Straight-Wall Rimmed Wildcat Ideas

[Saul]

Curious if anyone has seen or considered any of the following straight-wall rimmed wildcats. More of a hypothetical than anything else but I do think there would be some practicality with these. It would be easy to blow out the case to the desired bullet diameter and all would use readily available components.

9.3x74mmR necked up to 0.416
30 R Blaser necked up to 0.423
375 H&H Flanged Magnum necked up to 0.458
450 NE 3.25" necked up to 0.474

 

[PerH]

.375 Fl necked to .423 is a 11,75 Schuler , .404,ballistic and performance in a double.

 

[PerH]

I think it was the name of it , Robert Schuler made it,

Isnt the ,475 NE what you are looking for based on the .450 3.25 in case lenght you are thinking of, have a look at Cartridge Collector web page ,there is many to have a look at.

 

[Saul]

I think it was the name of it , Robert Schuler made it,

Isnt the ,475 NE what you are looking for based on the .450 3.25 in case lenght you are thinking of, have a look at Cartridge Collector web page ,there is many to have a look at.

The 475 NE uses 0.483 bullets which are only available from Woodleigh in one weight and no flat nose solids. If you used the 0.474 bullets instead, you would have much more availability and variety.

 

[xausa]

Curious if anyone has seen or considered any of the following straight-wall rimmed wildcats. More of a hypothetical than anything else but I do think there would be some practicality with these. It would be easy to blow out the case to the desired bullet diameter and all would use readily available components.

9.3x74mmR necked up to 0.416
30 R Blaser necked up to 0.423
375 H&H Flanged Magnum necked up to 0.458
450 NE 3.25" necked up to 0.474

in 1972 I developed a .375 H&H Flanged Magnum wildcat using a .458" bullet I called the .450 C&W Magnum, for Creighton & Warren, the business I was then trying to get started. I still have the Krieghoff "Teck" O/U double rifle I had built around that cartridge. I thought of it as a sort of rimmed .450 Watts.

I took it to Africa once, but never took anything with it other than a Grevy's zebra. I was hoping for a buffalo, but the opportunity did not present itself. Duplicating .450 NE performance in a smaller rimmed case with lower pressure than a .458 WM seemed desirable to me and more suitable for a double rifle or single shot than the .458 WM.

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The .450 C&W is on the left, the .505 SRE and on the right the .577 VSRE. In the foreground, the Kynoch 570 grain .510" bullet Iswaged down to .505 for use in the SRE.

The .577 VSRE was based on the .577 NE case trimmed to 2.5" and with the rim removed and an extraction groove machined into the case. It duplicated the .577 NE performance of a 750 grain bullet at 2050 fps. in a 12 pound bolt rifle, which was not unpleasant to shoot, but forced me to step back two paces after each shot. I had been in situations in Africa where this would have not been possible, so I reluctantly abandoned it.

 

[Saul]

in 1972 I developed a .375 H&H Flanged Magnum wildcat using a .458" bullet I called the .450 C&W Magnum, for Creighton & Warren, the business I was then trying to get started. I still have the Krieghoff "Teck" O/U double rifle I had built around that cartridge. I thought of it as a sort of rimmed .450 Watts.

I took it to Africa once, but never took anything with it other than a Grevy's zebra. I was hoping for a buffalo, but the opportunity did not present itself. Duplicating .450 NE performance in a smaller rimmed case with lower pressure than a .458 WM seemed desirable to me and more suitable for a double rifle or single shot than the .458 WM.

This is exactly what I was looking for, thank you! I had the same thought as you that it would be the .450 NE in a trimmer package. Not sure why this would not be hugely popular in double rifles.

 

[PerH]

That .450 would be good to make with .375 Fl brass so much as it is now to find. It would like a good flexible cartridge for many uses also.

 

[Saul]

30 R Blaser necked up to 0.416 or 0.423 = a milder alternative to a 416 Ruger or 404 Jeffery in a double. Would be good for driven boar.

9.3x74mmR necked up to 0.416 = should match 416 Ruger in a trim double rifle. Would be great for everything from driven boar to cape buff.

375 H&H Flanged Magnum necked up to 0.458 = should easily match 450 NE in a trimmer double rifle. Would be great for all DG.

450 NE 3.25" necked up to 0.474 = should be equivalent to 470 NE or 475 NE with more bullet availability and variety. Would be great for all DG, but especially cape buff to elephant.

 

[machinistbutler]

What benefit would there be necking up a 450 to 474, over a 470 nitro express that uses the same bullets?

I am not trying to be a smart ass just trying to see the benefit.

Thanks!

 

[Saul]

What benefit would there be necking up a 450 to 474, over a 470 nitro express that uses the same bullets?

I am not trying to be a smart ass just trying to see the benefit.

Thanks!

Since the 470 NE is basically a necked down 500 NE, by necking up a 450 NE, you could potentially get a slightly trimmer rifle.

 

[Round Ball]

I have built a couple of rifles based on the full length 9.3X74R necked up to .44 caliber, and shooting Hornady's 265 gr. Soft Point and 320 gr. Gas Checked Hard Cast bullets, both the guns and the loads were quite impressive!

Round Ball

 

[Opposite Pole]

9.3x74mmR necked up to 0.416 = should match 416 Ruger in a trim double rifle. Would be great for everything from driven boar to cape buff.

I doubt you could get anywhere near 416 Ruger ballistics with a necked up 9.3x74R case. The capacity of 9.3x74R case is about 20% less and it’s designed for 20% lower max pressure as well. There are at least two modern factory 416 double cartridges available which would be hard to beat by a wildcat.

 

[PerH]

The Schuler i mentioned was made in doubles ,not many of them. As i heard 5 -10 max of them.

 

[Saul]

I doubt you could get anywhere near 416 Ruger ballistics with a necked up 9.3x74R case. The capacity of 9.3x74R case is about 20% less and it’s designed for 20% lower max pressure as well. There are at least two modern factory 416 double cartridges available which would be hard to beat by a wildcat.

Blowing the case out straight should increase capacity but I did not consider pressure. Still, being a lighter load would probably suit the character of the cartridge better.

 

[IvW]

I see no use for wild cats I do prefer old traditional cartridges that have proven themselves. 22lr, 222 rem, 7x57mm, 338, 9.3x74r, 375 h&h, 12ga, 7x65r, 500 jeff, etc.

 

[mark-hunter]

I have the same opinion. All my calibers are "boring" vanilla calibers, and ammo easily available in gun shop.

 

[Saul]

I see no use for wild cats I do prefer old traditional cartridges that have proven themselves. 22lr, 222 rem, 7x57mm, 338, 9.3x74r, 375 h&h, 12ga, 7x65r, 500 jeff, etc.

I have the same opinion. All my calibers are "boring" vanilla calibers, and ammo easily available in gun shop.

I have my fair share of traditional cartridges too, but I love messing around with guns and reloading and so I have a lot of fun wildcatting. It might not be the most practical, but it sure is satisfying to spend time building and shooting your own.

 

[PerH]

A .40x74R could be good,plentiful brass much 10mm /41 RM / .400 bullets around .

 

[IvW]

I have my fair share of traditional cartridges too, but I love messing around with guns and reloading and so I have a lot of fun wildcatting. It might not be the most practical, but it sure is satisfying to spend time building and shooting your own.

Lucky you here we cannot play around with what we like

 

[Wyatt Smith]

Would there be enough difference in performance to worry about between the 450-470 wildcat and the standard 450 3 1/4