7mm 08 for Eland

Discussion in 'Firearms & Ammunition' started by MarkCZ, Mar 24, 2018.

  1. MarkCZ

    MarkCZ AH Veteran

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    As title suggests, thoughts and opinions please. I am taking 30-06 but my mate is taking 7mms 08.
    Markcz
     

  2. KMG Hunting Safaris

    KMG Hunting Safaris AH ENABLER SPONSOR Since 2013 AH Legend

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    Can it be done, absolutely. Is it ideal? No. Just dont ask too much from the cartrdige. Try and stay as broadside as possible, and slip it in just behind the shoulder for a double lung shot. Don't stop shooting.


    Good Luck.
     
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  3. CAustin

    CAustin AH ENABLER BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Ambassador

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    On the Eland perhaps your mate could use your rifle???? His can do the job but it is not ideal. Shot placement will be critical as you might imagine.
    People have taken eland using a 243 and great shot placement.
     
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  4. Divernhunter

    Divernhunter AH Elite

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    Not the best suited cartridge but if he must use it wait for an ideal shot.
     

  5. meigsbucks

    meigsbucks AH Enthusiast

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    I've been hunting with the 7mm/08 since its introduction. In fact I may have been one of the first people in Ohio to take an animal with this round. That being said, I think it definitely on the light side for eland. However, the 7mm/08 is almost the ballistic twin to the venerable 7x57, which has killed everything on the planet.
    I believe I once read that Craig Boddington's daughter took an eland and a bunch of other PG with a 7mm/08 using either a 140gr Nosler Partition or 150 Swift Scirocco bullets. Me, I'd load it with 160gr Swift A frames for everything.
    As KMG Safaris said: shoot it tight behind the shoulder.
    There used to be a company called A-Square that made semi custom big game rifles. An early brochure of theirs said: "Put a good bullet, in the right place, with the most power practical.". I've come up with my own version... Put a good bullet, in the right place, with a rifle and cartridge suitable for the game and conditions being hunted.
    I hope this helps.
     
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  6. Nosler guy

    Nosler guy AH Veteran

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    As someone mentioned, talk your buddy into using your '06 on the Eland. We (mostly my daughters) have used 7mm-08s since they came out, lots of experience, and I can assure you that 7mm-08 and Eland shouldn't even be considered. The truth of the matter is your '06 is a border line cartridge for Eland, best to use premium heavy for calibre bullets in it.
     
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  7. Shootist43

    Shootist43 AH ENABLER GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Perhaps your buddy should consider renting a suitable rifle from the outfitter or PH for the Eland. For smaller PG the 7/08 should be ok. Comparing the 308 to a 7 x 57 is not as straight up as you seemed to make it. The 7 x 57 was designed to use 170 Gr. bullets from the get go and has been taking African Game for over a century. Putting a comparable size bullet into a 7/08 plays to it's weaknesses, not it's strengths.
     
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  8. fourfive8

    fourfive8 AH Fanatic

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    Agree with above posts. Use a good, tough, premium bullet that is accurate in the rifle. Practice off the sticks. Hunt close. Shoot straight, shoot for the right place and keep shooting. You and your mate will probably be surprised at how big a mature eland bull is when you walk up to him!
     
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  9. jacques smith

    jacques smith AH Fanatic

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    100 grains in the right place is better than 1000 grains in the wrong place. Cheers
     

  10. Nyati

    Nyati AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    Two years ago, a friend of mine shot an Eland with a 25.06.

    That Eland tasted just great :D
     

  11. wesheltonj

    wesheltonj AH Elite

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    Not the most ideal round for Eland. That said Norma American PH is loaded with an Oryx 156G. Norma has some other rounds available but I don't believe that are available in the USA -- 140G Nosler Ballistic Tip & 160G Norma Tipstrike.

    From Norma Sweden:

    The 7mm-08 is nothing but the .308 Winchester necked down to 7 mm or .284”. This wildcat was adopted by Remington in 1980.

    The 7mm-08 is closely connected with metallic silhouette shooting. This sport has a Mexican origin and the trick is to knock down animal-shaped targets made of iron plate. The targets are placed from standing between 100 and up to 500 meters from the riflemen. The shooting is done off-hand. Accordingly the demands for a metallic silhouette cartridge were all met by developing the 7mm-08. It has a high precision potential, a flat trajectory, a light recoil and sufficient power to knock over the silhouette even when hit at the extreme range.

    The case capacity of the 7mm-08 is slightly smaller than in the 7x57, and accordingly the muzzle velocity of the heavier bullets will be 100-150 fps. less than in the Mauser design.

    For hunting purposes this cartridge is well-suited to medium game at long range and therefore also a popular choice for light-weight mountain rifles as it works well in short actions.

    From Norma USA - Oryx bullet:

    http://www.norma-usa.com/index.php/component/content/article/19-amph/126-7mm-08-oryx

    I would have a look at the energy loss.
     

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    Last edited: Mar 25, 2018

  12. IvW

    IvW AH Elite

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    If only all clients could shoot that well we would not need trackers or tracking dogs.

    Ethically we need to ensure that we use enough gun to ensure we kill the animals we pursue with the greatest chance of doing so effectively.

    For an experienced African hunter a 7mm firing a 170-175 gr premium grade bullet in the right place will get the job done.

    Is a 7mm-08 a good choice for a first time hunter to Africa to use on a trophy class eland bull? Personally I think not.

    Borrow your friends 30-06 with a heavy premium grade bullet and ensure a successful and frustration free eland hunt.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2018
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  13. BWH

    BWH AH ENABLER AH Legend

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    I used a 30-06. I took a beautiful Drakensberg Bull. Probably the only time/animal I wish I had more gun for.
     

  14. gatekeeper

    gatekeeper AH Member

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    The 7mm-08 will outperform a 7x57, every time. This is due to the 7mm-08 being a more modern cartridge, thus loaded to a higher average pressure then the 7x57. SAAMI calls for the 7mm-08@61,000PSI while the 7x57 is only at 51,000PSI. The 7mm-08 will be faster with all bullets, Hodgdon shows the 7mm-08 with 160s averaging about 2650fps from several suitable powders. The 7x57 is only at 2500 with a 160, and that's with only about 2 powders. Most were significantly less. In addition, the 7mm-08 has a much better reputation for accuracy, being used quite a bit in various disciplines. The 7x57 generally has a reputation for attaining satisfactory field accuracy at best. The 7mm-08 is a true short action cartridge at 2.80", where as the 7x57 is not a short at 3.071", but really isn't a long action round either. It is just long enough to not work well in most short actions, due to limiting COAL greatly or not fitting at all, but a long action is much more than is needed. Most cartridge discussions are based on subjective feeling, but to me, this is one of the objective ones with a clear winner. The 7mm-08 Rem.
     

  15. crs

    crs AH Enthusiast

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    "Two years ago, a friend of mine shot an Eland with a 25.06."
    On my first safari, in RSA, there were two PH that shot common rifles and rounds:
    1 - .308 on all plains game
    2 - 25-06 on all plains game

    They had done it all and knew their game.

    Not knowing better, I used my .338 Win Mag on all PG and loaned to my buddy for his eland - no bang flop, just bang and settling into the grass dead. A 225 grain Black Talon bullet from a .338 does that to a lot of critters.
     

  16. ChrisG

    ChrisG BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    The only thing I will point out, though you are right about the SAAMI specs, is that in any rifle made after 1935, the 7x57 can be boosted up to modern pressures easily and easily out-performs the short 7mm-08. I have had this discussion with people regarding the 6.5x55 vs 260. Loaded to modern specs, the old rounds beat the short rounds hands down due to their larger case capacity. Plus if you load it to equal the modern round, you will have a lower pressure load and that is more important I think. SAAMI really isn't the authority on 7x57 anyway. CIP is. Norma is showing a load in the 7x57 using Norma URP powder that will push a 170 grain bullet to 2,650fps. Plus... if it suits your fancy, you can tell people you have a .275 Rigby...;). Plus the 7mm-08 has zero romance. It's a tool. The 7x57 has it in droves. One is a set of socket wrenches, the other is a Lie-Nielson Jack Plane. There, that was my defense of the 7mm Mauser... And I don't even OWN one!o_O

    Just my observations on the cartridge, not it's suitability for Eland. I am sure it will kill one with the right bullet. A 175 grain 0.284" bullet has a sectional density that is marginally higher than a .375 H&H shooting 300 grain bullets. It just makes a smaller hole.
     

  17. Nosler guy

    Nosler guy AH Veteran

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    As already stated in another post - most loading data for the 7X57 is very conservative, simply because there were and are many rifles in that calibre that were based on not particularly strong actions. Hardly fair to compare the two calibres by numbers pulled off of paper.

    We had modern rifles in both 7mm-08 and 7X57 in the same model and action. We were able to comfortably load the 7X57 way above any max loading data, and the chronographed results had the 7X57 outperforming the 7-08 with every bullet we tried. The most notable differences were with the heavier bullets.

    That being said - in my opinion, neither one is a suitable calibre for Eland
     
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  18. gatekeeper

    gatekeeper AH Member

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    I suppose that is true, but I would argue that SAAMI is, in fact, an authority in the industry. Even if a 7x57 is built in a modern rifle that can handle high pressures, do you know if the brass itself is constructed heavy enough for the added pressure? That would be a concern of mine, particularly in the web area. I get the whole romance thing, sure. The British were 'romantic' in their approach to battle, wearing red coats and marching in the wide open. We romanced them alright, and they lost. LOL Just kidding, to each his own. Really, for me, the 7x57 is a German design, I'm a US Marine ( we won that one too TWICE)...I'll take my American 7mm-08. At the end of the day, we all know it's the skill of the rifleman that matters the most.
     
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  19. Dr Ray

    Dr Ray AH Elite

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    Why use such a relatively marginal cartridge (unless you can get very close)?
    Eland is a big tough animal!
     
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  20. stug

    stug AH Fanatic

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    I got my 7x57 with 162gr projectiles shooting at 2700 fps with no problems. No pressure signs or problems. Probably could have pushed it harder if I had wanted as well.
     

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