9.3x62mm vs. .375 H&H Mag

hawkeyesatx

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@hawkeyesatx
Mate 64,000 psi is getting right up there. 60 to 62,000 psi would be a lot safer.
I don't load the Whelen over 52,000 cup which translates to 62,000psi
Bob

@Bob Nelson 35Whelen

I hear ya there with the 62k psi!

I will look at QL data and 62k psi loads, and see how they come out.
It’d be interesting to say the least.


Hawk
 

BeeMaa

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If you are purely looking to load up the 9.3x62 to the original 375H&H ballistics, yes it is possible.

The real question is why? If you are already reloading, why not download the 375H&H to whatever recoil level is tolerable for you or whatever performance level (speed, energy or trajectory) you desire. There is no replacement for displacement, the 375 will always be the bigger of the two and give more flexibility throughout the range.

Same as why would you upload the 375H&H to achieve the performance of a 416? If you are looking for 416 performance, just start with a 416 and go from there. There is no free lunch. Benefits in one area means a compromise someplace else.
 

sgt_zim

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If you are purely looking to load up the 9.3x62 to the original 375H&H ballistics, yes it is possible.

The real question is why? If you are already reloading, why not download the 375H&H to whatever recoil level is tolerable for you or whatever performance level (speed, energy or trajectory) you desire. There is no replacement for displacement, the 375 will always be the bigger of the two and give more flexibility throughout the range.

Same as why would you upload the 375H&H to achieve the performance of a 416? If you are looking for 416 performance, just start with a 416 and go from there. There is no free lunch. Benefits in one area means a compromise someplace else.
Why not?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not pushing my own 9.3 very hard. Getting about 2350 with Oryx 285 gr and 2000MR. If I could get it to 2500 fps at the muzzle, that would increase energy at 100 yards by about 400 Joules. Not enough difference to make a difference, so not worth the extra cycles to try and get there, at least for my purposes. YMMV
 

BeeMaa

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Why not?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not pushing my own 9.3 very hard. Getting about 2350 with Oryx 285 gr and 2000MR. If I could get it to 2500 fps at the muzzle, that would increase energy at 100 yards by about 400 Joules. Not enough difference to make a difference, so not worth the extra cycles to try and get there, at least for my purposes. YMMV
To each his own, but when I'm looking to carry 10# of stuff...I don't start out with a 5# bag.
 

hawkeyesatx

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If you are purely looking to load up the 9.3x62 to the original 375H&H ballistics, yes it is possible.

The real question is why? If you are already reloading, why not download the 375H&H to whatever recoil level is tolerable for you or whatever performance level (speed, energy or trajectory) you desire. There is no replacement for displacement, the 375 will always be the bigger of the two and give more flexibility throughout the range.

Same as why would you upload the 375H&H to achieve the performance of a 416? If you are looking for 416 performance, just start with a 416 and go from there. There is no free lunch. Benefits in one area means a compromise someplace else.

Well…
I had a .375 H&H way back in the late 80’s. Unfortunately, I had to let it go when I got a divorce, to pay my lawyers retainer.
Unfortunately, I haven’t been lucky enough to afford another .375, but I have been able to get a 9.3x62.
I’m very much in the same boat that the German settlers were in, but can afford 9.3x62 rifle, and components now.
But, as being a prior .375 H&H owner, I see a lot of similarities between the 2 cartridges, and seeing promise in a stoutly loaded 9.3 compared to the old .375 H&H loads.

Hawk
 

sgt_zim

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Also, when your load is this accurate, why push it? This was my first 5 shot string, of a planned 5 strings. I packed everything up after the first 5 shots


1638233951433.png
 

BeeMaa

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sgt_zim

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= dead Buffalo. Well done sir.
Norma Oryx 285 is far and away the most accurate bullet I've shot out of my 9.3, Hornady 286 is 2nd most accurate. I have a couple boxes of SAF 286 gr waiting in the wings, haven't even worked up any loads for them yet
 

hawkeyesatx

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Also, when your load is this accurate, why push it? This was my first 5 shot string, of a planned 5 strings. I packed everything up after the first 5 shots


View attachment 439281

Holy Smokes!!

Now that’s outstanding accuracy.
The 9.3x62 lives up to its legend with how your rifle groups the 285 gr bullets.
Accuracy trumps velocity!


Hawk
 

Newby

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"Predicted" data ? Ahem.

"64000 PSI" ? another Ahem.

As has been said, equal bbl length, equal pressure, equal SD projectiles, and using the most suitable powder for each is the only valid ballistic comparison, and one which will show the 375 to be ballistically superior.

On game performance is another matter, and there are credible accounts from experienced people suggesting that, on similar animals at similar modest ranges, they could no see difference in effectiveness.

I've owned a couple or three 9.3s and the 286/2600 fps combos would have removed a good chunk of me head if used in any of them. I have also observed in written reports that, for whatever reason, the CZs seem to produce more speed than I have ever achieved with either 286s or NAB 250s in other brands.
 

John458Lott

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It's the 7mm STW all over again. No pressure signs amazing velocity for case size no pressure signs. Then they get pressure tested under lab conditions and they are all over 72k psi! Even worse for the 9.3 x 62 as load manual data is at very low pressure and we all know that our modern actions can take more. But really we dont have reliable pressure data. Just internet data!

Remember the claims of the 370 Sako or 9.3 x 66 Sako? H&H performance "nearly" and then a couple of years later published velocities were reduced by about 125fps!

They are both great calibres but why try to make the 9.3 a 375H&H? You negate any of the advantages which is 5 in the mag, reasonable recoil in a lighter weight rifle? If you want H&H performance get one!
 

Bob Nelson 35Whelen

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Tam Dl

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If I was arguing that the killing power of the 9.3 in modern loads was greater than the original loadings of the 375 H&H, I would look no further than modern bullets. Indeed that argument was available before modern bullets, at least according to Don Heath. I believe he had said the 9.3x62 was superior to the 375 H&H before the modern age because .375 bullets performed poorly. I believe he said they bent. I have to confess that I don't know where he said that but I am convinced that I read it somewhere, and in the history of firearms, such observations are commonplace. It could even come down to particular commercial loads, if they had a big bite of the local market he grew up in.

None the less, comparing modern bullets in 9.3, to traditional bullets in the .375 would probably give the 9.3 the win, even if there was no previous superiority in bullet design when the cartridges were fairly compared, side by side. And of course today, one can get great bullets in the .375s, so there is no cartridge superiority on that basis, and there are more choices for the .375. But on the simple question of whether the 9.3 of today is a better killer than the 375 H&H of legend, that is probably the case.
 

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Also, when your load is this accurate, why push it? This was my first 5 shot string, of a planned 5 strings. I packed everything up after the first 5 shots


View attachment 439281
Don't even need to chrony that one to know you've got your load!!!

I've also found the Oryx to be superbly accurate in my 9.3. Interestingly so are 286gr PMP Pro-Amms (locally made RSA brand) that are/were cheap as chips. Very similar shape to the Oryx, whether or not that plays a role in accuracy, I do not know.
 

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@WAB
What's next 500 then 577 followed by 600.
Dead is dead bit it depends on your fun level.
Bob

Totally agree Bob. I won’t go any bigger. All three perform well. I doubt that there is any practical difference between the 9.3 and .375 on buffalo. The Lott has a dramatically greater effect on them and allows shots you would not take with the others if your shooting is up to the mark.
 

sgt_zim

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