Remington Declares Bankruptcy Again

[JimP]

The Navajo Nation was in the process of negotiating to purchase them but then this Corona hit and they backed off.

 

[crs]

TWO quick questions:

1. Who owns the Freedom Group?
2. WRT mismanagement, why did Remington buy the Dakota Arms company?

 

[mdwest]

Freedom Group was owned by Cerberus Capital Management.. I believe they spun them off a few years back though and thats when Freedom Group re-branded itself as Remington Outdoors (RO is the owner of Bushmaster, Marlin, Rem, etc..etc.. now)..

Cerberus is a huge private equity firm that maintains a really diverse portfolio ranging from government services (a company I worked for about 12 years ago once entertained a possible acquisition by Cerberus), automotive, leisure, firearms, real estate, tech, etc..

Last I looked at them I think they had about $40B in holdings...



Regarding the purchase of Dakota.. Im not aware of the specifics.. but when Rem was owned by Freedom Group.. which was owned by Cerberus.. there was a big push for FG to buy just about any mid market firearms company they could get their hands on.. Im guessing a lot of that mindset and gearing toward small to mid sized firearms acquisition stuck with management even after Cerberus sold them off..

 

[Chago]

Remington is still swamped with debt and legal fees from all the law suits they had on a faulty trigger that they covered up for 30+ years. The class actions against them were astronomical. And personally once all that came out I never bought another Remington product again. And I was actually present in a ground blind with a buddy when his Remington fired a hole through the roof of our deer blind with no hand within 2' of the trigger. We were sitting around shooting the breeze in the blind. He grabbed the rifle by the barrel with one hand and squashed a hornet who came in from the bottom of the blind. When he stomped the bee I suppose even that light impact on the butt stock triggered the trigger. Bam!!!!! tons of ear ringing and utter shock from the both of us. Everyone checking to see if anyone got shot, obviously not as the barrel was pointed up as again we were seated and he grabbed it near the end of the barrel so nothing was in harms way.

When he called Remington, they had told him he "modified the rifle and was not their responsibility". I can confirm the only thing changed was the stock, he put the rifle in a magpul stock. It is literally a lift and drop stock that doesn't even require you to touch the trigger when installing. Complete and utter garbage, especially when they know there are 4000 cases against your trash trigger. From that day forward I refused to own as much as a t shirt of theirs never mind a rifle. Many people have died due to their negligence and worse, greed to cover it up and let it continue. I am a die hard gun supporter and do not wish this to any manufacturer. But this company I am not sorry to see them go. Hopefully this time it is a go and not just another bailout. Other manufacturers will simply take their place in the market.

 

[JimP]

Time to pick up a supply of Barnes bullets as a just in case since Remington also owns them.

 

[fourfive8]

No matter if you like a company's product or not- to think that less competition is good and failure of a major company, particularly a gun/ammo company in today's political climate is a good thing, is knee-jerk and short-sighted. IMO, nothing good about it.

 

[Bullthrower338]

It is heart breaking to see such and iconic American brand get ran into the dirt. I know the lawsuits that have plagued Remington have hurt them badly, but I don’t think they are the primary contributor. Piss poor leadership, gross mismanagement, terrible decision making and overall stupidity can only end with a singular outcome.
Remington, AAC, Marlin, DPMS, Dakota... Any of these once highly successful brands flourishing under Freedom Group?

I agree piss poor management( typically upper management) will crumble a company fast. I’ve seen many large companies that have survived well over 100 years in the oil business sell out or shutter their doors due to it. The people on the ground and mid level managers that get up every morning and try to do their best can not cover the horrific mistakes made by the decision makers on the top floor. I watched one company I worked for make horrible decisions, cut 401k and bonuses all the while taking fabulous trips on the company jet with their wives and friends. When the workers hear about this, morale and all give-a-shit goes out the window. It was painful to watch as they sold the most profitable business units to extend the inevitable just to get a few more trips in before the money was all gone.

 

[Saul]

This is not the end of Remington. They will undergo some much needed restructuring, sell off some of their other brands, and be back at it under new management. With any luck, they will replace the top brace, slim their line, and improve quality. My only fear is for Barnes, Marlin, and Dakota. I would hate to see anything bad befall these brands.

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

The Navajo Nation was in the process of negotiating to purchase them but then this Corona hit and they backed off.

So would you say they are having reservations?

 

[mdwest]

This is not the end of Remington. They will undergo some much needed restructuring, sell off some of their other brands, and be back at it under new management. With any luck, they will replace the top brace, slim their line, and improve quality. My only fear is for Barnes, Marlin, and Dakota. I would hate to see anything bad befall these brands.

My hope is that Barnes, Marlin, and Dakota will be the brands they sell off.. and that they can return to their glory days under new ownership and management..

They dont need the boat anchor of Remington around their necks.. Those companies can thrive and do exceptionally well I believe if given a new start on life..

 

[curtism1234]

Remington has many problems
1. Ownership group
2. Decades of a safety coverup that recently cost them dearly
3. The 597 was a rather poor 22lr compared to the Ruger and Marlin imo, though it had its followers. Today they only make a pump (who the hell knew that???). With the rise of Henry and a few others in the game, I'm not sure having a new 22 is worth having or not....probably not.
4. They specialize in traditional sporting arms (though you can bastardize an 870 easy and trick out a 700 with whatever you want). While that is my interest, that's not where the money is any longer. Their 1911 brought some good press and then they screwed that with some odd looking pistols that didn't perform all that well as far as I am aware. If i was in the market for a handgun other than a 1911, never in a million years would I even think to look on Remington's site. Even if I did, I would close the browser after 30 seconds.

They will keep limping along further cheapening the quality of the 870 and 700 hoping no one notices. This isn't a company I would invest in, and that is a shame. Hopefully some one can turn them around.

 

[BnC 04]

Not a fan of Remington by any means but I do feel for the workers and job lose due to them going tits up in a hand basket.

 

[Brent in Az]

Kind of sounds like politicians in a way....

I agree piss poor management( typically upper management) will crumble a company fast. I’ve seen many large companies that have survived well over 100 years in the oil business sell out or shutter their doors due to it. The people on the ground and mid level managers that get up every morning and try to do their best can not cover the horrific mistakes made by the decision makers on the top floor. I watched one company I worked for make horrible decisions, cut 401k and bonuses all the while taking fabulous trips on the company jet with their wives and friends. When the workers hear about this, morale and all give-a-shit goes out the window. It was painful to watch as they sold the most profitable business units to extend the inevitable just to get a few more trips in before the money was all gone.

 

[Wyatt Smith]

I will say I was honestly disappointed whe I saw 700s retailing new for $450. It means something has been cheapened.

 

[Ridge Runner]

I have own several Remington rifles and shotguns over the many years. In particular the 870, 887 and 1187 shotgun and the 700, 740, 742, 7400 rifles and at one time ( kicking my self in the hind end everytime I think about it) a model 660 in 243.

The 870's I didn't much care for as I'm not much into pump actions, rifles or shotguns, the last 1187 I had was stolen and I really liked it, even had a slug barrel for it.

The 700's I own were back in the 80's and early 90's in various calibers: 243, 7mm Mag, 30-06. They were all accurate out of the box.

The 740 and 742 rifles were previously used when I bought them. These models were okay, just not a personal preference. I have no regrets on trading or selling them.

The 7400 felt and shot better than any of the 740's and 742's. It also was stolen with the 1187, 887 other firearms.

As for the 887, it was chambered for 2 3/4, 3, 3 1/2 and was my go to gun for ducks and geese. Shooting 2 3/4 and 3 inch was no problem. Shooting 31/2 inch shells, the second shell would eject out the loading gate everytime. I called Remington about it, Remington even had the 887 on recall, sent it back to the company, they returned back to me, claiming it was repaired. It wasn't it still threw the second 3 1/2 shell out the loading gate. Called Remington, talked to a tech, told him my problem, he looked it up and since I had already sent it back under the recall there was nothing else to be done, however I could return it and pay for the repairs and shipping out of my own pocket. Needless to say, I haven't purchased a new or used Remington since.

Having said that I will simply consider purchasing another 1187 or 1100 for 2 reasons: 1. I still have the slug barrel with rifle sights, and 2. The 2 day quota deer hunts that I apply for each year only allow shotgun with slugs, muzzle loaders, and archery.

Will I purchase an arsenal of Remingtons, I have no real intentions of doing so. There are to many other better brands to choose from, and should I ever have a product problem I want to know the company has a solid record of standing behind their products.

 

[curtism1234]

The thing about 870's is it's a generational shotgun. You're 15 years old struggling to shoulder your dad's 12ga wingmaster, then you get a 12ga Super Mag for high school graduation, some years later you decide you don't need a 7 1/2 pound 3 1/2" chamber 12ga to kill a rabbit so you pick up a nice light 20ga Express, and when your kid is of age they use your 870 till they get their own.

The shotguns practically sell themselves

 

[Saul]

I have never owned a 700, I prefer CRF.

I have never owned an 870 either, I prefer my Winchester 1200.

The R1 was great when it came out, but the price just kept going up to the point of ridiculousness.

I have heard good things about the new Versamax but I really have no need for one.

My Model 11 and 1100 are sublime. Everyone just seems to shoot the 1100 well. If only not for that pesky o-ring, it would be the best semiautomatic shotgun ever. It still might be...

 

[Hunter4752001]

Irrespective of any quality issues with recent Remington offerings a couple of things stand out:
. The current US market is dominated by AR/AK type rifles which means a smaller market for traditional bolt actions etc.
. A quick glance at the Remington website shows an inventory overloaded with minor variations and competing products all catering for the same niche. No manufacturer can hope to make a profit like that.

If Remington is to survive, they need to prune hard and heavy. One basic hunting bolt action in a small number of calibres, one shotgun etc. Market research and their sales figures should tell them what to retain.

It may be a shame to lose some models, but you can't continue to make more model variation than the market will support. Leave all the gimmick stock variations etc to the aftermarket and custom providers.

 

[Professor Mawla]

I was casually looking at a recent ammunition catalog of Remington’s . They no longer offer ammunition for the .375 H&H Magnum , the .416 Remington Magnum or the .458 Winchester Magnum anymore . Even ten years ago , they used to offer all of these loadings .

 

[SnowLeopard]

Didn’t Remington get sued for a mass shooting because a bushmaster AR 15 was used? That would make it hard for any company.

Yes, for the Adam Lanza shooting of the elementary school in Connecticut. He murdered his mother, then stole her Bushmaster AR and drove to his old elementary school and killed 17 kids and 3 teachers. So, despite the Federal law shielding manufacturers from the unlawful use of their products, the Leftist courts are allowing the lawsuit against Remington who didn't even own Bushmaster at the time; the legal fees alone are killing Remington. Ultimately, the Supreme Court will probably rule that the Federal law shielding manufacturers prevails over Connecticut law, but Remington will be gone long before that occurs. What a shame. The Left destroys everything it touches.