Your Thoughts: Free Daily Rates?

[Kowas Adventure Safaris]

Hallo Ah.Com FRIENDS

I was wondering.... What are your thoughts on a lot of African Outfitters marketing hunts at "NO DAILY RATES" or "FREE DAILY RATES"?

Where you just pay the trophy fee...

Do you like it?
Is it appealing?
Does it seem "to good to be true"?
Or don't you like it?

Looking forward to hearing everyone's thoughts!

 

[MMAL]

I think free daily rates gets our attention but only our attention. Every “deal” is looked over for what we believe will be the final price. We look at trophy fees, transportation, taxidermy etc. I would be shocked if every hunter out there did not have a spreadsheet or at least back of the envelope calculation that takes all this into effect. Once that is done then we check reputation etc. the end result is I will make a decision based on reputation, location price and my perceived value of the facts.

 

[Divernhunter]

That all depends on the cost of the animals, other costs such as airport pick up, extra charges for other things, quality of service and animals, any cost to get animals to dip-in-pack and such. What matters to me is the bottom line costs, quality of hunt overall, having animals I want to hunt and quality of animals. Also how well do I think I will get along with the outfitter/PH--before, during and after the hunt.

 

[wesheltonj]

Nothing is "free" the costs are made up elsewhere.

 

[jeff]

I personally like very low day rates and the outfitters profit is in the trophy fees, that way if a hunt is poor the cost is low and if the hunt is successful they still make their profit. Performance pays, I also realize that is a general statement and there are always variables.

 

[Red Leg]

It's a marketing gimmick that might work on the uninformed or new hunters going to Africa. Or perhaps in Jeff's example above. PG hunts in any given region tend to fall in a fairly narrow cost model - if they didn't, a very few outfits would own the market. It is all about how those costs are identified and tallied.

 

[BSO Dave]

I've seen marketing gimmicks from every angle on this site and others, and those with the no daily fees offers certainly do get your interest. At least for that I think the outfitter was successful in their attempt to get you to take a look at them.

From there, I suppose it is up to the individual consumer to research to determine if they have a discovered a true deal or not. I am old school and I also believe that nothing is free. Costs are either made up elsewhere or something is sacrificed in most cases. Yet there are legitimate deals and offers made here from time to time that reflect a genuine value. Usually those deals are fairly straight forward in their appearance, and the outfitter's reputation backs that up.

 

[Buckdog]

Hallo Ah.Com FRIENDS

I was wondering.... What are your thoughts on a lot of African Outfitters marketing hunts at "NO DAILY RATES" or "FREE DAILY RATES"?

Where you just pay the trophy fee...

Do you like it?
Is it appealing?
Does it seem "to good to be true"?
Or don't you like it?

Looking forward to hearing everyone's thoughts!

I LOVE IT NO DAY FEES BRING IT ON!!
OK I WANT A LEOPARD HUNT WITH NO DAY FEES AND TROPHY FEE MAKE ME AN OFFER
I do not like high day fees and low trophy fees that puts the risk on me, no day fee and a bigger trophy fee risk is on the PH and outfit, put them in my gun sights make money you don't then you go hungry.
And yes I realize there is no such thing as a free lunch that the trophy fees will most likely be higher to make back the profit lost without day fees.
Just like I know that "cheap" package hunts are just that you will most likely be shooting lower quality animals especially in RSA where it is a pay to play game in reality. again no free lunch.

 

[Mekaniks]

I have only been on one PG hunt and don’t have anywhere close to the experience that some others around here have but here’s my 2c anyway...

When I see these “no daily rates” or “ low daily rates”, “free observer” ect deals that come up, the first thing I personally do is go look at the trophy fees. I want to know is if the trophy fees are “special”to this package or if they are the standard trophy fees that the Outfitter lists with his other packages. That usually tells if the trophy fees are being inflated to offset the costs of the reduced daily fees. Then I try to compare those trophy fees with other outfitters in a similar area, i.e, Limpopo, Namibia, Eastrn Cape ect... Then I look at any other potential costs like VAT and transportation. And compare those costs with other packages the Outfitter may have or simililar outfitters in the area have.
After all that I will look at the outfitters reputation and try to discern hunting types (free range, high fence, put and take, ect)
In my opinion there have been some very good “eye catching” packages offered by outstanding outfitters lately. While it’s easy to be skeptical of “too good to be true” offers, with some reasearch and a little patience I think there are some really good value hunting opportunities out there right now.
At the end of the day these Oufitters live or die on their reputations, referrals and repeat clients. So it’s totally possible that if a hunter does his research he can land a “deal that fits” and with an Outfitter that really just wants folks to come hunt with him so that they will go home and tell their friends about the great hunt they just had.
And maybe even rebook again in the future....

 

[Royal27]

Marketing gimmick and the sudden number of "free" offers makes me wonder if bookings are down?

What I don't like with this one is it is smoke and mirrors, assuming there is a minimum amount to be spent, which any outfitter with any sense would put in there. I think I've seen one that didn't mention a minimum in the ad, and I bet they would have a minimum before the deal is signed. If not, I want to take a 30 day hunt next fall. I need to improve on my impala. 30 days should be enough time for that, right?

Back to the smoke and mirrors.... So a $4k minimum fee if you shoot nothing. To me that's a day fee. It's the price I'm going to pay regardless of what I shoot. It's just not called a day fee.

Give me a reasonable day fee and a reasonable trophy fee and I will be happy. I don't like packages as they added pressure to "shoot the list" for me. I will never do one again I don't think. I'd rather pay as I go. And the gimmick of no day fees is a package being taken further....

Sell your product, not your gimmick.

 

[BRICKBURN]

Looks like a way to break into a crowded market.
If it's a loss leader, that's what it is. Part of the marketing budget to subsidize the day fees.
Check it out, make sure it is what it is. If it fits for you, buy it.

 

[CAustin]

Nothing in this life is truly free. That being said like some others I prefer to have a reasonable day rate and reasonable trophy fees. Everybody likes to make a good deal now and then. when the outfitter says no day fees and you then see trophy fees that went up 30% overnight it’s a big disappointment. I would hasten to add I too would like a leopard hunt with no day fees! Can somebody hook me up on that!?

 

[brandondd24]

I did a no day fee hunt this past September, myself and a friend were only required 5 animals each. The price list was not inflated. It was a sponsor here on ah, game4africa. There are good places out there. I ended up taking more animals because the no day fees. I’d do it again!
My 2 cents
Brandon

 

[Savage Hunter]

I'm not in the market for a hunt.
The "no day fees" are an interesting approach. I don't think of it as a gimmick, no more than selling a package.
I noticed some in the past that were no day fees, but the animal price list was different than the regular list. Maybe that's a gimmick.

But, I notice one outfit's offer on here recently that used the same price list. Now that's not a gimmick. It is straightforward.

If I were in the market for a hunt in the next couple of years, I would think about the animals I wanted.
I would look at the fine offer posted recently and see what my animal list added up to.
Then I would inquire with other outfits to quote me the same "package" of desirable animals.

What I see is that a lot of packages don't offer "no day fees", but their package comes out to a similar price as the other. So "no day fees" or "discounted animals", but still
came to a similar total price.

If price matters, study it out. But price certainly shouldn't be the only consideration.

One thing I wish would become standard in the offers from Outfitters, would be defining what a 7 day hunt "is".
To some, it is 7 hunting days.
To some, it is 2 travel days and 5 days hunting.
To some it is 7.5 hunting days.........( with Marius a 7 day hunt turns into 7.5 because you can hunt the first afternoon gratis if you get there in time)

 

[K-man]

I have no problem as long as ALL COSTS AND REQUIREMENTS are listed and straightforward. Same as any other hunt offer. Also as long as you can get the animals you want and don't have to "settle" for a substandard animal, again, just like any other hunt.

 

[brandondd24]

I was treated very fair, it was a great hunt, with great people. And I met kman in camp!

 

[Royal27]

Nothing in this life is truly free. That being said like some others I prefer to have a reasonable day rate and reasonable trophy fees. Everybody likes to make a good deal now and then. when the outfitter says no day fees and you then see trophy fees that went up 30% overnight it’s a big disappointment. I would hasten to add I too would like a leopard hunt with no day fees! Can somebody hook me up on that!?

I'm sure someone will come along with a no day fee for leopard deal.

• Zero day fees
• $14k baiting fee
• $5k trophy fee

Oh and it will likely included $150 airport transfer fee.

 

[Pheroze]

My fear would be the sellers remorse that will come one year later. I buy the no daily fees in 2018 for a 2019 hunt. But by then the outfitter is busy. Now, this deal sucks for them...then what? I want my PH to make money. I want him to be successful. But, let's be fair and not gouge either. Win-win and let's go hunt.

 

[brandondd24]

My opinion stands, I had a great hunt, with no day fees, each thereown

 

[LivingTheDream]

I feel like this is a loaded question. I think no day rates are a fantastic opportunity for new hunters who plan to shoot a bunch of animals. I think it works out well for the Outfitter and the hunter as it takes some financial pressure/risk off the hunter but also allows the outfitter to make money as well.

I think for some one who is targeting one or two species this probably isn't a good deal for the outfitter.

I personally would rather have a reasonable day rate and then middle of the road trophy fees. I feel this presents the best value while minimizing pressure on both parties.

The logic above applies almost entirely to RSA. I know Zambia, Zim, Moz and Tanzania have a completely different set of costs due to infrastructure or government fees.

In regards to Leopard, I would like to see lower day rates and higher trophy fees. I think the hunter needs to be honest with the outfitter and state they are specifically focused on nothing but leopard. I would rather have a low day rate and a 15k trophy fees, then a normal day rate and a 5k trophy fees. But that is just my opinion, and don't have enough insights to the costs to know if this is financially feasible.