458 socom for charging cats?

crs

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Redleg,
The factory .458 Socom ammo my son uses runs over 2000 fps for 300 grain bullets and respectable velocities for the heavier bullets. As you know, there is ammo and then there is other ammo. Though he does hand load some calibers, he has used only factory ammo in the .458 Socom.
Additionally, there is a lot of factory .45-70 ammo faster than the old original stuff. In my 1886, the Hornady 325 grain stuff clocked in above 2000 fps. I guess when dealing with cartridges like the .45-70, I should be more specific, such as the 2000+ fps 400 grain Punch and North Fork stuff our 1886 .45-70 shot through ele heads and the daylight holes in the 5/8 inch steel plate made by the .45-70 Punch bullets at a range of 50 yards.
I will try to be more specific in the future.

PS I still prefer traditional rifle designs to carry in the field. 2019 Pronghorn in Texas Panhandle with m70.
 

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Red Leg

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Redleg,
The factory .458 Socom ammo my son uses runs over 2000 fps for 300 grain bullets and respectable velocities for the heavier bullets. As you know, there is ammo and then there is other ammo. Though he does hand load some calibers, he has used only factory ammo in the .458 Socom.
Additionally, there is a lot of factory .45-70 ammo faster than the old original stuff. In my 1886, the Hornady 325 grain stuff clocked in above 2000 fps. I guess when dealing with cartridges like the .45-70, I should be more specific, such as the 2000+ fps 400 grain Punch and North Fork stuff our 1886 .45-70 shot through ele heads and the daylight holes in the 5/8 inch steel plate made by the .45-70 Punch bullets at a range of 50 yards.
I will try to be more specific in the future.

PS I still prefer traditional rifle designs to carry in the field. 2019 Pronghorn in Texas Panhandle with m70.
I was quoting "factory" ballistics - to the extent they exist for this round.

But, let's say he gets 2050 from a 300 gr .45 cal bullet - I would not recommend anything with that SD and that velocity for use on much of anything than for what it was conceived.
 

Forrest Halley

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A 100 year old BAR in 30-06 would probably be more effective.
How about an HCAR or BAR that's been modernized and has a 30 round magazine and a compensator? I'm thinking that it would be cheap to feed and it would make all the little fifes in the fifedom worried.
 

rnovi

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Now that‘s a pig gun for sure!
 

mdwest

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All of that said.. I own a .458 SOCOM AR (among several others).. for hunting purposes, I think it is very linear.. but.. it does fill one particular role quite well (IMO)..

For hog hunting at ranges of 150 yards or less.. its an absolute hammer.. not only on big boars.. but on sounders...

FWIW, pic of aforementioned Bacon Buster below...

SOLGW lower ($39)
Mil-spec lower parts kit ($39)
Rise Armament drop in single stage 3.5lb trigger ($99)
Magpul stock ($49)
Magpul pistol grip ($19)
Bear Creek Arsenal complete 458 SOCOM upper ($325)
Sightmark Wraith Day/Night Vision ($400 - got a great deal at DSC last year!)
Sniperhog 38LRX IR illuminator ($100)
Backup battery pack ($29)

All in - $1099 including the night vision optic...

For a rifle that will lay down some serious scunion on an entire sounder of hogs.. out to about 150 yards (I can easily see them out to about 250-300 yards with the Sniperhog / Wraith combo.. but the 458 SOCOM starts dropping like a rock after about 150)..

For cat stopping... definitely not my first choice... Deer hunting.. not even close to my first choice.. pretty much hunting anything other than hogs.. not my first choice..

Although I do know a couple of guys stationed at Ft. Richardson in AK that have them and like them for camp guns when they are tooling around in bear country..



IMG_6594.jpg
 

mdwest

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I toyed with the idea of 458SOCOM for a subsonic bolt action for use in pest animal control (non-dangerous game). While the design concept was sound, the cartridge developers made a huge error in not going down the SAAMI acceptance path until it was too late. As a consequence there is no universal specification for brass, chamber nor lab tested load data. Most of the chamber reamers, barrels and brass that are available don't match the original design spec. By the time the developers tried to pursue SAAMI accreditation, there were too many variations in circulation and the whole thing failed to progress. In a bolt action you could treat it as a one-off wildcat with a degree of success, in an auto there's too much to go wrong.

Thats curious..

Sounds like a problem possibly limited to Oz?

The 458 SOCOM is fairly prolific here.. there are thousands of them out there, the overwhelming majority of which are in semi-auto AR15 form... people are shooting them daily in the US.. and no one is reporting any issues with chambers/barrels/brass to my knowledge..

In fact, while ammunition manufacturers are very limited here.. there are a couple of companies producing exceptional factory ammo in 458 SOCOM.. and while you arent going to find 458 SOCOM ammo on the shelves at your local Wal-mart here.. the big online retailers here keep it in healthy stock.. picking up one of several different options from midwayusa, brownells, LAX Ammo, etc.. is an easy (albeit expensive) affair..

All of the major reloading equipment manufacturers like Lee, RCBS, Hornady produce dies for it.. and most of the current edition reloading manuals provide a significant amount of data for it...

the too many things to go wrong scenario you paint.. just doesnt appear to be an issue on this side of the pond at all..
 

crs

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"the too many things to go wrong scenario you paint.. just doesn't appear to be an issue on this side of the pond at all.."

+1
 

rnovi

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the funny thing to me is that when push came to shove and I decided on a big bore AR15, I went .450 Bushmaster.

It's hard to think of the .450 Bushie as underpowered as it basically duplicates original 45-70 loads. My current 300gr. handloads drop 3 into an inch (seriously) at 100 yards...with factory Hornady 250's equally accurate.

450, 458, 50 Beo, all thumpers of the first class order.
 

mdwest

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My understanding is the 450 bushmaster actually has a slight ballistic edge on the 458 SOCOM.. and you also have the advantage of more commercial load options and cheaper ammo...

The SOCOM I think shows it’s advantage in handloading as it uses the more common .458 projectile as opposed to a .452 bullet which doesn’t come in a whole lot of rifle options (a more common pistol dimension)..

If I weren’t a reloader, I would have hands down picked the 450 bushmaster
 

rnovi

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I fully admit: the availability of commercial ammo was a huge selling point for me in picking the 450.

I do have to say: banging off 9 rounds in fast succession is actually just plain stupid fun. :)
 

Bert the Turtle

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Why on earth would someone want to shoot an engine block with a 458 Socom? Or anything else shoulder-fired for that matter? The guy at the gun store knows a whole lot more about cars than I do if he knows where exactly the the unobstructed paths to the engine block are on the various cars/trucks they drive in wherever he plans on shooting engine blocks. And if by some miracle he manages to actually hit the engine block, it isn't going to bring the car to a screeching halt anyway. He might have half a chance if he aimed for the nut behind the steering wheel.
 

mdwest

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Stopping vehicle borne threats doesn’t involve shooting the engine block.. it involves shooting the driver...

556 is significantly affected by angled window glass, door panels, dash boards, etc...

458 SOCOM is not..

And at close ranges like you find at an entry control point, big bore puts a whole lot more energy on the target than 556...

It’s about shutting down the jackass with the trigger mechanism immediately... not about shutting the vehicle down..

If you’re interested in shutting the vehicle down, thst is done with the M2 .50 BMG...
 

RayAtkinson

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Ive seen a bison shot with the Socum and a bull elk with the 50, the bison went 2 miles fortunatly in snow, and the elk was lost only to be found 4 days later by accident, both were lung/heart shots..Made up my mind based on two kills, and Im good withthat..
 

mdwest

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Definitely not a bison or an elk gun IMO...

Pigs... sure... whitetail? If you’re shooting at 150 or less... no problem (a stay puff marshmallow will kill a whitetail I am convinced, as long as you put enough velocity on it)...

2 legged dangerous game? Probably good in limited application...

Everything else? There are likely better choices...
 

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Ive seen a bison shot with the Socum and a bull elk with the 50, the bison went 2 miles fortunatly in snow, and the elk was lost only to be found 4 days later by accident, both were lung/heart shots..Made up my mind based on two kills, and Im good withthat..
Well Ray I guess the only way is to test it! Anyone here willing to be a test dummy?
 

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