What is your accuracy standard for a Big Bore bolt gun?

[grand veneur]

I overshot a bit in my life with the choice of big bore cartridges. Such cartridges are very efficient, but as a client, you only need cartridges like the 460 Weatherby Magnum or 500 Schüler in very limited circumstances. In retrospect, I know that one can achieve in many cases the same results with cartridges of slightly smaller calibers, and this saves a lot of training and suffering. Unfortunately, that kind of insight only comes after decades of experience.

 

[Safari Dave]

While we all (myself included) love a rifle that shoots MOA groups, a more important factor is 1st shot accuracy from a cold, fouled, bore. No game animal is going to hang around to worry about 2nd shot placement.

This!



My most accurate rimfire (Anshutz) , that I use for long range metallic silhouette will place the first shot exactly where my "dope chart" tells me it will. The next shot might be 2 MOA away, 3- infinity will be sub-MOA, but definitely not where the first, cold, fouled, bore shot hit.


Thank goodness they let us take as many "warm-up" shots as we need, provided we can get dialed in engage 10 consecutive scoring target in 10 minutes.

 

[Big50]

This past weekend @tinktink12 and I went to our favorite range to sight in her new Savage Custom Shop Lady Hunter 30-06, and tune some other rifles for upcoming hunts.

Her first rifle on the bench was the 257 Roberts using the Hammer Fur Hunter bullets. Groups were all under .75 inches. Let's hope they do the job on our upcoming Klipspringer hunt.

Her new 30-06 rifle decided it did NOT like the factory Barnes 150gn X, delivering groups of around 1.5-2 inches. Switching to the Barnes factory 168gn cut groups to between.5 and .75 inches. Since the 168 is our chosen bullet and ammo for this rifle, we thought why bother testing anything else. This will be her rifle and load for cow Elk and similar sized game.

Moving on to bigger calibers my CZ550 in 375 H&H was next. I had some PPU blue box 300 grain and figured it would shoot to a similar point of aim as the Barnes X. Instead the first shot from a sandbag rest went 5 inches high and an inch right. Oh well, let's try again. Second shot went 6 inches low and 2 inches left. The remaining rounds did about the same.

Checked scope, bedding screws, operator headspace, etc. and no problems. With factory Barnes 300gn X bullets, this rifle does 1.5-2 inches. With Remington factory 300gn AFrames, groups are similar to the Barnes, but slightly different poi.

I plan to use this rifle for Croc on an upcoming hunt. If it does 1.5 inches with the Barnes X or Swift AFrames, am I still in the Ballpark, or should I try to get something more accurate?

I have other big bore rifles that group close to an inch or less, but shooting that PPU is messing with my head.

Don't overlook the Nosler E-Tips for the .375! I run those (260 gr) in my .375 and 250 gr in the 9.3x74R. The .375 stays under an inch, which is FINE for anything I'd ever use it for... but the 9.3! Holeee Crrrrap! Quarter- to half-inch groups are the norm. And don't tell anyone, but they are every bit as destructive on impact as the TTSX.
As you can see from the groups posted, the rifle (Ruger #1) is not at all picky about charge weights. I wasted a whole lot of time looking for an accuracy "node" but it seems as long as it involves a shovel full of H-380, it shoots.

 

[Safari Dave]

I occasionally work at a rifle range, and have seen hundreds of guys who could shoot sub MOA groups all day off a bench rest, but not even hit the target at 100 yards offhand.




I've also seen a few guys who's guns weren't capable of 2 MOA, but could place every shot within 4 MOA when shooting offhand. These are they guys that bring home the game during hunting season.


Accuracy under field conditions makes all the difference.

 

[Paul K]

As you can see from the groups posted, the rifle (Ruger #1) is not at all picky about charge weights. I wasted a whole lot of time looking for an accuracy "node" but it seems as long as it involves a shovel full of H-380, it shoots.

My Ruger #1 shoots incredibly small groups with 58.5grs. of Vit. N140 with the 250gr. Nosler Accu-Bonds.

Paul

 

[Paul K]

I do believe we are straying from the OP. I apoligize . I'm done.

Paul

 

[DLSJR]

Too bad her new gun isn't going along. Nothing wrong with 257 but 30-06 is much more versatile. Of course you could always add a slipon recoil pad to temporarily lengthen LOP. And I see some real sexy leather ones up on eBay regularly.

Is 257 too light to penetrate a crocodile's skull?

Here’s the deal about even thinking about a small caliber for a croc…

#1, I can’t imagine a .25 anything being legal for a croc. Even if it is, I can’t imagine any PH allowing it on a fair chase hunt.

#2, crocs are DANGEROUS. They’re sinister bastards. Anytime you’re near water that’s deep or even slopes down quickly OR is muddy, you have to be very aware. They’re incredibly quick and strike without warning. They’ve been killing stuff that way for a living and doing it for decades by the time they’re huntable. Do you want to chance a small, light bullet knowing that if your shot is less than perfect, you’re gonna have a wounded croc that somebody else is going to have to deal with?

#3, the trophy fee on a croc ranges from around $4,500-6,500 depending where you hunt. Do you want to risk that much money on a tiny bullet getting the job done? Especially since a .30 caliber or bigger bullet will do it much more easily and effectively, especially if the bullet placement is a little bit off.

Using a .25 caliber anything on a croc is just a bad idea. Period.

 

[DLSJR]

Use the 257 Roberts for croc.
Best croc rifle we ever had in camp was a 22-250 that would put 10 shots into a golf ball size target at 200m.

No. Just NO.

 

[DLSJR]

hi sir
for a croc you definately need accuracy on your first shot
u need to anchor that lizard where he is
so my personal opinion is double check that gun again, mounts, bases, rings, scope, etc, check the barrel is not touching the stock somewhere (changes in weather cause the stock to swell etc) this is a common problem on CZ. then give gun a good clean and head back to the range, if results are the same or similar then you know thats how the gun shoots. and im not sure i would be happy to take a croc with it
you really can shoot a croc with a .30 cal rifle with barnes bullets no problem, i myself have done it and had clients do it numerous tiles. u actually do not want a fast expanding (thumper) as someone mentioned as they tend to blow the lid off your trophy...literally blow the top of skull off. and depending on the angle of your shot you want a decently constructed bullet to reach that small target

best regards

stu

Stuart, you mean like this…

.338 225 grain Bearclaw. Yes it popped his top. But, he didn’t go anywhere!

 

[FlyGuy]

Don't overlook the Nosler E-Tips for the .375! I run those (260 gr) in my .375 and 250 gr in the 9.3x74R. The .375 stays under an inch, which is FINE for anything I'd ever use it for... but the 9.3! Holeee Crrrrap! Quarter- to half-inch groups are the norm. And don't tell anyone, but they are every bit as destructive on impact as the TTSX.
As you can see from the groups posted, the rifle (Ruger #1) is not at all picky about charge weights. I wasted a whole lot of time looking for an accuracy "node" but it seems as long as it involves a shovel full of H-380, it shoots.

I don’t think I’ve ever met an inaccurate 9.3x62…

 

[FlyGuy]

No. Just NO.

That little Sendero sent many a sunbathing croc to the big beach in the sky.
Bang… slight shiver… go fetch.

 

[skydiver386]

I overshot a bit in my life with the choice of big bore cartridges. Such cartridges are very efficient, but as a client, you only need cartridges like the 460 Weatherby Magnum or 500 Schüler in very limited circumstances. In retrospect, I know that one can achieve in many cases the same results with cartridges of slightly smaller calibers, and this saves a lot of training and suffering. Unfortunately, that kind of insight only comes after decades of experience.

Are you trying to say you attended the University of Trial and Error, also known as the School of Hard Knocks?

 

[Dhutson]

This past weekend @tinktink12 and I went to our favorite range to sight in her new Savage Custom Shop Lady Hunter 30-06, and tune some other rifles for upcoming hunts.

Her first rifle on the bench was the 257 Roberts using the Hammer Fur Hunter bullets. Groups were all under .75 inches. Let's hope they do the job on our upcoming Klipspringer hunt.

Her new 30-06 rifle decided it did NOT like the factory Barnes 150gn X, delivering groups of around 1.5-2 inches. Switching to the Barnes factory 168gn cut groups to between.5 and .75 inches. Since the 168 is our chosen bullet and ammo for this rifle, we thought why bother testing anything else. This will be her rifle and load for cow Elk and similar sized game.

Moving on to bigger calibers my CZ550 in 375 H&H was next. I had some PPU blue box 300 grain and figured it would shoot to a similar point of aim as the Barnes X. Instead the first shot from a sandbag rest went 5 inches high and an inch right. Oh well, let's try again. Second shot went 6 inches low and 2 inches left. The remaining rounds did about the same.

Checked scope, bedding screws, operator headspace, etc. and no problems. With factory Barnes 300gn X bullets, this rifle does 1.5-2 inches. With Remington factory 300gn AFrames, groups are similar to the Barnes, but slightly different poi.

I plan to use this rifle for Croc on an upcoming hunt. If it does 1.5 inches with the Barnes X or Swift AFrames, am I still in the Ballpark, or should I try to get something more accurate?

I have other big bore rifles that group close to an inch or less, but shooting that PPU is messing with my head.

This doesn't sound like a bullet issue. Clean the barrel with a copper-out product, especially if you have shot a lot of Barnes. I shoot the Barnes TSX 300 grain and have never has a group larger than 2 in.

 

[Rare Breed]

I agree, the PPU is not on the same level as most other brands. Unfortunately here in the U.S., it's difficult to find ammunition in anything over 35 caliber, especially metric calibers. S&B and PPU are often all that's available.

I think the box of PPU 375 H&H in question cost me less than $35, and I'm beginning to think I got what I paid for.

I have decided to use PPU for my leopard in my 9.3x62 in their copper with lead center SP given for leopard it will hold together while giving excellent shock and expansion. Would not use this for buff whatsoever

 

[Azklmsr]

Skydiver, I think we may be on the same hunt. Setting up my final loads for my 375 H&H. Shooting better than 1 MOA. 300gr TSX for Buff. 250 TTSX for plains.

 

[coreydb]

Zero to the same three rounds, 1" @100 yds as any other rifle

 

[skydiver386]

Skydiver, I think we may be on the same hunt. Setting up my final loads for my 375 H&H. Shooting better than 1 MOA. 300gr TSX for Buff. 250 TTSX for plains.View attachment 761606

View attachment 761605

My 375 is going to Jarrett Rifles for a tune up before I hunt with it again.

My 450 Rigby likes both the Grizzly ammo and my handloads with all rounds touching at 100 yards and under. I'm planning to do a neck/spine shot on a Croc with the 450grain Barnes TSX. Hope to get a Buff on this hunt too.

 

[45-70guy]

Most rifles can shoot moa or better, I’d say it’s the human error that needs to be worried about. Field conditions and practice , the bench just tells you what the rifle can do to a point as their still is human error at the bench.