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Kevin Peacocke

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Ironically with the Dems in 'power', the Republicans will have more clout to call the corruption in the election out, and hopefully straighten procedures for 2022. The critics in the USA seem to wield more sway than the defenders.
I put power in inverted commas because in actuality all the Dems have gained is the Whitehouse, the Republicans have actually increased power substantially in SCOTUS and the House, and are very likely to take the House completely in 2022.
 
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Wheels

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Part of the Michigan lawsuit.

Interesting how you have partial people voting. :unsure:


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All of this "creative accounting" could have been avoided if congress/president was held to a balanced budget. For example, if they want to cancel the student loan debt- great, all they have to do is use funds previously allocated to welfare and urban housing to pay the college/banks loans. How many of those minorities would vote for it then?
 

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Corrupt Pennsylvania court of appeals has rejected Trumps legal appeal.

On to SCOTUS.....
 

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With the obvious cheating that undeniably happened, and then the push back by the various branches and the judiciary against the attempts to expose it, is this not the epitome of a conspiracy? The defense of there being 'inadequate numbers of fraudulent votes to sway the outcome' must surely be accompanied by the concession that cheating did indeed occur? I haven't heard that yet.
 

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Actually not a Pennsylvania court, but the Third Circuit of the U.S. Court of Appeals. Case heard by 3 Federal judges, all appointed by republican presidents. The judge that wrote the unanimous opinion was appointed by President Trump.
 

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Some media ding dong over on Parler, said the PA court of appeals? Maybe they meant the district representing PA.

Apparently, whoever filed that appeal for Trumps legal team, didn't do a very good job, as it was seriously lacking in content?

Maybe just a ruse?
 

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Actually not a Pennsylvania court, but the Third Circuit of the U.S. Court of Appeals. Case heard by 3 Federal judges, all appointed by republican presidents. The judge that wrote the unanimous opinion was appointed by President Trump.
Exactly. This is looking more Quixotic by the day. We have thoroughly undermined our voting system (maybe healthy if some national remedial regulatory measures can be taken that aren't unconstitutional), and nothing to date appears to remotely convince a court that a specific remedy should be applied.

In Pennsylvania, this may even not get past Alito, much less to SCOTUS. There are lawyers on our site with a far more experience in law than me, but my understanding of such suits is that fraud must be pled very specifically, not just general allegations. Outside affidavits can't be based on hearsay or merely belief or a review of statistical data or anomalies. With respect to the appeals process, I don't believe a Court of Appeals or even the SCOTUS generally considers new facts. That is why I have always been so perplexed by this notion that Trump's team does not want to show all their cards prior to reaching SCOTUS. But I stand to be corrected by someone with an actual jurisprudence background.

I suppose, like the Dems with Gore and Hillary, there is value in keeping the troops inspired by the "stolen election" narrative. My concern is many of the Trump faithful in typical conservative and Republican circular firing squad tradition are pledging to boycott elections like Georgia's runoff. I am glad to see the President can see past his challenges to go down there, though I am concerned his rally will be more about his grievances rather than saving the senate.

I still believe that the "steal" to place through mail-in ballots, most of which were collected by local community organizers and activists to ensure they were turned in and "properly" marked. It is critical that some federal remedy be found to stop this practice from becoming the new norm.
 
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Wheels

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I have also read that the Giuliani suit is poorly prepared. Speed does not always produce the best results.

Alito was not happy with the way things went down in PA. Alito on his own may want to see the separation in ballots that came in after 8pm on 11/3. It doesn't look like PA did what Alito told them to do. Even if the Giuliani suit is poor, Alito may bring up the suit from before the election to SCOTUS.

After the hearing's earlier this week, the PA legislature may make all present court cases mute. Ultimately they can determine the electors if they want. It looks like they are considering it.

 

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It would be interesting to see how Gumble would see what is happening now? He has two options:

Either he tells the truth that this election stinks to high heaven and corruption by the Dems was rampant. Or he continues with his obvious left leaning stance. If he choose the truth then kudos to him, it may mean he has developed a single bone of credibility. If he opts to call this election fair then it just proves that his words on paper should come in two ply and be sold in the toiletry section.

As for voter ID: If the rest of the world (including third world countries) can manage to insist on voters actually being registered legal voters, then why can't it happen in the US? I mean that's security of the election 101. With regard to the Fed court saying that the transient, elderly,students and the poor are affected and that they are "much more likely" to vote Dem: well the elderly I would say are much more likely to vote Rep as they come from a time when this sort swamp behaviour was not tolerated. Students: I seriously think you should raise your voting age to 21 as the quality of the students/activist brains I've seen over the last 4 years is embarrassing to the US. Hopefully they would have matured a bit by 21. The transient: If that means hobos and the homeless then that figure is so small that it would be statistically insignificant. If it means transient voters as those who move around the country for work then I would say they are more than likely Rep voters as they actually like to work for a living. And yes the poor will vote Dem predominantly as the Dems give them free stuff. But if you can get off your ass to go get your free stuff you can get off your ass to obtain picture ID.

If you can't tell who is a registered legal voter how can you have a free and fair election. Like Trump said just yesterday: this election is an embarrassment, it's like a third world country!
I acknowledge your point, but regardless since the early naughties, each side has accused foul when they've lost the election. The ongoing post-election shit-fight seems to be a normal part of the fun now.
 

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We can disagree on this and I am sure I can create a counter argument for all of Mr. Gumbel points. Because his research is obviously slanted.

But if ID laws are the based on racist voter suppression, why is an ID needed to buy alcohol, tobacco, or get on a plane? That whole argument is nonsense.

Just out of curiosity how does voting work in Australia? I honeslty have no idea and would like to understand the differences.
Its a much more laid back affair in Oz, people just accept the outcome - and if they don't like it vote the other way in 3yrs time! But to keep the 2 main parties honest, if the state government is one party, some people vote the other way (federally) - that way there's some degree of checks and balances - to keep the bastards arguing with each other to get the best deal for your state.
 

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Hi Timbo, we’ll probably agree to disagree which is fine. We’re both entitled to our own opinion.
However, if we accept the vote counts from the 2020 Presidential election, which I don’t at this point but just assuming they are correct and legitimate, vs the 2016 election totals the U.S. population would have had to increased something on the order of 44 million people in 4 years for your logic to even begin to make any sense.
In 2016 Trump received about 63 million votes.
In 2020 Trump received about 74 million votes.
11 million more people voted for Trump in this election than last election. If that was due to an increase in population, and assuming the vote of that increased population was split 50/50 between Trump and Biden, and assuming a FULL 50% of that increased population was eligible to vote, and 100% of them DID actually vote... Well, you get the picture.
I just don’t believe your argument holds water. The fact remains 11 million more people were willing to vote for Trump in 2020 than 2016 which suggest to me that he couldn’t have alienated THAT many people due to his demeanor and personality.
I do agree that a number of people don’t care for Trump. But they sure as hell love his policies!
But let me ask you a question. Do you believe the Democrats knowingly cheated in an effort to get Biden/Harris election?
Yeah that's fine to agree to disagree, but your figures may just go to show how many people come out of the woodwork for this election - OR - BOTH sides have been indulging in a bit of voter fraud to get the record numbers?
 

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For 4 years, the Democrats tried to frame Trump for colluding with Russia. They had no proof. Zero.Zip.Nada

The fraud in this election cycle is there for all to see.

Trump received more votes then any sitting President in history. Pretty good numbers for a President that many claim was not well liked....eh?

Biden, spent most of his time in hiding, because he is a bumbling fool behind a microphone, and his rallies could hardly fill a parking lot. He received a historic 80 million votes????

This election was filled with numbers that don't add up, along with many statistical impossibilities.

Anybody that thinks Biden won this election, fair and square, I have some oceanfront property in Arizona that I would like to sell you. Cheap!
Yep, I get it you're a dyed-in-wool member of the repunant party - as opposed to those villainous good for nothing demonrats! But this is the US democracy, as enshrined by your constitution and laws, as the bastion of the free world - so let's see how this one pans out!!

If Biden gets in, then either you'll have to accept the law of land OR go fight another civil war if you really believe the system is corrupt.
:D Pop Popcorn:
 

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And they cheated. Blatantly. From big tech and media withholding key stories to voter fraud. They cheated.
You've more or less stated the same thing as another guy's response. O,disrespect, but I'm not going to repeat it, but just read through - you'll find it. Cheers!
 

Brent in Az

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Yep, I get it you're a dyed-in-wool member of the repunant party - as opposed to those villainous good for nothing demonrats! But this is the US democracy, as enshrined by your constitution and laws, as the bastion of the free world - so let's see how this one pans out!!

If Biden gets in, then either you'll have to accept the law of land OR go fight another civil war if you really believe the system is corrupt.
:D Pop Popcorn:
If a Civil war is what it takes to save this country from a Tyrannical Democrat party gone Radical ..... I'm all in on that.
 

Kevin Peacocke

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Could the Republicans and Democrats ever reconcile, or is it beyond that point?
 

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If Biden gets in, then either you'll have to accept the law of land OR go fight another civil war if you really believe the system is corrupt.

Most of your recent assertions in regard to election fraud the last few replies are so delusional they are not worthy of argument. In regard to this last comment, I would only point out that the "law of the land" should first apply to the laws that were broken to acquire said office in the first place.

As far as another civil war is concerned, it has already existed as a cold war which began shortly after Obama's first term in office. Obama's systematic alienation of the "real Americans" that you insultingly refer to as a dog whistle term for "racists", collectively began to grow increasingly sick and tired of a multitude of new ideologies all based in fake narratives and identity politics. We were introduced to the new ideology that told us we should be ashamed of our American exceptionalism, and repent for the crimes of previous generations. We were told that God is offensive, our entire political and economic systems were inherently racist, and abortion is not murder provided that the mother deems it so. For the next 8 years, Americans were told that we must accept these new narratives or pay the price by being publically ostracized.

However, what Obama and yourself apparently failed to account is that "Real Americans" come in all ethnicities and colors in case you hadn't noticed..? We are hard-working, mostly blue collar folks who are tired of being labeled racist for having populist views such as pride for our country which was founded upon Judeo-Christian values, respect for those who sacrificed for our freedoms, and most importantly, a reverence for the US Constitution "AS WRITTEN"...! Trump was the ONLY candidate who tapped into that concept and had the balls to run a political platform on it... That's how he defied the odds and destroyed a field of 17 establishment republicans to win the presidency despite a multitude of personal and character flaws that would have sunk any other candidate right out of the gate...

I believe we have reached that point of civil war when middle-aged couples from the suburbs have no choice but to stand armed on their front lawn to keep their home from being burned down, and then subsequently get arrested for doing do... I truly believe that there are more than enough angry "real Americans" who would fight an actual civil war. The problem with that is that unlike our previous civil war, we had political leaders capable of organizing and funding a rebellion. However, those types of leaders are non-existent today as evident of the indifference if not outright cowering we have already seen demonstrated by so many republican politicians in the course of this past year. Instead of outright war, it is highly more likely that we will increasingly see more civil disturbance taken to new and more violent levels than ever before. It is not unrealistic to expect to see various small, independent militias forming on local levels to defend their own homes, businesses, and property assuming the Biden Administration is going to continue the practice of encouraging, condoning, or turning a blind eye toward the violence from the anarchists. But who really knows? I wouldn't rule out anything at this point especially if the new Administration continues to cripple this country with national lockdowns and other assorted violations of our personal freedoms. When you push people to the point where they have nothing left to lose, anything is on the table.
 

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