Let’s hunt Lion

[chiefdale]

Hey friends,
I remember the first time I ever shot a predator. I shot a big bobcat in eastern North Carolina while deer hunting and remember just being amazed by all cats. I remember thinking bobcats will have to do until I can get to Africa.

The first go round to Africa I scratched a good bit of plains game off the list. My father is turning 60 and looking to go across again for his birthday.

last year, I got a bit overwhelmed trying to understand lion hunts in South Africa. Lot of interesting stuff and opinions.

I feel like a good starting place is the SAPA 8 ranches. It seems like some of them maybe don’t have people book directly.

would you ever hunt lion in SA apart from these ranches? If so, with who?

do some of them not book and let other PH come in to guide?

looking for direction on where you would start. Thanks

 

[375Fox]

Why not look into something like this instead of a “captive bred” lion hunt?

Wild Managed Lion Hunt As Well As Free Range Buffalo & Plains Game On 75,000 Acres Kalahari 2021/2022

Post edited on October 6, 2020: Due to the pandemic we now offer this hunt during the 2021 and 2022 hunting season. In a continuous effort to provide, topmost hunting areas and trophy quality game to our hunters, Limpopo Big Game Safaris signed a 5-year hunting agreement in the Kalahari...

www.africahunting.com

 

[Frederik]

Chiefdale, Hans de Klerk who posts here has one of those 8 ranches registered by SAPA, 24th September I'm setting foot there for my lioness hunt.

Just search for @DE KLERK SAFARIS.

 

[mark-hunter]

Hunting lion in Africa, for working people, with limited budget, is only possible in South Africa. So, who wans to hunt lion on budget, goes there. Fact.

So, Option one for me, in theory would be sapa approved ranches, option 2 other ranches.
Acceptable.
This will depend on several factors - price, reputation of outfitter, reccomendations and refferemces from other clients, size of hunting area (acreage), etc

Hunting lion in south africa, is ethically similar to hunt anything else in south africa (because of fence), and from my remote perspective from another continent::

I am not in position from my place of living, not knowing souht african local ways, by using internet, email, whatsapp or phone - to determine with certainty what is difference bewteen - 1) captive bread lion hunt - 2) wild managed lion hunt, or 3) wild lion hunt in south africa because all hunting is done in the fence and the line between these 3 is blurred.

I can do all the due diligence I want, and simply I came to conclusion that I cannot make difference of this three possiblities.
I suppose I would be able to smell 4) put and take lion hunt operation, because of education I had on this forum, but even that is questionable.

So in south africa to hunt lion, the main reason is affodability, then we have to make some compromise, take risks, and make smart choices.

To hunt wild lion anywhere else is a costly affair, afordable to some, but for blue collar it is not.

 

[IvW]

Start with what you want first....what type of hunt are you interested in? And then what is your budget...

 

[BAYLY SIPPEL SAFARIS]

We hunt on one of the SAPA approved ranches and believe in terms of quality of experience you will struggle to find better. We would love to speak to you about the hunt if you have any questions at all! Here is our hunt we offer below:

Lion & Lioness Hunting With Bayly Sippel Safaris

Good day AH Community, We hope you are all doing fantastic and are looking forward to all the upcoming adventures this season! This is a great hunt that we are happy to offer to everyone here. Please bear in mind that there is still a non export policy in place for hunters wanting to export to...

www.africahunting.com

Kind regards,
Dempsey Bayly & Michael Sippel

 

[TSALA HUNTING SAFARIS]

Good Day Chiefdale

There are very good Outfitters on here that would be more than happy to share info with you regarding the different scenarios at play for lion hunting in Souther Africa.

Lion hunts in Souther Africa differ greatly in cost and experience ( baited or on foot ).My advice would be talk to as many Outfitters as possible.

You are most welcome to contact me as we do hunt on one of 8 SAPA accredited ranches and also have a few other option available.

Regards

Rouan

 

[375Fox]

1) captive bread lion hunt - 2) wild managed lion hunt, or 3) wild lion hunt in south africa because all hunting is done in the fence and the line between these 3 is blurred.

How is the line between these 3 categories blurred? “Captive bred” is born and raised as a farm animal until it’s released on to a hunting farm a week before your hunt, no intention of creating self sustaining populations. Wild managed is a fenced property where lions were established with intentions of a self sustaining population and hunt, fight, and breed like wild lions. Wild lions would be lions against a park area that are free to move and obviously hunt, fight, breed as they naturally would. If you want to draw a distinction ask how many lions are harvested off a 15,000(?) acre SAPA ranch each year compared to other options. The distinction is very clear to me.

 

[Spear Safaris]

Chiefdale, I think you must also decide if you want your trophy to go home or not, and if do want it, you must see which of the Lions may be exported to the USA currently.

 

[mark-hunter]

@375Fox You are very lucky to have clear picture, from your place. because I dont.
Tetxbook definition is very clear to me and I agree with you. But:
But once you start doing your research, and before going to hunt, you will be forced to trust safari operator whatever he is telling you. Lions generally do not have a tag with date of release into the fenced game hunting area ( a day, a week, a month earlier... ), or where and how they have been raised, and at this point, you will base your decision to whatever you have been told, and if it is to your satisfaction, then it is.

We can also judge by the fact of nuber of lions taken per year in certain areas size (like 15k acres you mentioend), for which you have a point, but again you have no way of really knowing how many lions have been hunted really, but only to conisder the number you are told.
Again you have to trust, what you are told, and then to go hunting in good faith. So, it all comes down to trust and good faith.
sapa operators do give some security.

What I am saying, we, as a foreign client are a bit of disandvatage on this.

On the other hand, south africa is great opportunity to hunt lion. All I am saying, who ever goes there for lion will have to choose wisely, and there is always a risk of getting a different type of hunt then expected. And after such hunt, there is also a chance, the client will be perfectly happy and unaware what he has been sold.

 

[sierraone]

Most people on this forum cannot afford to hunt a "wild lion" and import it to the U.S.. That's just a financial fact. A South African fenced hunt and leaving it there is their (and would be mine) only choice. Same with a bull elephant hunt as far as my knowledge goes. No disrespect meant to any of you, just a financial fact. So @chiefdale, do your homework so you won't be overly disappointed.

 

[375Fox]

@375Fox You are very lucky to have clear picture, from your place. because I dont.
Tetxbook definition is very clear to me and I agree with you. But:
But once you start doing your research, and before going to hunt, you will be forced to trust safari operator whatever he is telling you. Lions generally do not have a tag with date of release into the fenced game hunting area ( a day, a week, a month earlier... ), or where and how they have been raised, and at this point, you will base your decision to whatever you have been told, and if it is to your satisfaction, then it is.

We can also judge by the fact of nuber of lions taken per year in certain areas size (like 15k acres you mentioend), for which you have a point, but again you have no way of really knowing how many lions have been hunted really, but only to conisder the number you are told.
Again you have to trust, what you are told, and then to go hunting in good faith. So, it all comes down to trust and good faith.
sapa operators do give some security.

What I am saying, we, as a foreign client are a bit of disandvatage on this.

On the other hand, south africa is great opportunity to hunt lion. All I am saying, who ever goes there for lion will have to choose wisely, and there is always a risk of getting a different type of hunt then expected. And after such hunt, there is also a chance, the client will be perfectly happy and unaware what he has been sold.

We are not in disagreement like I thought. There is definitely a blurred line with how they are marketed. I do think the true “captive bred” short release time hunts are very clear to see, any of these 8 SAPA ranches. I won’t argue they can be more dangerous than a wild lion hunt, but I find farm raising lions to be released and shot impossible to ethically defend.

 

[Daktari]

Where can Americans import lions from? Is it only CBL liona in South Africa and wild lions in Ethiopia?

 

[Hunting Hitman]

Where can Americans import lions from? Is it only CBL liona in South Africa and wild lions in Ethiopia?

Zambia for sure and I believe Tanzania as well.

 

[K-man]

Where can Americans import lions from? Is it only CBL liona in South Africa and wild lions in Ethiopia?

Zambia for sure and I believe Tanzania as well.

Lions have been and can be imported from the Save and Bubye conservation areas into the U.S. (Zimbabwe)

 

[Frank Cavallo]

You can split hairs all you want, SA captive bred whether released or roaming within a fence are still dangerous game. But they are not wild. SA are fenced, the rest are pretty much wild.

Importation requires much documentation, including where the trophy money goes- schools, etc. Of course the biologist at Fish & Game needs to see numbers, etc.

My lion is literally in customs right now. Shot him in Zim -Sango (Save Valley) in September 2018. Took 2 years to get the import permit and nearly a year to get him stateside (COVID). I did not apply for a permit until after I shot him, others have gotten them prior to the hunt. (I doubt you'll ever get a captive bred lion into the US).

At the time, non importable SA canned hunts were in the 20s. "Alleged" importable SA canned lions were in the 50s

Zambian lions were in the 100-120s. Zim lions were 60-100. I forgot what the Tanzania lions were going for, perhaps 80-100? Of course that does not include bait.

My lion was $100 all in. That's him on bait in my avatar.

PS my lion hunt was an absolutely magical experience....

 

[Riksa]

You can find cheaper Lion hunt option from Cameroon. I have no idea whether you can import that to US or not. For example JKO Safaris / Jacques Spamer can help you with these.

Also if you'd be OK with a Lioness, every second year there has been wild Lionesses available in Zim. You can check this option with Mbalabala Safaris / Lin Stanton.

 

[Frederik]

Just a bit of topic but what does non importation of lion or elephant for that matter actually help the wildlife in the long run???

If you can afford to, do a wild lion great but most of us as much as we would like too will not get there unless finding that magical number ticket in a Lottery ticket or rich Nigerian relative leaving you millions.

Instead of spending 1000's on day fees and time to shoot bait and get it hung to get a wild lion on bait I'm going to skip these steps and hunt like they use to in Botswana and look for tracks and track my lioness down.

My lion will be adjusted to its environment and if stupid and not being able to catch its own food will starve and be pissed off. The lion will not be drugged or kept on the same area with a donkey carcass left in close proximity of water. It will be with the other lions left to roam the 15 000 acres or more of Kalahari sands to fend for itself and might even be stupid enough to try and tackle a buffalo.

I will track the lion down with the help of trackers and PH look the lion in the eye that it will pierce my inner human nature and then fulfill one of my lifelong dreams. On that although struggling but managing to get the funds together for this hunt my wife stands behind me and knows if I don't do it NOW! This stupid greenie mind invested crowd might get it right to close down lion hunting I will be less of a hunter inside.

Do your homework hunt with the right people the end result is a hunt for a lion be it wild or not inside that animal the instinct stays the same to be the top of the food chain king of the jungle and 500 pounds of pure feline fury.

24 September is rollling in slowly but surely.

 

[VertigoBE]

Just a bit of topic but what does non importation of lion or elephant for that matter actually help the wildlife in the long run???

If you can afford to, do a wild lion great but most of us as much as we would like too will not get there unless finding that magical number ticket in a Lottery ticket or rich Nigerian relative leaving you millions.

Instead of spending 1000's on day fees and time to shoot bait and get it hung to get a wild lion on bait I'm going to skip these steps and hunt like they use to in Botswana and look for tracks and track my lioness down.

My lion will be adjusted to its environment and if stupid and not being able to catch its own food will starve and be pissed off. The lion will not be drugged or kept on the same area with a donkey carcass left in close proximity of water. It will be with the other lions left to roam the 15 000 acres or more of Kalahari sands to fend for itself and might even be stupid enough to try and tackle a buffalo.

I will track the lion down with the help of trackers and PH look the lion in the eye that it will pierce my inner human nature and then fulfill one of my lifelong dreams. On that although struggling but managing to get the funds together for this hunt my wife stands behind me and knows if I don't do it NOW! This stupid greenie mind invested crowd might get it right to close down lion hunting I will be less of a hunter inside.

Do your homework hunt with the right people the end result is a hunt for a lion be it wild or not inside that animal the instinct stays the same to be the top of the food chain king of the jungle and 500 pounds of pure feline fury.

24 September is rollling in slowly but surely.

Looking forward to your report Frederik!

 

[FARO EAST NORTH CAMEROON]

Hey friends,
I remember the first time I ever shot a predator. I shot a big bobcat in eastern North Carolina while deer hunting and remember just being amazed by all cats. I remember thinking bobcats will have to do until I can get to Africa.

The first go round to Africa I scratched a good bit of plains game off the list. My father is turning 60 and looking to go across again for his birthday.

last year, I got a bit overwhelmed trying to understand lion hunts in South Africa. Lot of interesting stuff and opinions.

I feel like a good starting place is the SAPA 8 ranches. It seems like some of them maybe don’t have people book directly.

would you ever hunt lion in SA apart from these ranches? If so, with who?

do some of them not book and let other PH come in to guide?

looking for direction on where you would start.

Hello, after no longer hunting in burkina and in CAR Cameroon remains the only Central African place where you can have a real and true lion hunting. If you are interested let me know. Rgds Patrick Dahlan