Size of Concession

Discussion in 'Hunting Africa' started by Tony Perkins, Apr 27, 2018.

  1. Tony Perkins

    Tony Perkins New Member

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    Hi- I am looking at booking my first African hunt. Though it's my first time hunting Africa I've hunted extensively around the US.

    One question I have is what size of concession is right? I see outfitters with 1200 ha to 150,000 ha, some even much larger. I don't want to come to kill but want to hunt and feel that the small concession are more for people wanting to have a easy shot. Can I get some opinions here?
    Thanks!
     
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  2. Countrylife

    Countrylife AH Senior Member

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    I had the same concerns as you. I hunted on a place that was approx 12,000 ha. That equates to about 30,000 acres and converting to sq miles, about 50 sq miles. That's a lot of territory! The owner took us up to the top of one of the hills near the middle of the property to watch the sun set and showed us where his boundary lines were. There was no question that it wasn't going to be easy.

    A better question would be Are there any cross fences and what kind are they? (high, low) And what is the smallest area that we'd be hunting in? The place I hunted had both low and high fencing. He's expanded his ranch by buying up the neighbors so the high fences are left over from that. The low fences are to control the cattle which is where most of his income comes from. He leaves the gates open except for the cattle areas (which are huntable). Never-the-less, I've seen mature Oryx go thru the fence, so it doesn't stop them if they don't want to be there. It does encourage them to travel along the fence but that's kinda like what a natural barrier does as well. Just be sure the area they are in is big enough that they can get away and make you work for them.

    So, I really didn't answer your question, just gave you some things to think about.
     

  3. jeff

    jeff AH Elite

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    It greatly depends on what species you are hunting. 3000 acres of well managed brush veld or mountainous terrain you will be able to have a awesome hunt on. Just make sure that the herds are self sustaining and not put & take. Animals that are born and raised on the property will be a challenge!
     

  4. Mekaniks

    Mekaniks GOLD SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    Welcome to AH Tony.
    There are other things that go with your question,such as which species are you hunting? What is the terrain like? Are the species that you want to hunt a self sustaining population on the property or are the animals brought in and realeased specifically to hunt?
    IMO There are no truly wrong answers, but more about personal preferences and what you want out of the experience.
     

  5. Shootist43

    Shootist43 AH ENABLER GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Tony, please define "an easy shot." You can easily walk 5 to 10 miles while stalking any number of African animals on one of those small concessions you referred to. But in the end your shot isn't likely to be more than 200 yds. Sure some shots will be in the 300 to 400 yard range, however the vast majority shots are taken at a hundred yards or less.
     

  6. Tony Perkins

    Tony Perkins New Member

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    Thanks for all the responses so far:

    I'm after plains game; Kudo, Gemsbok, Impala, B/Wildebeest, Impala mainly. For me it's more about the total experience than the actual hunt though. I have 2300 acres in S. Ohio which is a ton of ground there but I still cover it all when chasing deer and turkey. I don't want my experience in S. Africa to be limited on such a small track. I want to get out and roam some country but understand there are limitations. I know high fence is part of the equation but I don't want the combination of high fence and small size to work so much to my advantage that I am killing and not hunting.

    As far as My reason for this post is to help me understand what is reasonable expectation. I prefer self sustaining population in theory but I am not dead set on that. For the terrain I think everything holds it's own beauty. I just want the area large enough that I can experience it.
    Thanks!
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2018
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  7. Shootist43

    Shootist43 AH ENABLER GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Tony, your farm is just a little less than 4 sq. miles the small concession you mentioned is 50 sq. miles. Does that put it into perspective for you? Concessions that size will almost assuredly have self sustaining herds of the species you mentioned.
     
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  8. wesheltonj

    wesheltonj AH Elite

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    The place I hunted was 24k acres or 37.5 sq miles. Yes, it was high fenced and cross fenced. You could walk as little as you wanted or as much you wanted. I preferred the drive and get out and walk once spotted, so did his staff. One afternoon I spent several hours tracking a waterbuck and I was fairly tired (the ground was loose sand). The last day the wind was bad and could not find anything driving around, we parked the truck and walked all morning. I was so tired, that after lunch owner asked if I want to go bird hunting, I told him no.

    The place had self sustaining animals, no supplemental feeding, but did have man-made water holes. As other have said the real question is to make sure its not put and take. Nothing wrong with put and take, if that's want you want and know you are getting. (Unless it's a croc dumped in a stock tank and shot while holding your beer and discussing the price of a barrel of oil).
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2018

  9. fourfive8

    fourfive8 AH Enthusiast

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    First, convert the hectares to acres so you have an experience base on which to judge. IMO, a common, "smallish" high fenced property in Africa will be 5000 to 10,000 acres. A less common "largish" high fenced area will be in the 250,000 acre range give or take. To me, having grown up hunting wide open really big areas of the western US, the 5,000 to 10,000 acre areas in Africa feel confining. While the larger areas of maybe 250,000 acres not at all. Of course there are also wide open areas in Africa without high fences that are called free range. Also, consider an area where you (your PH or outfitter) is permitted to hunt may have nothing to do with high fences but simply is a restriction to the area you may hunt- because of land status or specific lease agreements and the like.
     
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  10. Doug375

    Doug375 AH Senior Member

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    Your concern shows you're an ethical hunter. Good for you! I agree with the other posters....it does depend on the topography and vegetation. A piece if land measuring 2,000 acres is certainly too small if it's flat and sparsely covered. That same size property can be tougher to hunt if it's broken by ridges and gullies and/or choked with thorn bush. All this said, I understand you're looking for a rule of thumb. In Namibia, a hunting farm (as they call it) can't be less than 1,000 hectares (2,471 acres.) That seems a little small to me. The "home place" at Immenhof, the outfit I hunted with in Namibia, was over 12,000 acres and we hunted several adjacent farms that combined were many thousands more. To be honest, I only remember seeing fences when entering or leaving. At least the game proof fences around the perimeter. Cattle fences are no barrier to wild game. You ought to see an Eland jump! It takes a bunch of acres to sustain healthy herds of free-ranging and reproducing game animals. You have so many good options in SA and Namibia. Make sure you know the size of the smallest parcel you'll be hunting and make sure it's big enough to meet YOUR standards. Then have fun.
     

  11. KMG Hunting Safaris

    KMG Hunting Safaris AH ENABLER SPONSOR Since 2013 AH Legend

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    Hi Tony,
    Please be so kind to drop me either a PM or email me directly. I will be more than happy to put together a package to suit your needs exactly to your requirements.

    Take Care,
    Marius Goosen
     

  12. Nyati

    Nyati AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    Welcome to AH, Tony !
     

  13. Divernhunter

    Divernhunter AH Fanatic

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    The people I hunted with twice have a home place High Fenced of about 30,000 acers with no cross fences that they OWN. The also have other property(large) that is low fenced with sheep(their main income) and great springbok hunting. They have friends and family near them and farther away that have large properties they can/do hunt when needed. Like for an animal they do not have on their own property. Some of it is high fenced and some free range. This would be sort of a concession. They were all spot and stalk on animals born and raised on their own(or families) property. They hunt all day unless you do not want to with lunch in the field. They do not shoot from the truck. I like the fact that the land has been in their family 5-6 generations and it is a family owned/operated and guided by them. They are the PH's.
    I have taken all the animals you listed and quite a few(many) more. Most of my animals have made the SCI record book including the SCI Gold #48 Impala and what looks like the #30 Black Springbok. All of this on budget hunts. Their prices are real good and the service/where you stay/friendly people are top notch. Their name is Iliwa Safaris and they are worth ckecking out. Remember most places a 7 day hunt is really 5 days of hunting and one day each of coming and going. Sometimes you are charged for pick up and usually charged 1/2 or full daily rate for those days. When you book 7 day hunt with Iliwa you are there 9 days and hunt a full 7 of those with no charge for pick up, drop off or daily rate for those 2 days.

    I do not get anything for suggesting them. I do not work for them. I just did 3 years or research before booking with them the 1st time and they were everything and more of what I expected. While at a lower price than others. You can hunt all day and not see a fence. The hunting can be easier(like for me short stalks due to my disabilities) or harder/longer stalks in hills and brush. Our 1st trip on the last day my daughter and I split up and the father took her on long stalks thinking he would wear her out. Did not happen. I might mention that was a free extra day because I saved money by leaving one day later on plane tickets. They insisted we stay there and not at a airport hotel for the extra day. On top of that we went hunting and she shot 2 free Impala. I cannot say enough nice things about these people. I also saw them have a cull hunt guy who wounded a Kudu(1st one in 5 years they could not find) during his hunt shoot a trophy size one as they took him to the airport because he was bummed about the one he did not get any photos of. He only took home photos because he did not want the expense and that was one reason for him only booking a cull hunt.
     

  14. BSO Dave

    BSO Dave AH Veteran

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    Hi Tony,

    Welcome to the Africa Hunting forums. There are lots of helpful hunters all eager to offer their opinions and advice as you have seen. I agree with others that even small concessions in South Africa will be much larger on average than your own 2300 acres. There are several good outfits represented here that can offer you the total package of large properties, quality animals, and a great overall experience. Read the hunt reports, contact references, ask very specific questions of your prospective outfitters, and you should be able to find the one that best fits your goals.
     

  15. sierraone

    sierraone AH ENABLER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Welcome to our forum Tony. You have so much to choose from in South Africa. You just have to decide what you want and then shop for it! Good luck!!!
     

  16. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN AH ENABLER SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR LIFETIME TITANIUM BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    "Concession" in South Africa is often referencing property under contract, that may or may not be owned by the Outfitter.

    150,000 acres of concessions could be 15 - 10,000 acre properties or some other combination. It is not synonymous with contiguous acres.

    If you'd like to add more fun to your debate, look up threads on: High fence, low fence, no fence, free range, wild, etc.

    As others have noted:
    The particular species being hunted changes the game:
    Blue Duiker or Elephant?
    Springbok or Bushbuck?
    Kudu or Gemsbok?

    Just a quick sampling of the possibilities. There are many more in Southern Africa.
    Eastern Cape. I wish I could show you that valley closer up. 1200ha in that stuff is plenty of cover.
    GoogleEarth_Image 5.jpeg

    North West way out near Namibia. You can see forever.
    GoogleEarth_Image 2.jpeg

    KZN highveld. Wide open spaces are available here too. There is also some stuff in KZN that will make you cry when you think about walking through it.
    GoogleEarth_Image 6.jpeg

    Slightly hilly and shorter cover in EC
    GoogleEarth_Image 4.jpeg
    The bush up in Limpopo near Vaalwater.
    GoogleEarth_Image 3.jpeg
    Again, in NW. There are places you can see the scorpions walking at 1KM. ( It's not all like this.)
    GoogleEarth_Image.jpeg

    I have hunted for days in a single small valley after Bushbuck with my bow. I could snipe anything in view from a decent vantage point with a rifle. At no point was it a gimme, even with a rifle. It may have been 640 acres but it was bushy and rolling.

    I have hunted in the grass on the same size property, as noted, and you could literally shoot at the animals from one vantage point. I was not impressed. It was the closest thing I have encountered to a pen. Never again.

    The right property, the species and the Outfitter will make the difference.

    Good luck with your research.
     
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  17. CAustin

    CAustin AH ENABLER BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Ambassador

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    Tony I am here in the states and am more than willing to speak with you directly if you like. I’m sure we can come up with the size property that will give you a great hunt.
     

  18. LJ Safaris

    LJ Safaris SPONSOR Since 2017 AH Veteran

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    Hi Tony.

    I have sent you a PM with info on our Karoo Area. Please let me know if you have any more questions.

    Kind Regards
    Juan Stander
     

  19. Hank2211

    Hank2211 GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    @BRICKBURN makes a very important point.

    Many outfitters will aggregate the properties over which they have hunting rights, and give that number, without further explanation. Once you do some digging, you may find that while the aggregate size was fine, none of the actual properties are large enough to satisfy you (or a fair chase ethic). So you have got ask the questions. As part of that, many with small properties will try to talk you out of your position, some with merit, others less so.

    The second point is related. As I said, understand why the size is important. If I was looking to hunt kudu, then a small property with low fences might be just fine, since kudu are not particularly intimidated by low fences. If the fences are high, then I'd want a substantial property to hunt them properly. For others, such as buffalo, where a proper hunt is a tracking hunt, then large amounts of land which allow the buffalo to move and hide, would be critical. On the other hand, springbok are generally unwilling to jump even a low fence unless really pushed.

    Some animals can't be fenced in, almost regardless of the size of the fence. For example, if I was hunting serval, I'm not sure I would care how big or small the property was. If it had the right kind of terrain, and serval were generally seen there, then a small property might be just fine. Baiting a brown hyena can happen anywhere - you just need a good bait site, and the size of the property and the fences are generally irrelevant.

    Understand what size matters to you and why, and then stick to that. There are plenty of options in South Africa for everyone.
     

  20. ActionBob

    ActionBob AH ENABLER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Welcome to AH Tony!

    My first African hunt with Crusader Safaris, Andrew Pringle, was possibly on the order of what you are inquiring about. No high fences, lots of PG, large parcels of land including a variety of different velds in the East Cape.

    Another option you might consider is to get beyond RSA. Costs more to get there and for day fees but trophy fees are usually a fraction of those in RSA.

    Buffalo hunts seem to be spectacular deals right now. Even in the real wild places.
     
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