wintering grounds.

    As for the predictors the CP&W is trying a few things with them. In the Rifle area they are thinning them out more than any other place to see if it will help the mule deer and elk come back. But even where I live and play the elk herd is down close to 50% in the last dozen years, and I live in prime elk habitat.

    As for the counts, they do it during the winter when the animals are bunched up using helicopters. They can't count all of the deer and elk but they come up with a very representative number of the population.
     

  19. LivingTheDream

    LivingTheDream AH Elite

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    Colorado recent change to app fee only on Sheep and goats opened the flood gates. In 3 years the odds will be terrible (not that they were awesome to begin with). Sure they will quietly start raising the point fee every year and will be like Wyoming, where a sheep point is 150 dollars.
     
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  20. markferrigno

    markferrigno AH Veteran

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    I was in Craig last Nov for rifle season and you could not throw a stone without hitting a mule Deer. They were literally everywhere. I saw the biggest Buck I have ever seen in the Walmart parking lot. I saw little 15x15 lawns, each with a Mule Deer on it. Driving from the Hunting Ranch to Craig, nothing but Mulies on either side of the road. Maybe that only happens in NOV but the city and surrounding area were overrun with Deer....
     

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