Where have the gunsmiths gone....

[Luvthunt]

With the loss of AHR to CZ owners and the CZ Pro shop shutting down along with the change of McMillan ownership the DG rifle work is harder to find folks to do the job. Time, hopefully will correct this but trust must be established with the new folks.
Have read on this website comments as to the overly heavy stocks on CZ Safari magnum stocks so was excited to find a shop in Sparks, Nv that worked on reducing the bulk of a CZ 550 DG stock.

I had one of those overly heavy factory stocks on a CZ 550 Safari 416 Rigby . Rifle shot well and I liked the cartridge but oboy was the rifle bulky and to me somewhat clumsy.So I decided a few weeks ago to try the fellow in Nevada for a face lift on the CZ.Well a week ago the rifle came home from Nv and I can not express my satisfaction strongly enough over the quality of the rework. Ugly duckling to swan says it all.

If interested the shop is under the name of RJ Renner. His web page shows a before and after of a CZ 550 Safari Magnum American rifle.

Just to clear up any thoughts of personal involment I am not in any way,other then this rifle, involved now or in the past with this shop. My only mission is to provide to the members of AH a possible resource.

 

[uplander01]

There is a guild guy building complete rifles from supplied actions that are truly incredible if you're willing to wait. His name is Steve Durren, located ted in Adrian Michigan at a sporting goods store with full smith shop, W Johnson Services. There are lots of good guys out there , problem is they are getting fewer and they are all really busy. That being said there is a lot of good stuff on the market right now.

 

[Zambezi]

No pics means it didn't happen...

 

[Firebird]

I noticed the other day that sportsman’s warehouse offers gunsmith service. There was an ad above the urinal. Never used them as I have a kindly white haired guy that does my stuff. When he goes I don’t know who to try especially for truly custom projects like yours-glad you found a good one!

 

[USMA84DAB]

I can share with you some insight regarding where the riflesmiths have gone.

1. Ruger Americans and Savage 110s make it financially unfeasible to work over Mausers for us hunting nuts. Without work to do, one cannot keep the doors open. The denizens of this board make up a very small elite market. Most guys are happy with the Savage 110 and fire 5-7 rounds of ammo per year.

2. Any man wanting to learn the trade has a choice of only 6 schools across the US. Tuition, TOOLS, room, board, projects to learn on in class - there is nothing cheap about getting rudimentary training. The NRA provided a $1,000 scholarship to me for schooling last summer. That covered 2 of 8 required classes for their gunsmithing certificate. Guess Wayne needed more $5,000 suits. Not being a college age kid, I am not relocating to a community college/2 year school for 2 years to take classes.

3. Opening the doors to your shop have a heinous financial entry barrier!!!! The cost of the mill, lathe, blast cabinet, bandsaws, support tooling, rifle tooling for each model/make, hand tools, welding equipment, blueing equipment - it equates to a house loan. Then there is the cost of the building, either construction or rent.

4. The gun industry is doing it's best to strangle new, one-man shops with their asinine protections for their legacy business base. Leupold will not sell to me as a dealer because I do not have $10,000 worth of signage and a brick and mortar store front. Same for Vortex. Same for Blue Force Gear. After the industry ignores or actively works against/strangles new riflesmiths getting trained up, then who will work on the CZ550s, Mausers, and Winchesters?

5. Politics - if you can find banking services outside of the federal government's and society's effort to strangle your business, then there are things like being prohibited by my county from placing signage outside my shop, as well as prohibiting Client traffic to my shop. The only way I got PERMISSION from my county to open a rifle shop was because I would work as a self-employed, one man shop on the premise that I would ship and receive work via UPS/have no Client traffic. Then there is our buddies at the ATF...

With craftsman dying off, little to no school system, ENORMOUS financial barriers to entry - one must really love to work on rifles.

 

[mark-hunter]

It is surprising fact, the lack of gunsmiths in the land of guns and 2A. (USA) But it is also logically explained.

 

[longbow70]

My gunsmith is doing well; designed his own action, his own cartridges, and is 2 years backlogged. Caters to the long range community. All rifles guaranteed to shoot 1/2 MOA at half a mile or he doesn't ship them. Allen Precision Shooting.

Luckily he worked on my Winchesters and Sakos before he got so well known.

 

[Luvthunt]

As Zambezi requested

 

[Luvthunt]

try again

 

[HuntingGold]

Yes indeed, it does look very nice. Congrats!

 

[Luvthunt]

Big mistake that I did not think to take a before pic.
Also as a camera man I don’t do to good.

 

[Nevada Mike]

Part of the problem is that it takes MANY years to become a competent gunsmith, rather than a 'parts swapper'. So the best 'smiths are often older guys. Of my two or three preferred 'smiths, one is totally retired, another half retired, the third still active but prefers to work for existing customers.

That said, there are a number of younger guys who do excellent work and I seek them out. The ACGG does a good job of qualifying, nurturing, and helping them to exhibit their work and build a customer base.

When I find a good gunsmith/gunmaker I give them work and I don't argue over prices... last thing you want is the guy working on your rifle to be thinking what a tightwad you are...

 

[Zambezi]

try again

View attachment 393423View attachment 393424

Lovely work! Lovely rifle! Thanks.

 

[Luvthunt]

Thank you all, yes do support the comments made it takes experience to become a trusted smith.
RJ Renner specialty seems to be in reworking stocks to mirror the older stock concepts of the past. Altho on this rifle he did other metal work.
However it is the feel of this rifle in my hands that wins the race for me and not only it looks nice it feels as it is ready to get to work.
Enough said.

 

[John P.]

Reminds me of the song "Where Have All The Flowers Gone?"

As the posters have said, there are good gun builders out there, you just gotta find them.

But, as USMA84DAB mentioned, starting out from scratch with the aspiration of becoming a talented gun builder is becoming more and more difficult.

With increasing regulations a constant thing, and the high cost of doing business (building, tooling, machinery, taxes, insurance, etc.) and the stigma the anti gunners have concerning a gun shop in their neighborhood, it seems like a losing battle.

Sad.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

With the loss of AHR to CZ owners and the CZ Pro shop shutting down along with the change of McMillan ownership the DG rifle work is harder to find folks to do the job. Time, hopefully will correct this but trust must be established with the new folks.
Have read on this website comments as to the overly heavy stocks on CZ Safari magnum stocks so was excited to find a shop in Sparks, Nv that worked on reducing the bulk of a CZ 550 DG stock.

I had one of those overly heavy factory stocks on a CZ 550 Safari 416 Rigby . Rifle shot well and I liked the cartridge but oboy was the rifle bulky and to me somewhat clumsy.So I decided a few weeks ago to try the fellow in Nevada for a face lift on the CZ.Well a week ago the rifle came home from Nv and I can not express my satisfaction strongly enough over the quality of the rework. Ugly duckling to swan says it all.

If interested the shop is under the name of RJ Renner. His web page shows a before and after of a CZ 550 Safari Magnum American rifle.

Just to clear up any thoughts of personal involment I am not in any way,other then this rifle, involved now or in the past with this shop. My only mission is to provide to the members of AH a possible resource.

@Luvthunt
The problem in OZ with gunsmiths is that they are getting older, mine is 60 and with the laws we have in regards to being licenced is a raid tape nightmare. Top that off with no younger people wanting to get into the game and the old blokes not wanting the hassles of an apprentice. Gunsmithing cost here are ridiculously low for the work. Mine wanted to charge me mates rates of 200 dollars to chamber, thread and fit a barrel.
I told him he was not getting the job because I wasn't going to steal off him. The going price is twice that amount. I told him if he wanted the job he would have to charge me at least 350 dollars which he did. We were both happy. He gets ALL my work and built my lowall for me. A true master in wood and metal in all types of firearms. He even does restoration work on Purdy and H&H
weapons.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Part of the problem is that it takes MANY years to become a competent gunsmith, rather than a 'parts swapper'. So the best 'smiths are often older guys. Of my two or three preferred 'smiths, one is totally retired, another half retired, the third still active but prefers to work for existing customers.

That said, there are a number of younger guys who do excellent work and I seek them out. The ACGG does a good job of qualifying, nurturing, and helping them to exhibit their work and build a customer base.

When I find a good gunsmith/gunmaker I give them work and I don't argue over prices... last thing you want is the guy working on your rifle to be thinking what a tightwad you are...

@Nevada Mike
That's a problem we have in OZ. People want the good quality work but are tight arses when it comes to paying.
A lot of the customers have deep pockets and short arm syndromes. The hands don't quite reach the wallet.
As you said you want good work be willing to be patient and pay good $$$.
Bob

 

[Deleted member 53080]

CZ 550 upgrades are back

I'm pleased to announce that upgrades for the CZ 550's are available again through Matrix Gunsmithing in Colorado. They will be using the same AHR parts and I will be giving them guidance as they take over the work. They are a professional shop and crew, and I have full confidence in them...

www.africahunting.com