460 Weatherby Magnum For Sale Price Reduced

Mark Curry

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FOR SALE 460 Weatherby Magnum in excellent condition $2100.00
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Bill K

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Hi Mark, Nice gun. Can you tell me where the gun was manufactured (Barrel stamp?) Can you post a picture of the stamp and serial number? I may be interested. thanks
Bill
 

Bill K

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Beautiful gun, but unfortunately I'm collecting Mark V's that were made in Germany in the 60's & 70's. The 460 is one of the few I don't have yet. So sorry, I would have gobbled it up! Thanks for your quick response and good luck. If I move over to American models, I'll give you a shout!
-bill
 

Mark Curry

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Beautiful gun, but unfortunately I'm collecting Mark V's that were made in Germany in the 60's & 70's. The 460 is one of the few I don't have yet. So sorry, I would have gobbled it up! Thanks for your quick response and good luck. If I move over to American models, I'll give you a shout!
-bill

Thanks for looking, good luck with your search, if I happen to run across one I will send you the info.

Mark
 

Major Khan

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which dream?
Oh , my friend has always dreamt of shooting a .460 Weatherby magnum calibre rifle for the last 50 years . Unfortunately , he never got the chance . He is a retired professional hunter , just like myself. He always hoped that he would have a client bring 1 . Unfortunately , that never happened.
 

Hank2211

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Dream? I have so many more interesting ways of punishing myself. Don't need to add firing a .460 Weatherby to the list!
 

Major Khan

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Dream? I have so many more interesting ways of punishing myself. Don't need to add firing a .460 Weatherby to the list!
Relax ! He just wants to try it out ONCE , since he never saw a client bring 1 to India for shikar ( it used to be be largest commercially available rifle calibre available , during our time .)
He is a practical fellow who has written numerous articles for African Hunting Forums. He merely wishes to try it out .

I personally HAVE had clients bring .460 Weatherby magnum calibre rifles to India for shikar and I do not like the cartridge 1 bit ! Those excessively high velocities are counterproductive ....to put it lightly . A good dangerous game calibre should not have a velocity much higher than 2350 feet per second .
 

Bill K

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I've been using a .375 H&H and .416 rigby for the big stuff and 240/270 for the plains game. I haven't had a problem with those choices, but I'm collecting German made Weatherbys for the gun cabinet. The .460 is currently missing from the collection. I even have a 22-250 and 30-06 (9 lug). The hunt continues. PS - Roy would disagree with velocity being counterproductive... speed kills. :)
 

kurpfalzjäger

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Don't be so negative about the cartridge 460 Weatherby Magnum !:)

It is a very good cartridge that can be reloaded according to the need and then gives what it promises. One cannot say that of all cartridges caliber 45.

The factory ammunition made its bad name at the beginning , and the cartridges are still loaded far above what one need. That only makes sense if you want to hunt DG at greater distances , but that doesn't happen. In addition , it was not uncommon with the first cartridges to have overpressure problems in the heat of Africa which is also not ideal by hunting DG if you cannot open your bolt action quickly.

In summary , those who want to hunt in Africa with the cartridge 460 Weatherby Magnum , and not only show off with it on the shooting range , should reload it in all cases. A 500gr bullet with a muzzle velocity at 2400 fts to 2500 fts is enough for our purposes.
 

Von S.

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I personally HAVE had clients bring .460 Weatherby magnum calibre rifles to India for shikar and I do not like the cartridge 1 bit ! Those excessively high velocities are counterproductive ....to put it lightly . A good dangerous game calibre should not have a velocity much higher than 2350 feet per second .

Oh yeah? How about an explanation grounded in not only personal experience, but also scientific reasoning and proof .
 

Major Khan

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Oh yeah? How about an explanation grounded in not only personal experience, but also scientific reasoning and proof .
It will be my privilege , sir .
During the time of my career ( 1961 to 1970 ) , l observed that the factory loaded ammunition for the .460 Weatherby magnum calibre was loaded to excessively high velocities which caused the following problem :
With a traditional solid metal covered bullet ( which you American gentlemen refer to , as " full metal jacket " ) , the excessively high velocities of the .460 Weatherby magnum calibre factory loaded ammunition would often cause the bullet to distort when being used on heavy , thick skinned game , such as frontal heart shots or shoulder shots on 2000 pound gaur bison . I have witnessed this happen 4 times in the field.
There is a way to circumvent this problem , however. If you hand load your own ammunition and slightly reduce the powder charge to achieve a little less velocity , then the 500 grain " full metal jacket " bullet will not distort.
Alternatively , you could use a modern brass " monolithic solid " bullet which is less likely to distort than a traditional solid metal covered bullet ( on account of it's 1 piece construction) . However , I have no 1st hand experience with monolithic solid bullets , as the 1st monolithic solid bullets were introduced roughly 17 years after I had already retired from guiding foreign clients .
 

Von S.

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So your " complaint" is not the rounds made 50 to 60 years ago but the bullets used could not take the speed of the 460.

Hummmmm~ so in other words......you are posting a complaint that died long before many members here were born.

As far as bullets bending many years ago..... the same bullets loaded into the 458 wm would bend as well, though people claimed that it moved too slow.
 

kurpfalzjäger

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I cannot understand this story about unsuitable bullets for the cartridge 460 Weatherby Magnum.

I fired old Weatherby ammunition at the beginning and can say that the bullet was the 500 gr interbond from Hornady , a bullet which until recently was still offered by Hornady and with which I shot several buffalos. Sure , the matter of the bullet in the body of the buffalo is certainly very different from bullet to bullet. You only have a exit at times and the mushrooming is also not constant , but the bullet still makes deep , large and deadly wounds. I also shot an elephant with the classic FMJ bullet from Hornady. Some of the bullets looked like beans , but the elephant was dead.

All of the bullets used by Weatherby for the old ammunition were in all cases in the sixties of better quality than what was used in the previous decades. No bullet reached the specified muzzle velocity of 2700 fts , that was just marketing. That's why i don't think that only a few 100 fts more led to the explosion of the bullets with the cartridge 460WM , but not with the cartridge 458 Win Mag from the same time. By the way , high quality bullets from Woodleigh have also broken. This can happen with all bullets and is due to the alloy.

I therefore believe that the story of the systematic bursting of the bullets with the cartridge 460WM is more of a myth , like so many that have been written about this cartridge for almost 60 years now. The cartridge has surprised many with its recoil , few have mastered it and the legend was born.
 

Major Khan

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So your " complaint" is not the rounds made 50 to 60 years ago but the bullets used could not take the speed of the 460.

Hummmmm~ so in other words......you are posting a complaint that died long before many members here were born.

As far as bullets bending many years ago..... the same bullets loaded into the 458 wm would bend as well, though people claimed that it moved too slow.
1stly , let's get something very clear . If I have a " complaint " with the bullets , then I will say so myself. I do not like the .460 Weatherby magnum calibre ( in it's factory loaded form ) for various reasons , as listed below :
> The recoil is ungodly . In my 10 year career as a professional hunter , I do not recall having even 1 client who could shoot accurately / handle the recoil of a .460 Weatherby magnum calibre rifle with factory loaded ammunition. I have fired a .460 Weatherby magnum calibre rifle 7 times in my life and I struggled with it as well. Perhaps , I am physically weak , but I weigh 186 pounds and have a height of 6 feet 2 inches . I have also served in the military and seen combat .
> The only way the average man can take the recoil of a .460 Weatherby magnum calibre rifle is by using a muzzle brake . God help your ears and the ears of your professional hunter if you happen to be firing 1 with him near you ( which invariably happens a great deal , especially in dangerous game hunts . )
> At normal ranges where dangerous game is shot ... the .460 Weatherby magnum in it's factory loaded format delivers excessively high velocities which is counter productive . Unless you plan to shoot an elephant or gaur bison or cape buffalo at distances exceeding 200 yards , you do not want such a high velocity .
A lowered velocity produces less erratic results on bullet integrity .

If you lower the powder charge of the .460 Weatherby magnum and bring the velocity down to 2350 feet per second or thereabouts , then you have good performance.
If high velocity is your fancy , then you use a monolithic solid bullet of 500 grain weight, with a flat point ( as opposed to a round point ) . That will not deform .
The South African company , Rhino will turn out such bullets for the .460 Weatherby magnum calibre . Barnes used to do it as well , but ceased manufacturing them after BATF ( Bureau of Alcohol , Tobacco , Fire Arms & Explosives ) declared them to be armour piercing .

Issues that occurred 50-60 years ... Hmnnn , let's see. So , in 1990 a professional South African elephant culler by the name of Mike LaGrange published a book named " Ballistics ln Perspective " ( a book which I highly recommend to anyone who plans to hunt dangerous game someday ) . This gentleman shot more that 6000 African elephants between 1980 and 1990 , when he was in charge of the culling team at Nyamanetchi . In his book , he documents the dismal failures of factory loaded .460 Weatherby magnum ammunition when used on big bull elephants for brain brain shots , or cape buffalo with frontal heart shots and shoulder shots .
In 2011 , a professional hunter named Pierre Van Der Walt wrote a book called " African Dangerous Game Cartridges " where where he speaks of the dismal failures of .460 Weatherby magnum calibre factory loaded ammunition on African elephants and hippopotamuses .
Sure .. I am no spring chicken ( I turn 80 this year ) , but 2011 seems fairly recent to me .

Regarding the .458 Winchester magnum ... It is not a cartridge which I have much love for , either . A .375 Holland & Holland magnum cartridge case is 3 inches long and propels a 300 grain bullet with marvellous results . By contrast , a .458 Winchester magnum cartridge case is 2.5 inches long ( 0.5 inches shorter ) and yet it employs a 500 grain bullet ( which weighs 200 grains more than the aforementioned .375 Holland & Holland magnum ) . In my eyes , this is conceptually wrong .
When Winchester launched the .458 Winchester magnum calibre in 1956 , their factory manufactured ammunition was loaded to achieve a velocity of 2150 feet per second. Unfortunately , they realized that shelf life with such a powder charge was very definite . Ammunition stored for a few years tended to develop erratic velocities , often delivering velocities at least 100 feet per second less than what was advertised . In 1960 , Winchester began to manufacture their factory loaded ammunition to achieve a slightly lower velocity of 2130 feet per second . Unfortunately , shelf life was still a problem ( especially compared to other calibres ) . In 1973 , Winchester began to load their factory manufactured ammunition to achieve a slightly lowered velocity of 2120 feet per second , in yet another attempt to improve shelf life . Unfortunately , the desired result ( a longer shelf life for .458 Winchester magnum calibre ammunition ) was still not achieved . In 1978 , Winchester finally decided to do something drastic . They lowered the powder charge of the .458 Winchester magnum calibre factory loaded ammunition to achieve a velocity of 2040 feet per second. This move DID improve the shelf life considerably . Unfortunately , it also made the .458 Winchester magnum calibre an unreliable performer for frontal brain shots on big bull elephants , and this phenomenon was recorded widely by the Zimbabwe Department of National Parks and Wild Life Management, whose culling teams experienced numerous penetration problems on big bull elephants , using the factory loaded ammunition produced by Winchester and Remington for the .458 Winchester magnum at that time ( 1980 to 1984 )
Remington also followed the same route as Winchester . When Remington 1st began to manufacture .458 Winchester magnum calibre factory loaded ammunition in 1961 , the advertised velocity was already 2130 feet per second ( because they had already learnt from Winchester that a velocity of 2150 feet per second was causing problems with shelf life ) . They experienced shelf life problems and thus , by 1973 the powder charge was lowered to achieve a velocity of 2120 feet per second. They still experienced shelf life problems , and thus in 1978 they ( like Winchester ) also lowered their powder charge to achieve a velocity of 2040 feet per second . The effect ( or lack thereof ) that this lowered velocity had on thick skinned dangerous game ( especially frontal brain shots on big bull elephants or frontal heart shots or shoulder shots on cape buffaloes ) was widely recommended by the African game departments of the 1980s ( as I have elaborated on , in the above paragraph ).

If you wished to get desirable results on thick skinned dangerous game , with the .458 Winchester magnum , then the trick was to do 2 things :
> use ammunition loaded to the original advertised 2130 to 2150 feet per second.
> Use VERY FRESH ammunition , taking the short shelf life in to the equation .
The early patterns of Winchester and Remington factory loaded ammunition ( which was loaded to accomplish a velocity of 2150 feet per second and 2130 feet per second , respectively ) were marvellous performers if the operator was using freshly loaded / factory ammunition . I have personally seen what freshly loaded .458 Winchester magnum ammunition ( loaded to velocities of 2130 to 2150 feet per second ) can accomplish . They are good performers.

Today , most modern hunters who use achieve good results with the .458 Winchester magnum AND get a good shelf life , use bullets weighing no more than 480 grains . This increases powder space and shelf life. Those who use monolithic bullets typically use 450 to 465 grain bullets . Of course , sectional density is compromised . However , they do the work properly.

Your statement that bullets were also bending in the .458 Winchester magnum calibre is also too generalized . There were , indeed a few batches of Winchester " Full Metal Jacket " factory loaded ammunition produced in the late 1960s ( I 1st became aware of the issue in 1967 ) , where the " jackets " of the " full metal jacket " 500 grain bullets were poorly constructed and upon being fired at thick skinned dangerous game , these bullets often had a tendency to have their " jackets" rupture .
However , Hornady 500 grain " full metal jacket" bullets were also available during our time , as a hand loading component . These bullets had extremely thick and sturdily constructed " jackets " . When used in the .458 Winchester magnum , I had never seen a Hornady 500 grain " full metal jacket " bullet distort ( even if the ammunition was loaded to a velocity of 2150 feet per second ) .

The same Hornady 500 grain " full metal jacket " .458 calibre bullets , when used in the .460 Weatherby magnum ( loaded to factory velocities of 2600 feet per second ) were prone to distorting . If you lowered the velocity of the .460 Weatherby magnum calibre ammunition to achieve 2350 feet per second ( which is ample for anything which walks God's Green Earth ) , then these Hornady 500 grain " full metal jacket " bullets were sweet performers .

At the end of the day , however... If I was guiding clients again and a gentleman showed up at my outfitters with a .460 Weatherby magnum calibre rifle or a .458 Winchester magnum calibre rifle , then I would still be more than happy to guide them ( provided that they can shoot straight with them , of course ) .
 

Major Khan

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I cannot understand this story about unsuitable bullets for the cartridge 460 Weatherby Magnum.

I fired old Weatherby ammunition at the beginning and can say that the bullet was the 500 gr interbond from Hornady , a bullet which until recently was still offered by Hornady and with which I shot several buffalos. Sure , the matter of the bullet in the body of the buffalo is certainly very different from bullet to bullet. You only have a exit at times and the mushrooming is also not constant , but the bullet still makes deep , large and deadly wounds. I also shot an elephant with the classic FMJ bullet from Hornady. Some of the bullets looked like beans , but the elephant was dead.

All of the bullets used by Weatherby for the old ammunition were in all cases in the sixties of better quality than what was used in the previous decades. No bullet reached the specified muzzle velocity of 2700 fts , that was just marketing. That's why i don't think that only a few 100 fts more led to the explosion of the bullets with the cartridge 460WM , but not with the cartridge 458 Win Mag from the same time. By the way , high quality bullets from Woodleigh have also broken. This can happen with all bullets and is due to the alloy.

I therefore believe that the story of the systematic bursting of the bullets with the cartridge 460WM is more of a myth , like so many that have been written about this cartridge for almost 60 years now. The cartridge has surprised many with its recoil , few have mastered it and the legend was born.
Your logic is extremely sound ( as always ) , Kurpfalzjager . Allow me to add a few points from my own personal experience as well .
1stly , you are spot on about the 500 grain Hornady " Full Metal Jacket " bullet being of extremely good quality in the 1960s . Hornady bullets were premium grade loading components back in those days and my American clients , in particular , always sung praises about Hornady bullets for hand loading . I was extremely impressed with their performance as well . Those steel jackets were impressively thick and very sturdily constructed !
2ndly , yes l do believe that the stories of factory loaded .460 Weatherby magnum calibre " Full Metal Jacket " ammunition distorting so frequently are highly exaggerated . Out of the 18 or so clients who used to came to India , armed with .460 Weatherby magnum calibre rifles , I have only seen 4 cases of bullet distortion with factory loaded ammunition 1st hand ( although , I have heard of a few other instances from my colleagues ) .
My verdict is that it CAN happen and HAS happened . However , it does not happen as frequently as the myths suggest. Nevertheless , 4 times is enough to warrant my concern .
I have full confidence that your Hornady 500 grain " Full Metal Jacket " bullet fired from the .460 Weatherby magnum calibre Brevex magnum Mauser action bolt rifle laid low the elephant which you shot .
Out of genuine curiosity ( as well as improving my own knowledge ) , I have 2 small questions :
> Were you using factory loaded ammunition or hand loaded ammunition ?
> Did you use a side brain shot , or a double lung shot or a frontal brain shot or a shoulder heart shot ?
 
 

 

 

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