If the 9.3x62 became the new legal minimum?

Joined
Oct 28, 2018
Messages
3,412
Reaction score
5,266
Location
Wyong new south Wales Australia
Media
8
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
SSAA
Hunted
Australia
If the 9.3x62 became the new legal minimum caliber for dangerous game in all of Africa:
- Would you consider replacing your 375 with a 9.3 (If you did not currently own a 9.3x62)?
- For a one rifle safari, which included plains game and Cape buffalo, would you feel comfortable with only the 9.3x62?
- For someone who owns neither, but plans on hunting Africa (someday), asks you to help them choose between the 9.3x62 and 375?

I realize this has probably been kicked around in one form or another but, was hoping to get everyone’s thoughts.
Thanks...
@Randy Bo
I would feel quite comfortable using my 35 Whelen loaded with 310 grain RNSP or solid for buffalo of any sort, but then again I'm a bit irregular on my thoughts.
Bob
 

Nhoro

AH enthusiast
Joined
Sep 16, 2014
Messages
372
Reaction score
468
Media
26
IIRC the 9.3x62 is and has been legal in Zim (or one of the African nations) for some time.

as to the question: sure. I have both a 9.3x62 and a 375 H&H. I have driven 286 gr Partitions at 2500 FPS chrono’d in my 9.3. The 375 drives 300 gr bullets at 2500.

I doubt any critter would know the difference.
With all currently available factory ammunition, the 9,3 x 62 is NOT legal in Zimbabwe for Category A animals (Hippo/Buffalo/Elephant). It does not make the minimum energy but does make the minimum calibre. Handloads can make the legal requirement- 3982 ft/lbs. There used to be a 293 gr TUG bullet loaded at 2515 fps which developed 4110 ft/lbs so it could be done with factory ammo.

Your handload above is at 3970 fp/lbss so a little more (2504) fps would get you legal. In theory, Zim National Parks could require you to prove your stats by firing 5 rounds over a chrono and averaging it but that is highly unlikely . Mostly, you would get away with it cos no one will ask.

As to practical differences, they are both capable calibres but one is legal in Zim and one can be legal if you handload judiciously.
 
Joined
Oct 28, 2018
Messages
3,412
Reaction score
5,266
Location
Wyong new south Wales Australia
Media
8
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
SSAA
Hunted
Australia
If the 9.3x62 became the new legal minimum caliber for dangerous game in all of Africa:
- Would you consider replacing your 375 with a 9.3 (If you did not currently own a 9.3x62)?
- For a one rifle safari, which included plains game and Cape buffalo, would you feel comfortable with only the 9.3x62?
- For someone who owns neither, but plans on hunting Africa (someday), asks you to help them choose between the 9.3x62 and 375?

I realize this has probably been kicked around in one form or another but, was hoping to get everyone’s thoughts.
Thanks...
@Randy Bo
I would feel quite comfortable using my 35 Whelen loaded with 310 grain RNSP or solid for buffalo of any sort, but then again I'm a bit irregular on my thoughts.
Bob
With all currently available factory ammunition, the 9,3 x 62 is NOT legal in Zimbabwe for Category A animals (Hippo/Buffalo/Elephant). It does not make the minimum energy but does make the minimum calibre. Handloads can make the legal requirement- 3982 ft/lbs. There used to be a 293 gr TUG bullet loaded at 2515 fps which developed 4110 ft/lbs so it could be done with factory ammo.

Your handload above is at 3970 fp/lbss so a little more (2504) fps would get you legal. In theory, Zim National Parks could require you to prove your stats by firing 5 rounds over a chrono and averaging it but that is highly unlikely . Mostly, you would get away with it cos no one will ask.

As to practical differences, they are both capable calibres but one is legal in Zim and one can be legal if you handload judiciously.
@Nhoro
If 3,900 fpe is legal muzzle energy for the 9.3 then the 35 Whelen and 358 Norma should be legal with both capable of over 4,000 fpe should theoretically be legal as well.
Bob
 

Nhoro

AH enthusiast
Joined
Sep 16, 2014
Messages
372
Reaction score
468
Media
26
@Randy Bo
I would feel quite comfortable using my 35 Whelen loaded with 310 grain RNSP or solid for buffalo of any sort, but then again I'm a bit irregular on my thoughts.
Bob

@Nhoro
If 3,900 fpe is legal muzzle energy for the 9.3 then the 35 Whelen and 358 Norma should be legal with both capable of over 4,000 fpe should theoretically be legal as well.
Bob
I don't think so. Law requirement is over .362 " + energy requirement.
 
Joined
Oct 28, 2018
Messages
3,412
Reaction score
5,266
Location
Wyong new south Wales Australia
Media
8
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
SSAA
Hunted
Australia
I chose a .375H&H over a 9.3x?? for a few reasons.
First was the obvious DG legal issue.
But right behind that was ammo availability.

Although 9.3 ammo is more common in Africa.
What if I'm in Alaska?
375 ammo is just easier to find.

So I would not trade my 375.
Plus, it kinda belongs to my wife.
No need to kick that hornets nest.
@BeeMaa
I'm sure you would prefer to face a wounded leopard and charging buff than an angry Mrs BeeMaa.
At least you can shoot the other 2 and be safe. Not so with the last one.
Bob
 
Joined
Oct 28, 2018
Messages
3,412
Reaction score
5,266
Location
Wyong new south Wales Australia
Media
8
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
SSAA
Hunted
Australia
Double Expresso - Whisky Lagavulin 16 on payday rest of month Mr Walker Red - Ohh not adverse to progress love the 17HMR it is amazing development - and as has become strange in these strange times - I am as a male attracted to females ! Shocking I know - Even worse hunt with a 303 and if the post from Auz ever arrives with the dies a 303-25 will add that for the small stuff !
@Odinsraven
Hopefully the dies for your 303-25 arrive soon. If'n you need any load data on it do not hesitate to contact me. It has been one of my favourite calibers for a long time.i like it that much I even created my own wildcat version to improve it.
What rifle have you got it on
Bob
 
Joined
Oct 28, 2018
Messages
3,412
Reaction score
5,266
Location
Wyong new south Wales Australia
Media
8
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
SSAA
Hunted
Australia
I like the handle.

We're not too far apart, I'm in Richmond.
@Sgt Zim
I know it's the wrong post mate it should be on the reloader 22 post but fear not once again
Load from a disc says 45 grains of CFE223 behind a 180g bullet for a max pressure of 52,000 cup. Start 2 grains lower and work up.
I know you have plenty of CFE223 and couldn't find load data for the 180 grain.
The above is for the 308 Winchester only and the usual caution applies.
Bob
 

Randy Bo

AH member
Joined
Jul 28, 2018
Messages
23
Reaction score
33
In a world full of ‘What If’s’: Had the 9.3x62 been declared the minimum caliber in all of Africa, from the beginning, is it possible that @Red Leg’s post on page one of this thread:
“I have used the .375 with 300 gr bullets so often and with such predictably excellent results on everything from Suni to Buffalo, that I would never consider trading it out for a 9.3. All I would be gaining would be a slightly lighter rifle (maybe) with zero advantages in ballistics on any game I hunt in Africa.”
might have read:
I have used the 9.3x62 with 286 gr bullets so often and with such predictably excellent results on everything from Suni to Buffalo, that I would never consider trading it out for a .375. All I would be gaining would be a slightly heavier rifle (maybe), with slightly more recoil (maybe) and with only slightly better ballistics (on paper with .375/300 gr bullets/ as per @doctari505), on any game I hunt in Africa.

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen’s ‘irregular thinking’ was the inspiration for this question.
 
Joined
Oct 28, 2018
Messages
3,412
Reaction score
5,266
Location
Wyong new south Wales Australia
Media
8
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
SSAA
Hunted
Australia
In a world full of ‘What If’s’: Had the 9.3x62 been declared the minimum caliber in all of Africa, from the beginning, is it possible that @Red Leg’s post on page one of this thread:
“I have used the .375 with 300 gr bullets so often and with such predictably excellent results on everything from Suni to Buffalo, that I would never consider trading it out for a 9.3. All I would be gaining would be a slightly lighter rifle (maybe) with zero advantages in ballistics on any game I hunt in Africa.”
might have read:
I have used the 9.3x62 with 286 gr bullets so often and with such predictably excellent results on everything from Suni to Buffalo, that I would never consider trading it out for a .375. All I would be gaining would be a slightly heavier rifle (maybe), with slightly more recoil (maybe) and with only slightly better ballistics (on paper with .375/300 gr bullets/ as per @doctari505), on any game I hunt in Africa.

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen’s ‘irregular thinking’ was the inspiration for this question.
@Randy Bo
Irregular thinking is good for developing crazy shit like a rimmed 25 cal that gives the 257 weatherby a run for its money, a bolt action 444 Marlin and a decent load for the 35 Whelen that gives the 250grain projectiles 2,700fps and shakes up the 338 win mag.
A little bit of crazy is a good thing at times.
Bob
 

bruce moulds

AH legend
Joined
Aug 10, 2018
Messages
2,626
Reaction score
3,637
could 2500 be a hot load for the x62 using 293 and 300 gn bullets?
i know that while these bullets can do 2600 with good loads in the x64, 2500 is still a fair load in that case with bigger capacity.
these loads are also starting to generate a fair ammount of recoil in a light rifle.
from experience with 293 tug, i would not use it on bovines at those kind of speeds, and john taylor described that bullet as a bit soft for those speeds as well on bigger game.
he liked the bullet at reduced velocities.
bruce.
 

samu

AH veteran
Joined
Dec 28, 2019
Messages
118
Reaction score
240
Media
2
@Randy Bo
Irregular thinking is good for developing crazy shit like a rimmed 25 cal that gives the 257 weatherby a run for its money, a bolt action 444 Marlin and a decent load for the 35 Whelen that gives the 250grain projectiles 2,700fps and shakes up the 338 win mag.
A little bit of crazy is a good thing at times.
Bob
I don't know if I've asked before but how long is the barrel on that Marlin? I've been tempted to try and one up these numbers from 9,3x62 but I'm starting to suspect 20" barrel is going to be bit of a handicap there.
 

samu

AH veteran
Joined
Dec 28, 2019
Messages
118
Reaction score
240
Media
2
could 2500 be a hot load for the x62 using 293 and 300 gn bullets?
i know that while these bullets can do 2600 with good loads in the x64, 2500 is still a fair load in that case with bigger capacity.
these loads are also starting to generate a fair ammount of recoil in a light rifle.
from experience with 293 tug, i would not use it on bovines at those kind of speeds, and john taylor described that bullet as a bit soft for those speeds as well on bigger game.
he liked the bullet at reduced velocities.
bruce.
From 24" barrel 9,3x62 could probably do 2600fps with 285gr Norma Oryx and RL-17.

Then again, I chose 9,3 to have enough gun for moose, boar and bears with short barrel and copper bullets so my goals are bit different, more like 250gr TTSX or one of the 230gr options.
 

bruce moulds

AH legend
Joined
Aug 10, 2018
Messages
2,626
Reaction score
3,637
i find a 286 at 2600 a very serious load in the x64, and regard it as a place not to go further than.
not questioning that you can get it in the x62, but it would worry me.
how is your case life?
comparing the x62 to the x64 could be likened to the 338/06 vs 338 win.
bruce.
 

samu

AH veteran
Joined
Dec 28, 2019
Messages
118
Reaction score
240
Media
2
i find a 286 at 2600 a very serious load in the x64, and regard it as a place not to go further than.
not questioning that you can get it in the x62, but it would worry me.
how is your case life?
comparing the x62 to the x64 could be likened to the 338/06 vs 338 win.
bruce.
That was just the simulation. I tried one run with RS 60 behind 250gr E-tip and there's certainly potential but my first series stopped bit short. Then hunting season came and put an end to the experimenting. I'll have another go with RS 52 and 250gr TTSX at some point and will definitely post results somewhere.

Few things to understand, CIP p_max for x62 is 3900bar and 4400bar for x64, but in the case itself, there's really not much difference that would make x64 withstand higher pressures. Sure the case head will probably expand less at higher charges. Using similar burn rate powder gives about the same pressure curves with same p_max. Another disadvantage is the case capacity. There are few powders unmatched with energy density i.e. energy content per mass times bulk density. Alliants RL-17 is one, RS 60 is nearly the same, just tiny bit slower.
Last there's generous throat and magazine on R8. E-tip I could load to 3.386 COL and Oryx is shorter bullet. Using same seating depth, powder etc. x64 should get to at least 2700fps.
 
Joined
Oct 28, 2018
Messages
3,412
Reaction score
5,266
Location
Wyong new south Wales Australia
Media
8
Hunting reports
Africa
1
Member of
SSAA
Hunted
Australia
I don't know if I've asked before but how long is the barrel on that Marlin? I've been tempted to try and one up these numbers from 9,3x62 but I'm starting to suspect 20" barrel is going to be bit of a handicap there.
@samu
The barrel on my BOLT ACTION 444 marlin was 22 inches.
Bob
 

HWL

AH elite
Joined
Aug 29, 2016
Messages
1,150
Reaction score
2,081
Location
Germany
Media
203
Hunted
RSA, Namibia, Germany, Austria, Norway
It does not make the minimum energy but does make the minimum calibre. Handloads can make the legal requirement- 3982 ft/lbs. There used to be a 293 gr TUG bullet loaded at 2515 fps which developed 4110 ft/lbs so it could be done with factory ammo.

Your handload above is at 3970 fp/lbss so a little more (2504) fps would get you legal. In theory, Zim National Parks could require you to prove your stats by firing 5 rounds over a chrono and averaging it but that is highly unlikely . Mostly, you would get away with it cos no one will ask.
You will leave safe pressure area doing so.

This kind of performance is the 9,3x64 was made for....


HWL
 

Forum statistics

Threads
36,781
Messages
697,516
Members
64,811
Latest member
MarshallLe
 

 

 

Latest profile posts

Rob404 wrote on Newboomer's profile.
I,d like to buy some pistol primers if they available,thanks
Rifle57 wrote on Rimshot's profile.
I bought some bullets from Rimshot and he is good to trade with!
Greetings all! I've been a hunter for 50 years, but only now planning a trip to Africa. I was fortunate and successfully bid on a couple hunts for plains game in SA later this year and next. Also a rare Native Texas (5th generation) and USMC Vet. Hunt safe y'all!
uujm wrote on trg's profile.
I am looking for a Safari Express. Was yours made in New Haven or South Carolina? Any other details you can give me? I am very motivated to buy.
pimes wrote on flatwater bill's profile.
Hello Bill - can you tell me that landowner/ranch/outfitter - Thank you!
 
Top