Converting a 7.92x57 Mauser to .35 Whelen

hawkeyesatx

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I know I’m probably beating a dead horse subject, but I didn’t see any postings about either rechambering and rebore, or switch the barrel out.
But, my concern would be that the feed rails. Would they have to be modified slightly for the longer cartridge?
What is the most cost effective for everything?



Hawk
 
Why don't you start with something already set up for what you want? Simpsons. Ltd has several Husqvarna 1640 Mausers in caliber .30-'06, which could be converted to .35 Whelen with a minimum of extra work. https://simpsonltd.com/search-results-page?q=Husqvarna+1640+.30-06 For $400-$500 you can start with something which already has commercial features, no alterations necessary, and feeding issues, if any, should be minor.
 

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I did this conversion about 4-5 years ago.. it was as simple as a barrel swap… the bolt, magazine, rails, etc all work perfectly with no modification or tweaking required…

Midwayusa used to carry short chambered green mountain .35 Whelen barrels for about $100… total cost was about $160 after I rented a reamer to finish the chamber out.. total time invested to yank the old barrel off, seat the new one, and then finish the chamber was less than 90 minutes..

I actually just shot the rifle this afternoon.. my wife is taking it on an eland hunt in a few weeks… it loves both 200 and 225gr Barnes ttsx loaded to about 2700/2600 respectively and will do sub 1” groups all day long with either..

After shooting her .35 Whelen this afternoon, I’m seriously considering building another one for myself if I can find another reasonably priced action and barrel anytime soon
 
Why don't you start with something already set up for what you want? Simpsons. Ltd has several Husqvarna 1640 Mausers in caliber .30-'06, which could be converted to .35 Whelen with a minimum of extra work. https://simpsonltd.com/search-results-page?q=Husqvarna+1640+.30-06 For $400-$500 you can start with something which already has commercial features, no alterations necessary, and feeding issues, if any, should be minor.

I was thinking the exact same thing.
I bought a sporter 8mm Mauser with a 25 inch barrel.
I’m going to send it to JES for a rechamber/rebore to 35 Whelen.
It’s only going to cost $250, and on top of the $330 I spent, I can’t argue about getting a really decent 35 Whelen for under $600.
I’m bookmarking Simpson’s. They seem to have really good deals on the old Husqvarna’s!


Hawk
 
I did this conversion about 4-5 years ago.. it was as simple as a barrel swap… the bolt, magazine, rails, etc all work perfectly with no modification or tweaking required…

Midwayusa used to carry short chambered green mountain .35 Whelen barrels for about $100… total cost was about $160 after I rented a reamer to finish the chamber out.. total time invested to yank the old barrel off, seat the new one, and then finish the chamber was less than 90 minutes..

I actually just shot the rifle this afternoon.. my wife is taking it on an eland hunt in a few weeks… it loves both 200 and 225gr Barnes ttsx loaded to about 2700/2600 respectively and will do sub 1” groups all day long with either..

After shooting her .35 Whelen this afternoon, I’m seriously considering building another one for myself if I can find another reasonably priced action and barrel anytime soon

Phew!!!
I’m glad I won’t have to be doing any feed rail alterations!
I’ve heard really good things about JES reboring/rechambering to 35 Whelen, or 35 Whelen AI to the old Mausers.
Someone I know said I had to watch pressures for the “old” military rifles since they were soft metal.
Is this true?
I wouldn’t think JES would be doing the rebores if that were the case.
He said to keep pressures around 58k psi.
He said he was running 64k psi in his modern rifle with his 35 Whelen AI.
I would imagine that I could probably run the regular 35 Whelen to 62k psi without a hiccup or undue stress.
What do you say?


Hawk
 
It really depends on the individual action..

If you’re talking a pre WW2 German, Belgian, or Czech made Mauser you’re talking some of the strongest and best made actions ever built… remember many of the “foreign” mausers like the Brazilian, Argentine, Mexican, and Chinese mausers were actually “German”,FN, or Czech made as well, and simply marked with a foreign crest after they were exported…

Although some 98 mausers were indeed made under license in other countries..

If you’re talking about a German made Mauser that was manufactured during the war years.. that can be a little sketchy.. as production numbers went up and resource availability went down, the quality of some rifles that came out of the German factories became questionable… the later into the war you get, the more iffy things get…

Spanish mausers (small ring) have a particularly bad reputation for being “soft”…

98 Mauser actions manufactured in Germany, Belgium, Serbia, Yugoslavia, etc after the war was over have all been known to be well made, properly heat treated, use quality steel, etc… I haven’t heard of any “soft” actions coming out of the major factories producing commercial mausers post WW2…

All that said… I’ve got a 35 Whelen built on a 1937 BRNO VZ24 action, a 30-06 built on an Argentine Mauser action, a 416 Taylor built on a Brazilian Mauser action, and a 7x57 built on a SR Spanish Mauser action… I built all of them myself.. I shoot full power loads through all of them routinely.. and I’ve never had a problem with any of them showing any signs of pressure or stress issues…
 
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Here is the rifle I just bought.
Description is GEW98, 7.92x57mm, 25 inch barrel.
But if it’s a 7.92x57, it’s a JS bore, and I would think it has the heat treatment for a stronger action done at the factory, more than likely.


Hawk


IMG_1258.jpg

IMG_1259.jpg
 
GEW98 and JS bore doesnt really tell you much.. Thats just the make/model (no indication of which arsenal it came out of), and JS is the most common bore ever made in the GEW 98..

The best indicators of quality are going to be the arsenal/factory and the year of manufacture.. but unless when you pick up the rifle you find that it was made in late 1944 or early 1945 and has something funky going on with the action that makes you raise an eyebrow, I wouldnt be too worried around it..

The 8mm Mauser (JS) produces about 56K pressure (factory loads, CIP).. The35 Whelen produces about 62K.. tens of thousands of GEW98's (military, non magnum actions) have been converted to 300H&H.. 300H&H produces 62K pressure..

German made military mausers were pressure tested and proofed to 1000 atmospheres of pressure beyond their military/factory loads.. the 7mm and 8mm Mauser german factory military ammunition generated 57,600 PSI, which equates to 4050 atmospheres.. which means the minimum standard PSI for an action to leave the factory (CIP) was roughly 72,000... (a significant margin of error over what a max load 35 Whelen will produce).. and many german military made mausers subjected to extreme testing have survived pressure tests up to 100K CIP before coming apart..
 
GEW98 and JS bore doesnt really tell you much.. Thats just the make/model (no indication of which arsenal it came out of), and JS is the most common bore ever made in the GEW 98..

The best indicators of quality are going to be the arsenal/factory and the year of manufacture.. but unless when you pick up the rifle you find that it was made in late 1944 or early 1945 and has something funky going on with the action that makes you raise an eyebrow, I wouldnt be too worried around it..

The 8mm Mauser (JS) produces about 56K pressure (factory loads, CIP).. The35 Whelen produces about 62K.. tens of thousands of GEW98's (military, non magnum actions) have been converted to 300H&H.. 300H&H produces 62K pressure..

German made military mausers were pressure tested and proofed to 1000 atmospheres of pressure beyond their military/factory loads.. the 7mm and 8mm Mauser german factory military ammunition generated 57,600 PSI, which equates to 4050 atmospheres.. which means the minimum standard PSI for an action to leave the factory (CIP) was roughly 72,000... (a significant margin of error over what a max load 35 Whelen will produce).. and many german military made mausers subjected to extreme testing have survived pressure tests up to 100K CIP before coming apart..

Now that’s what I like to hear!
I’m glad you really know your stuff!!
I’m not going to worry about it then.


Hawk
 
:)

I dont know that I really know my stuff, so much as I went through exactly what youre going through when I started building rifles out of old miliary mauser actions a few years back.. I was concerned about max pressure, steel qualities, whether or not an old action built in the 30's that got drug through mud and debris for years and then likely stored in someones attic for the next 40+ years could possibly be accurate or made to look decent after decades of rust, pitting, etc... I was also concerned about the overall quality of a rifle made in Brazil, Argentina, Mexico, China, Singapore, etc over half a century ago (until I realized most of those "foreign" mausers were actually made in German, Czech, or Belgian factories to the exact same standard as BRNO, DWM, FN etc mausers and then just exported to the country whose name the rifle bears...)..

Turns out the best mauser I own (tightest fit, best steel, best overall condition, etc) is a Mauser manufactured for China... its action was used for my .35 Whelen build.. Once I researched a bit, I found that BRNO made a large number of M98 mausers (the VZ24) for China in the mid to late 30's just before the Japanese invaded.. The Chinese stored most of these rifles in warehouses not wanting to issue them because they were new/nice, and they knew they would need them if/when they were ultimately attacked by a foreign power..

The Japanese did in fact invade in July 1937.. and overran China so quickly that almost none of the mausers ever actually made it out of the warehouse.. My "China" VZ24 was made in early 1937 and likely barely made if off the boat before the Japanese took it..

When the Japanese took over the warehouses, they didnt want the mausers either.. they werent chambered in a caliber they could easily use, and they preferred their Arisakas.. so they just locked them up, secured the storage facilities, and sat on them in case they ever needed them..

VZ24's built for China all start with a P in their serial number.. just under 200,000 were exported, and they are considered by many to be the best "pre war" mausers you can buy (well made, almost certainly never actually fielded or used, stored well, etc..)..

As a side note / fun fact.. The Japanese also bought about 40,000 VZ24's from BRNO just prior to WWII kicking off.. but very few of them were ever issued, for the same reason(s) they didnt field the Chinese VZ24's once they were captured.. I think most, if not all of them went to the Japanese Navy.. So if you ever find a Japanese Mauser.. it is also likely very, very good.. (although if still in its original military configuration, and not already sporterized, it is also likely going to be VERY expensive as collectors go nuts over them since they are relatively rare now)..
 
I know I’m probably beating a dead horse subject, but I didn’t see any postings about either rechambering and rebore, or switch the barrel out.
But, my concern would be that the feed rails. Would they have to be modified slightly for the longer cartridge?
What is the most cost effective for everything?



Hawk
@hawkeyesatx
I used a M17 Enfield for my Whelen AI. Just needed a barrel and no mods plus holds 6 rounds in the mag plus one in the chamber.
More than enough fire power.
 
@hawkeyesatx
I used a M17 Enfield for my Whelen AI. Just needed a barrel and no mods plus holds 6 rounds in the mag plus one in the chamber.
More than enough fire power.
Hawkeyesatx,

I developed a headspace problem with my 1917 Enfield (I'd prefer not to go into why) and the cure for it was to send the rifle to P.O. Ackley for a rebore to .35 caliber and a rechamber to .35 Brown Improved Whelen. That would have been around 1960-61, so I've been using it for 60 years now and killed a couple of deer with it as recently as two years ago.
 
Hawkeyesatx,

I developed a headspace problem with my 1917 Enfield (I'd prefer not to go into why) and the cure for it was to send the rifle to P.O. Ackley for a rebore to .35 caliber and a rechamber to .35 Brown Improved Whelen. That would have been around 1960-61, so I've been using it for 60 years now and killed a couple of deer with it as recently as two years ago.
@xausa
Very unusual for an Enfields to develop headspace problems because they are actually stronger than the 98 Mauser.
The only reason I can think of is bad gunsmithing.
I would love to hear about you experience with the brown improved Whelen. What loads, projectiles and velocity as well as how it performs on game.
Being a 35 it should work well.
I had the Whelen AI but went back to the standard Whelen. Less hassle and no need to fireform cases.
Bob
 
GEW98 and JS bore doesnt really tell you much.. Thats just the make/model (no indication of which arsenal it came out of), and JS is the most common bore ever made in the GEW 98..

The best indicators of quality are going to be the arsenal/factory and the year of manufacture.. but unless when you pick up the rifle you find that it was made in late 1944 or early 1945 and has something funky going on with the action that makes you raise an eyebrow, I wouldnt be too worried around it..

The 8mm Mauser (JS) produces about 56K pressure (factory loads, CIP).. The35 Whelen produces about 62K.. tens of thousands of GEW98's (military, non magnum actions) have been converted to 300H&H.. 300H&H produces 62K pressure..

German made military mausers were pressure tested and proofed to 1000 atmospheres of pressure beyond their military/factory loads.. the 7mm and 8mm Mauser german factory military ammunition generated 57,600 PSI, which equates to 4050 atmospheres.. which means the minimum standard PSI for an action to leave the factory (CIP) was roughly 72,000... (a significant margin of error over what a max load 35 Whelen will produce).. and many german military made mausers subjected to extreme testing have survived pressure tests up to 100K CIP before coming apart..

First off, there are .323 „S“ Barrels on .318 non S-Barrel (you cant find much non S). The Proof test was maximum pressure plus 30% (now it 25%).

Some of the best Mauser actions came from Austria made by Steyr.

But often some Gunbutchers heated up the action, if the barrel didnt came of „easy“, so you cannot depend on the correct heat treatment done by the factory to the action. And sometimes they have sloppy chambers.

I would change to 9.3x62 instead of. .35W
 

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