Pushing through myths and misconceptions: The Push Feed Action

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

Agreed. For 99% of hunting, the difference between the two systems (in a GOOD rifle) is mostly academic.

Where I'd see a difference is at the extremes of professional "hunting" use: long range sniping, and daily use as a DG backup rifle submitted to all sorts of mistreatment. There I'd pick a push-feed for the former, and a CRF for the latter.

@Kano
Keep both clean and maintained and you won't have problems with either . Takes 5 minutes a day to wipe them down and clean the action.
Bob

 

[Professor Mawla]

As someone who has been hunting a great deal of dangerous game as part of Problem Animal Control work for the last 48 years , here is my approach to this matter .

I personally own and exclusively use a control round feed rifle for most of my hunting applications ( a custom made .458 Winchester Magnum which is built on a Winchester Enfield Model 1917 action ) . However , I have used all manners of rifles ( either borrowed or rented ) for my hunting applications whenever I am hunting in foreign countries . This includes a good amount of push feed rifles .

It must be remembered that the development of push feed rifles has come a long way since the 1950s , when Remington first made them popular ( by introducing the Model 721 , 722 and 725 which preceded the Model 700 ) . One cannot make a fair assessment of 21st century push feed rifles , by simply looking at push feed designs from the 1950s - 1970s .

I would not hunt dangerous game with a heavy calibre Remington Model 700 or a post 1964 Winchester Model 70 or a post 1962 Browning Safari . The extractor on these designs is too small and unreliable , when large calibre shell cases need to be reliably extracted in a hurry . However , I would not hesitate to use a Blaser R-8 for hunting dangerous game . I have hunted my largest Himalayan ibex with a Blaser R-8 in .338 Winchester Magnum ( employing a 250 grain Nosler Partition soft nosed factory load ) and ( while a Himalayan Ibex is by no means dangerous game ) I would not hesitate to use a Blaser R-8 in .416 Remington Magnum to hunt marauding Royal Bengal tigers .

I have observed that most currently manufactured European rifles ( such as Sako , Sauer , Blaser or Steyr Mannlicher ) employ a push feed action , these days . If the issues of reliability were too great , then I doubt that any of these companies would be thriving today . Personally speaking , I am an old soul and I prefer the Enfield Model 1917 action ( simply because I have had extremely successful results with this action , even since 1976 ) .

 

[WebleyGreene455]

As someone who has been hunting a great deal of dangerous game as part of Problem Animal Control work for the last 48 years , here is my approach to this matter .

I personally own and exclusively use a control round feed rifle for most of my hunting applications ( a custom made .458 Winchester Magnum which is built on a Winchester Enfield Model 1917 action ) . However , I have used all manners of rifles ( either borrowed or rented ) for my hunting applications whenever I am hunting in foreign countries . This includes a good amount of push feed rifles .

It must be remembered that the development of push feed rifles has come a long way since the 1950s , when Remington first made them popular ( by introducing the Model 721 , 722 and 725 which preceded the Model 700 ) . One cannot make a fair assessment of 21st century push feed rifles , by simply looking at push feed designs from the 1950s - 1970s .

I would not hunt dangerous game with a heavy calibre Remington Model 700 or a post 1964 Winchester Model 70 or a post 1962 Browning Safari . The extractor on these designs is too small and unreliable , when large calibre shell cases need to be reliably extracted in a hurry . However , I would not hesitate to use a Blaser R-8 for hunting dangerous game . I have hunted my largest Himalayan ibex with a Blaser R-8 in .338 Winchester Magnum ( employing a 250 grain Nosler Partition soft nosed factory load ) and ( while a Himalayan Ibex is by no means dangerous game ) I would not hesitate to use a Blaser R-8 in .416 Remington Magnum to hunt marauding Royal Bengal tigers .

I have observed that most currently manufactured European rifles ( such as Sako , Sauer , Blaser or Steyr Mannlicher ) employ a push feed action , these days . If the issues of reliability were too great , then I doubt that any of these companies would be thriving today . Personally speaking , I am an old soul and I prefer the Enfield Model 1917 action ( simply because I have had extremely successful results with this action , even since 1976 ) .

It might not be quite the same as hunting rifles, but the Russian M91/30 push-feed has been around for decades and is still very much in use with militaries, insurgents, militias, and law-enforcement around the world. I'm pretty sure it's the longest-lived battle rifle in history and I don't doubt that there are rifles running perfectly fine in terrible conditions and using horrible ammo. By comparison, the Kar98k and its brothers are much less common (but then again, the Russians were churning out rifles by the truckload so there are plenty to go around now). The USA switched to the Remington 700 for its new USMC sniper rifles during Vietnam and stuck with the action ever since.

Granted, those examples don't usually have more than a .30-calibre bullet (.338 Lapua and Norma being two exceptions) in military service, and they don't necessarily need to worry about fast follow-ups, but if they can withstand combat use and be used to exceptional effect by trained personnel?

Personally, and I say this without any hunting experience, I'd still prefer a CRF for dangerous game, especially if I was using a cartridge designed specifically for a particular rifle (i.e., 9.3 Mauser in a 98 action). I think I'd feel better using it and knowing the combination of the two had been used for a long time with great success.

 

[colorado]

My two favorite rifles are my CZ 550 in 500 Jeffery (CRF), and my late 60s vintage Rem BDL in 270 (push feed). The CZ took some work but it feeds, extracts effortlessly now, is accurate and the recoil offhand isn't a factor at all. I've taken a cow elk and a black bear with it but that's it so far. Alaska and Africa hopefully in the future. The 270 I guided with, finished off two grizzlies clients wounded, killed 9 black bears a couple of dozen elk and more deer and javelinas. On it's 3rd barrel, 5000 rounds through it, it's still accurate never jammed, failed to feed or extract. Still shoots nickel sized groups at 100 yards. The only work I ever had done on it was to have Norm Thompson adjust the trigger to 2 1/2 lbs and put a Pachmayer Decelerator recoil pad on it. I'm not say today's Remingtons are as good, they aren't, but I'd trust my life with it and I have. I would do the same with my 500 Jeffery.

 

[Ray B]

Some threads just never go away. I see the differences between the push & catch systems are:
Push may require the cartridge to be completely chambered, bolt closed before the extractor will snap over the rim. Catch will have the rim behind the extractor as it comes up from the magazine. In a shooting situation both extractors will have grasped the rim.
The catch systems that I'm aware of have fixed ejectors that do not contact the cartridge until it is ejecting the cartridge. the push system has the ejector in constant contact with the cartridge and under spring pressure. The ejector button is generally at the top of the chambered cartridge so is applying pressure to the cartridge, pushing the bullet to the bottom of the chamber, and doing so consistently. I have read that some believe that this is one of the reasons push systems are thought to be more accurate than catch.
The third difference I will note is the push extractors are generally mush smaller than catch. So in a situation where the rifle has been fired and minute degrees of accuracy are not needed, this difference seems to be the most important as the extractor may be pulled through the rim of a stuck case whereas the larger bite of the catch would have sufficient grip to remove the case.

 

[Luvthunt]

If the extractor is your only concern then convert to a Sako or better yet an m14/4 claw type. Have done so on many from 300 Wby to 458 Lott.Started converting more then 50 years ago and all conversions still fault free. Simple conversion.