Ammunition in Original Package or in an MTM box in Locked Case?

Discussion in 'Before & After the Hunt' started by AB2506, Feb 10, 2019.

  1. AB2506

    AB2506 AH Enthusiast

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    OK. Trip to RSA coming up in April.

    Common advice is to make sure your ammo, even handloads, are packed in original type packaging of the same caliber as the ammo. True or False?

    I did this last time, packed in my small Pelican (I recommend the Pelican as I was made to ship it separately home. A lighter made case might not have made it. The handle is nice also.), but the 300WSM Federal boxes I have are so bulky, I need no foam and they are actually quite a hard friction fit. The boxes also hate me. They don't want to open easily.

    I have MTM boxes coming out of the ying yang due to the going out of business sale at Wholesale Sports. If no issue, I would prefer the MTM box.

    I see that some use items other than original boxes in cases to travel.

    The following photo belongs to member "One Day....". Thank you.

    ammo.JPG
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 11, 2019

  2. Spooksar

    Spooksar AH Fanatic

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    I use the MTM 20 round boxes all the time, they are the “original” as I use hand loads. It’s usually a Airline thing and they just don’t want them loose.
     

  3. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN AH ENABLER SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR LIFETIME TITANIUM BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    IMG_1419_zpsbdee52e4.jpg

    The guts from TWO MTM cases. Appropriate to cartridge size.

    Cut with a Soldering Iron
    80 and 60 cartridges.
    300 Win Mag and .270 Win respectively.

    Handled Deluxe Rifle Ammo boxes by MTM Case-Gard? - 100 Plastic handled ammunition reloading boxes and cartridge cases


    A Pelican 1200 case.
    Water proof, lockable with my own locks.

    Pelican Products 1200 Case


    How I figured out the configuration.


    Ammunition Weights for Airline
    Pelican 1200 Empty -- 1210 Grams
    130 grain PSP Corelokt Box 20 --- 544 --- 3808 Grams
    Plastic Box for reloads --- 98 Grams
    Remington Cardboard and Plastic Holder --- 46 Grams
    20- 130grain psp Coreloks Bullets --- 496 Grams
    1 Cartridge --- 24.8 Grams

    7 Boxes fit in the Pelican --- Total 140 Rounds --- 5018Grams


    Over All Weight --- 5.02 KG


    Grains per Gram --- 15.4323584 Grams
    Increase for 180 Grains --- 55 Grams
    Grams per Cartridge ---3.563940039 Grams

    Cartridges 60 --- 213.8364023 --- 214Grams
    Ammunition Weight --- 80 180 Grain 60 130 Grain --- 4022 Grams
    KG 4.02

    Over All Weight --- 5232
    KG 5.23
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019

  4. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN AH ENABLER SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR LIFETIME TITANIUM BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    Jim, if you would like to borrow it, let me know.
     

  5. AB2506

    AB2506 AH Enthusiast

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    Thanks Brick. I'll keep you posted. Right now I am transitioning from 28 years with the City to my next career. To top it off, my left foot is in an air cast. (Long story). I need projects to keep me sane. Besides that is half the fun of preparing for a trip!

    I'm only taking 60 300WSM. I purchased a Pelican 1170 last time. A little less weight and bulk than the 1200. 60 rounds, in the factory Federal boxes effectively fills the space. However, the Federal boxes are inefficient space wise. I've already have several possibilites in mind.

    Like I said, fun! :)
     

  6. AB2506

    AB2506 AH Enthusiast

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    Here is my solution. Thanks to Brickburn for the inspiration! It will hold 80 300WSM cartridges, although I am only taking 60 for the 12 day hunt.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I would just like to point out why a person should choose a Pelican. I journeyed from Calgary to Amsterdam to Johannesburg to East London and back to Johannesburg with the Pelican in my checked luggage AS ALL THE MAJOR AIRLINES IN 2014 WANTED.

    However, in Johannesburg on the way back, when checking in the bags at the KLM/AirFrance Desk, I was told to remove the Pelican from the suitcase which was to be a checked bag. I had to check the Pelican as a separate bag. I wasn't charged for a third checked bag, but I had no confidence I would ever see the small Pelican again. However it made it back to Calgary. As you can see, there is virtually no marks on this case from travelling half way around the world. Would a MTM case have survived the journey? Not sure, but for me, the peace of mind the sturdy Pelican gave me was worth the extra cost and weight over the MTM. (Two small brass colored Master locks were used to secure the case from being opened.)

    YMMV.
     

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  7. Shootist43

    Shootist43 AH ENABLER GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    That works. I've used MTM boxes that were then put inside a "locked" plastic ammo can in my luggage. It has worked on two safaris to S.A.
     
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  8. WAB

    WAB AH Elite

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    Did you custom build the interior or is that an option with Pelican?
     

  9. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN AH ENABLER SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR LIFETIME TITANIUM BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    Custom made
     

  10. Bullthrower338

    Bullthrower338 AH ENABLER AH Legend

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    Awesome idea, stealing it! Lol
     

  11. AB2506

    AB2506 AH Enthusiast

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    Careful, Brickburn may have it patented!
     
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  12. One Day...

    One Day... GOLD SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    So... the first pic in the thread is mine.

    1) There might be a bit of confusion about MTM.
    Apparently many folks associate MTM with only the small boxes etc. MTM actually makes the orange box in the pic. It is called the MTM Survivor Dry Box, size large (https://www.amazon.com/MTM-Survivor...d=1550886338&sr=8-1&keywords=mtm+survivor+box). The MTM Survivor Dry Box is about the same as a Pelican, but it is 1 lb lighter (which counts a lot when you are limited to 11 lbs total) and a lot cheaper... Is it less tough than a Pelican? maybe, but it is apparently plenty tough enough for that use.

    2) Ammo organization
    To hold the ammo within the box, I use the typical plastic inserts that come with regular commercial ammo. In the pic posted by AB2506, the .340 Wby are held in Weatherby dividers, and the .470 NE are held in Hornady dividers. I cut the dividers (with a pair of snips and then finish the work on the belt sander) as needed in width and length to maximize the load. Last year (pic posted by AB2506), for a combo plains game & buff hunt, I had 58 rounds of .340 Wby and 34 rounds of .470, which weighed 10 lbs 15 oz including box and TSA lock, and complied with the 11 lbs limit.

    For this year, I take a .257 Wby and a .340 Wby (no buff on the menu). Playing with the Weatherby dividers cut to size (in length and width), I am able to put 122 rounds in the box, and it weighs, with TSA lock, 9 1/2 lbs:
    IMG_2550.jpg

    IMG_2547.jpg

    To answer specifically your question (and a few others) AB2506:
    • Ammo must be in original boxes OR in airline approved containers (i.e MTM Survivor as above, Pelican, etc.).
    • There is no requirement for the ammo packaging to identify the caliber. The requirement re. caliber is that you can only import in RSA ammo for the caliber of the rifle you import, and ammo head stamps must match the caliber(s) stamped on the barrel(s), hence the catch if you reload .416 Rem Mag using .375 H&H brass for example.
    • RSA limits the importation to 200 rounds per rifle/caliber.
    • South African Airline requires the ammo to be checked separately on domestic flights (hence the need for a MTM Survivor, Pelican, etc.).
    • The ammo box, including ammo and TSA lock cannot weigh more than 5 kg or 11 lbs.
    I hope this helps :)

    PS: looks like we came up with the same type of DIY solution BRICKBURN (y)
     

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    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 25, 2019

  13. AB2506

    AB2506 AH Enthusiast

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    FYI a Pelican 1150 is probably the smallest suitable size and the 1200 about the biggest without getting unwieldy. I saw a 1170 for the first time today. If it is tall enough, it maybe the best compromise.
     

  14. One Day...

    One Day... GOLD SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    The Pelican 1120 has a 3.3" internal height. It works with most standard length calibers, but it is too shallow for .375 H&H length cartridges.

    The Pelican 1150 has a 3.8" internal height. It works with .375 H&H length ammo, but it is too shallow for .470 NE.

    The Pelican 1170, with a 3.2" internal height, is actually shallower than the Pelican 1120 and will not work even for many of the "standard length" cartridges.

    After going through the same gyrations you are going through AB2506, I elected to use the MTM Survivor Dry Box (large) because it has a 4.4" internal height and takes even the .470 NE ammo, and it is only 15 oz, hence ~1/2 lb lighter than the Pelican 1150 (1.61 lbs empty), which is important when you have heavy ammo (e.g. .470 NE) because you max out the weight before you max out the volume.

    I stayed away from the Pelican 1200 for the same reason, because it is 2.65 lbs empty. With an 11 lbs limit, it is really an inconvenient when using heavy ammo...

    PS: the MTM Survivor (large) is not 1 lb lighter than the Pelican 1150 as I typed too fast in the previous post, but ~1/2 lb lighter...
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2019

  15. BRICKBURN

    BRICKBURN AH ENABLER SUPER MODERATOR CONTRIBUTOR LIFETIME TITANIUM BENEFACTOR AH Ambassador

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    He just improved and created a new model for sale at a later date.
     

  16. AB2506

    AB2506 AH Enthusiast

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    One Day, There is a MTM Ammocan that I actually purchased just before the Survival box came out. If one can be assured that the box rode the whole way in one's luggage, then there is no reason that either would not be adequate to travel with. What caused me to change to the Pelican 1150, was the fear of the "What if..?" What if it had to ship as checked luggage? Sturdy enough? Don't know. Feel lucky? Don't know. Want to chance it? NO. So I went with the Pelican 1150. As luck would have it, it did ride as checked luggage from Johannesburg to Amsterdam to Calgary.

    Would have the MTM Ammocan or Survivor made it? Don't know. They aren't as heavily made as the Pelican, and in the case of the Survivor, there is no handle. Having a handle, if the case is riding the baggage compartment as checked luggage, may cause the handlers to be a little gentler on it. The handle certainly gives them something to grab the case by.

    I believe in lighter being better in most gear, but I also believe in being prepared. The Pelican is me being better prepared for the worst scenario.
     

  17. AB2506

    AB2506 AH Enthusiast

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  18. One Day...

    One Day... GOLD SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    Great! Happy if this works for you :)

    Mine was checked separately by South African Airlines between Jo'burg and East London, and back, without apparent ill effect.

    Note that I was not arguing lighter being better, I was making the point that .470 NE does not fit vertically in the small Pelicans you suggest, hence they are useless to me, and that when using heavy ammo, every ounce counts as you max out on weight before you max out on volume.

    Enjoy your upcoming safari and your preparation for it; in the end, it is all that matters. I am a fervent believer that fine tuning to the umpteenth degree, and with the passion that it infers, one's prep is about the only way to make bearable the months long wait until the day... :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2019
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  19. AB2506

    AB2506 AH Enthusiast

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    One Day, thanks for all the info. You and Brickburn got me to this point.
     

  20. Spooksar

    Spooksar AH Fanatic

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    I agree about the heavy ammo problems, last year I took over a 404 Jeffery’s and a 470 NE, I use the 20 round MTM boxes inside a pelican case and 30 rounds each was near maximum weight without the case. I’ve never had ammo weighed , but Air Canada says weight of the ammo. So haven’t worried about the case weight
     

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