Pre Africa rifle issues

Discussion in 'Firearms & Ammunition' started by gillettehunter, Sep 1, 2019.

  1. gillettehunter

    gillettehunter AH ENABLER AH Legend

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    I thought I'd start this thread to possibly help someone else before a hunt. I'm in a airport headed to Africa..... In getting ready for this hunt I encountered some issues that I'd never had before.
    Rifle #1 is a new Howa 1500 in a .375 Ruger. I had a box of shells to start off with as well as some brass to reload. I saw some 300 gr Swift A-frames for a discount and bought 100 of them. Hoping for a chance at a cape buffalo and perhaps an eland. Rifle was bought from an individual but was unfired. Still had tags on it.
    I used the factory Hornady to start barrel break in. Then used some RL17 to work up a load. Determined that 78.5 grains was safe in my rifle. I started trying different seating depths and then varying the powder charge. I'd get a decent group sub 1 1/2 inch and then go back to verify and get a 4 inch group. Disappointing. After about 45 rds of reloads and still nothing I re torqued the scope rings and bases. Re-cleaned the barrel and tried again. Finally found the culprit. The stinking action screws had started to back out! Once tighten back down a 1 1/4 inch group was easy to come by.
    2nd rifle. 7mm SAUM. This is my longer range rifle. Custom built on a titanium action and a Manners stock. Have shot 1/4 inch groups at 100 yds with it. About 2 yrs ago the we experienced some heavy bolt lift with reloads that were all the same as before... Hmm what is going on. Thought perhaps I had mistakenly used a Fed 215 magnum primer instead of a 210 Lg rifle. Nope that was not the issue. Left it sit a while and decided it was the rifle for a Vaal Rhebuck this year in africa. Thought maybe my new powder lot was the issue, but as I dropped powder to a safe level the velocity dropped. New powder lots sometimes have a different burn rate... Eventually discovered a "carbon ring" in the barrel. With a bit of elbow grease and time I was able to remove that. After cleaning up everything from that I could use more powder and not be too hot. The issue was the accuracy was down to about 1 inch. Finally realized that I might need to change the seating depth. Seating the bullet out .011 inches further closed the group up to sub 1/4 inch. In fact I put 3 in one ragged hole a couple of days ago. Guess I'm officially "chasing the lands". As the barrel wears I apparently need to seat the bullets out further to maintain accuracy.
    So perhaps some of you have managed to overcome difficulties with a rifle that might help others out with problems of their own. Feel free to post any problems found and the fixes used.
    Bruce
     

  2. Wyatt Smith

    Wyatt Smith AH Veteran

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    You might want to install pillars on the 375. That could be stock compression and not the screws backing out.
     
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  3. Newboomer

    Newboomer GOLD SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    Good point about wringing them out at home. Not nice to be half way around the world and find out your rifle won't work.
     

  4. sestoppelman

    sestoppelman AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    "carbon ring",,, in the barrel? Where? Please explain.
     

  5. Hogpatrol

    Hogpatrol AH ENABLER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    It forms just forward of the case mouth into the freebore. Some powders are worse than others. Unexplained pressure rises can be the result of a carbon ring.
     
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  6. sestoppelman

    sestoppelman AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    Never encountered such a thing in 50 years of re loading. I don't really see how it isn't blown out at every shot. Unless there is some defect just ahead of the chamber, how does it stay there? Unicorns!:D
     
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  7. Hogpatrol

    Hogpatrol AH ENABLER SILVER SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Generally speaking, and depending on the rifle, cartridge and powder, it's caused by shooting X amount of rounds without cleaning.
     
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  8. sestoppelman

    sestoppelman AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    Well they say anything is possible, however unlikely. I suspect it would require as I said, a defect. Someplace out of the ordinary to collect fouling. Lots of guys put many, many rounds thru their rifles without cleaning and don't seem to suffer this malady. I clean guns after shooting.
     
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  9. IdaRam

    IdaRam SILVER SUPPORTER AH Elite

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    It’s a real thing. I think it was David Tubbs that wrote something on the subject a long time ago? Ses, it was way back when you were middle aged :ROFLMAO: Sorry, couldn’t help myself.
    I had this same problem on a Ruger tang safety 7Mag. A buddy of mine also experienced this on a M700 300Win. Some folks speculate it is more common with Alliant powders such RL22. It is work to get it out as Bruce mentioned. The bullet gets squeezed undersize before engaging the rifling. Pressures usually go up and accuracy goes to hell in a handbasket. If you look carefully with a borescope you can see it.
    I’ve owned and shot a few rifles and have only seen it once. :E Shrug:
    Bruce, thanks for taking time to post the intel.
     
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  10. sestoppelman

    sestoppelman AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    LOL, no worries, just an old fuddy duddy!;):rolleyes:o_O:D:D
     
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  11. sestoppelman

    sestoppelman AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    I just looked around a bit about this. Appears to be a thing allright! Guess I will continue to ignore it like I have been doing since before never hearing about before, LOL.o_O:rolleyes::D:D I clean barrels after every shoot regardless so maybe that's been enough to escape the dreaded:eek::eek: heretofore unknown:rolleyes::rolleyes: carbon ring!!:D:D:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
     

  12. bruce moulds

    bruce moulds AH Elite

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    do not laugh at carbon rings - they are real.
    the worst part of it is that the heat of repeated firing over a carbon ring makes the carbon go ceramic, literally.
    it gets harder than the barrel metal by a long way.
    the only real way to deal with a carbon ring is to use an abrasive like jb, kg2, or remclean.
    when the stuff you are trying to abraid is harder than the barrel, guess what disappears first.
    the best fix for carbon rings is never to let them build up in the first place.
    bruce.
     
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  13. Wyatt Smith

    Wyatt Smith AH Veteran

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    What’s the best prevention Bruce?
     

  14. sestoppelman

    sestoppelman AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    Cleaning your bore after every shoot.:rolleyes::D
     
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  15. Wyatt Smith

    Wyatt Smith AH Veteran

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    I’m good then
     

  16. gillettehunter

    gillettehunter AH ENABLER AH Legend

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    I suspect that pillars would help. The screws were VERY loose. They had backed a long way out.
    On the carbon ring. Good cleaning regularly helps prevent it. I use RL26 in that cartridge and apparently that is a powder more prone to cause it than some others....
    Made it to Dubai. Next stop is Jo-berg.
    Bruce
     

  17. Ridgewalker

    Ridgewalker AH ENABLER LIFETIME BRONZE BENEFACTOR AH Legend

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    Gillettehunter, best of luck on your hunt and please keep us updated if possible!
    We’ll be anxiously waiting!
     
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  18. Hoss Delgado

    Hoss Delgado AH Fanatic

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    I went Boar hunting with a pal once. The guy owns 44 guns , mostly tactical AR-15 style rifles and never did any real hunting in his life. When he hears that l invited him for a hog hunt , he promises me that he will bring" The Greatest Hunting Rifle ever made by a man " . I anxiously wait the next day for him to come. He comes with a new , Shiny looking Weatherby Mark V in .460 Weatherby Magnum and Factory ammunition ( which uses 500 grain Hornady Meplat bullets ). Anxious to see it in Use , we go off , me with my Old .375 HH Magnum Winchester Model 70 .
    He proudly tells me that the gun is brand new . So , we're near the boars with their huge , mean looking tusks. My friend fires . A Hog completely gets blown off his feet. Unfortunately , my friend is almost blown off his feet as well due to the recoil he didn't anticipate :p . I'm popping hogs left and right with my. 375 . He aims at another hog and pulls the trigger. Nothing happens. We realize that the gun's monstrous recoil jarred open the Magazine floor plate and true enough , two huge .460 Weatherby Magnum cartridges are lying at his feet.
    Be sure to always practice and check your rifle thoroughly before going into the field.
     
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