.458 Winchester Magnum too much gun?

Discussion in '.375 & Up' started by Quaticman, Nov 25, 2019.

  1. Quaticman

    Quaticman AH Member

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    Craig Boddington in his recently released book entitled Buffalo II stated that the .45 caliber big bore rifles are not required for hunting buffalo.
    In his opinion, the .375 H & H Magnum is a more suitable choice while the .416's (Remington, Ruger, Rigby) are even better yet. Would you hunt a cape buffalo with a .458 Winchester Magnum bolt action rifle or is it really too much gun for the task?
     

  2. crs

    crs AH Fanatic

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    More Boddington BS.
    Of course a .458 Win Mag is not required. Some folks use handguns and others use bow and arrow. Some use 500NE or 600 NE.
    Man is not even required to hunt buffalo.
    But if we do it, we have our say on the tools we use Except in some backward countries that are behind the times on modern firearm and ammunition.

    Rant over.
     
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  3. PHOENIX PHIL

    PHOENIX PHIL AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    Too much gun for the task? I think not, more like too much gun for the hunter. I'm guessing CB was writing from the perspective of he'd rather see someone shoot a buff with the less hard kicking .375 and place the bullet accurately, than a poorly placed .458.
     
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  4. Kawshik Rahman

    Kawshik Rahman AH Elite

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    Absolutely not . While a .375 Holland and Holland magnum calibre rifle loaded with modern soft nose bullets with a controlled rate of expansion , is perfectly adequate for the task , there is nothing wrong with using a .458 Winchester magnum calibre rifle to shoot them either . Many of my clients successfully took Gaur ( Indian Bison ) with .458 Winchester magnum calibre rifles .
    Screenshot_20191013-052701_01.png
    This Indian water buffalo was shot by a client using a .458 Winchester magnum calibre bolt operation rifle made by Birmingham Small Arms.
    Screenshot_20191006-203431_01_01.png
    This Gaur was shot by my client using a double barrel .458 Winchester magnum calibre rifle built by the firm , Holland and Holland.

    He would go on to secure a Royal Bengal tiger with the same rifle , the following night .
    While l personally favor the .375 Holland and Holland magnum cartridge myself over the .458 Winchester magnum cartridge , l see no problem with a Shikari using the latter calibre to hunt a buffalo , provided of course that you can shoot properly with it.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 26, 2019

  5. WAB

    WAB AH Elite

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    I have a .375 H&H and .458 Lott. I have killed buffalo with both, but IMO, the Lott is far superior on buffalo, assuming you put the bullet where it needs to go.
     

  6. crs

    crs AH Fanatic

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    "assuming you put the bullet where it needs to go."

    Always best - shot placement rules!

    And badly placed shots can and have led to less than desired performance.
     

  7. BnC 04

    BnC 04 GOLD SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    No such thing as "too much" when talking buffalo. There is however too much rifle for any given individual. Know your limit and put that first one where it counts.
     

  8. meigsbucks

    meigsbucks AH Fanatic

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    Put a good bullet in the right place is the most important thing. IMO, when it comes to dangerous game, do it with the most power with which you can accomplish the most important thing,
     
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  9. johnnyblues

    johnnyblues AH ENABLER AH Ambassador

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    Agree will everything said above. The golden rule is and has always been the right bullet and shot placement. I don’t have to tell anyone here you could be using a 460 Weatherby and place it poorly with disastrous results.
     
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  10. BeeMaa

    BeeMaa AH Elite

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    My Grandfather would say of shooting at game...
    "Shoot as if it is your only shot, because it could be"

    Granted he grew up in the Depression so ammo was scarce and he also hunted to put food on the table.
    Still good words to think of when I look through a scope.
     

  11. Newboomer

    Newboomer GOLD SUPPORTER AH Fanatic

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    Shoot what you can handle accuracy and recoil wise. Caliber really isn't that critical.
     
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  12. TOBY458

    TOBY458 AH Elite

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    I doubt you will "overly impress" a buffalo with a 458 Win Mag or Lott, but with my limited experience with buffalo (4 Water Buffalo and 2 Cape Buffalo), I would say that anything above a 416 isn't necessary. And a 375 has left me with little to be desired.
     
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  13. WAB

    WAB AH Elite

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    With similar bullet placement the impact of a Lott on buffalo is significantly greater than that of a .375. The Lott also opens up shots that would not be well advised with a .375. This is all based on the assumption that you can put the bullet where it needs to go.
     

  14. kurpfalzjäger

    kurpfalzjäger AH Veteran

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    Not necessary , but not absurd. Who controls big bore rifles well should use them. The bigger the wound channel , the better the effect.
     

  15. BenKK

    BenKK AH Elite

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    Gosh, the rodeos I’ve had with .500J and .500NE when I botched the first shot! And the biggest bulls sink in seconds shot by .275 Rigby or .30-30 or .300H&H or even .22-250 if I make it good and true the first time!

    .375H&H is about perfect especially when scoped. But a nice, close shot with fine open sights is a wonder, too, with the bigger cartridges.
     

  16. PeteG

    PeteG AH Elite

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    Which caliber is best suited will be discussion that will never end.

    The question is "Would you hunt a cape buffalo with a .458 Winchester Magnum bolt action rifle or is it really too much gun for the task?"
    Yes i would and no it is not too much gun for the task.
     

  17. Forrest Halley

    Forrest Halley AH Veteran

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    I would not. I'd much prefer the .375(Have) or the .450 3¼(Desire) in a Ruger No 1 and I'm going to keep shooting until I am good and certain he no longer has flame on the boiler.
     
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  18. Red Leg

    Red Leg AH ENABLER LIFETIME BRONZE BENEFACTOR AH Legend

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    I’ll respectfully disagree. I choose to use a .375 and leave the heavier calibers at home. And I shoot them all extremely well thank you very much. The .375 is so versatile, so transportable, and so accurate I honestly feel like I am handicapping myself with my .404 or 500-416. And a 300 gr A Frame, TSX, or Hydro will make any shot on a buffalo anyone should be taking with a Lott.

    And no, a .458 is not too large for buffalo. It has been and would be decisive - just wouldn’t be my choice.
     

  19. Frederik

    Frederik AH Enthusiast

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    Having different calibres to use just adds to the fun.
    Do the first buffalo with a scoped 375 H&H enjoy and have fun go back do it again with a 458 open sights or red dot like trijicon RMR, SRO, Deltapoint or what ever works for you and make it a challenge to get 50 meters or closer.

    I'm awaiting my license/permit for my 458 lott and on its menu is a waterbuck bull as my first targte and then hopefully a buffalo again hunting animals with big bores is fun and challenging at the same time.

    So to get back to the post use a 375 H&H on your first buff hunt you are not limited when scoped to use it past 150 yards for proper shot placemeent making and giving you a good chance to go home with a buff. Recoil is very manageablee and 300gr with a proper bullet 2500fps does hurt a buff. You will probarbly have back up is the popo hits the fan with a bigger calibre anyway.

    Bigger calibres are an adjusment to shoot especially if you dont shoot them often they limit you on range and on the gals that can be used with beter eye relief and they do push back far more than a 375 but having a bigger gun is fun and make it a challenge on a buff hunt to get closely acquainted.
     
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  20. WAB

    WAB AH Elite

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    I’m not saying the .375 won’t get the job done, it will and I’ve done it. However, with the same bullet construction and point of impact, its hard to argue that a 500 gr bullet at 2300 fps will not have more immediate effect on a buffalo than a 300 gr bullet at 2550 fps.

    Like you, I have both calibers in the safe, I choose to go with the Lott. However, I’d be perfectly happy to hunt with you while you’re using your .375! I’m sure we’d have a blast. I’ll also bet you can get three shots off with that blaser in the time I can get two off with my M-70!
     

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