4-Bore rifle build

Discussion in 'Muzzleloaders & Black Powder' started by Gert Odendaal, Jul 2, 2016.

  1. Gert Odendaal

    Gert Odendaal AH Elite

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    Good day members
    A friend of mine Herman Nel is building a 4 Bore black powder rifle. I thought sharing photos will be good. The match box is to give scale to the photos of the rifle only.
    The barrel is grooved and made in Birmingham.

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    Name Birmingham name engraved on the barrel:
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    Action is made by a well known gunsmith family from the cape in the 1800 era:
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    I definitely will be the first person to shoot this four bore, I already arranged it with my friend Herman Nel... [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Will upload photos as progress is made with the build, Herman Nel is a master rifle builder ....
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 2, 2016
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  2. CAustin

    CAustin AH ENABLER BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Ambassador

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    WOW! Now that's a project. Does your friend plan to have all the metal restored?
     

  3. Gert Odendaal

    Gert Odendaal AH Elite

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    CAustin, Herman Nel will build any part of the rifle himself if he can not get hold of an original part on this rifle. He already build a 8 -bore that was used by a legend in the Voortrekker history, and an ancestor of him, Hans "Dons" De Lange a reconnaissance soldier of the Voortrekker commando who fought the Zulu Impi of Dingaan...I will follow the build and upload photos and description of it..we are currently working on a method to sand cast our own steel components for these old rifles..The Quest; casting steel thread describes this process....http://www.africahunting.com/thread...sting-brass-martini-henry-barrel-rings.30024/
     
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  4. EDELWEISS

    EDELWEISS AH Enthusiast

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    Can you tell us any specifics about the rifle? Barrel length? Twist rate? Expected weight? What load he is planning (powder type, brand, charge)? Round ball of conical? I find these historical project of yours fascinating. I really wish I was able to join you on your living history hunts.

    I've wanted a BIG Bore gun for a long time. At first I planned a cartridge gun; but your posts have convinced me that I really want a muzzleloader. They also inspired me to buy a Martini rifle (in 45-70) and a Greener (Martini) action. If I cant be there with you in person, I'll be there in spirit....
     

  5. Gert Odendaal

    Gert Odendaal AH Elite

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    Good day to you Edelweiss
    Thank you kindly for the reply, it is much appreciated. I will visit Herman Nel in three weeks time. I visited him regularly to do project builds under his guidance.This time I will be building a copper milk tart pan I will use to build milk-tart on the camp fire coals. If time permits I will commence forging a Viking war ax as well.
    I will definitely get all the details you asked from Herman.
    Regards

    Gert
     

  6. Dennis Howard

    Dennis Howard New Member

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    Hi Gert,
    I just stumbled on this article and I am very interested to hear if you ended up finishing the 4 bore and have shot it? I own a hollis and sons 4 bore that we shoot as often as the shoulder can handle, so I just wanted to see if we can share any information.
    Thanks Dennis
     

  7. Gert Odendaal

    Gert Odendaal AH Elite

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    Dennis, Herman Nel is still working on the four bore , with all the current projects he is busy with it will take a while to complete the 4-bore project. I will keep you up to date ...(y)
     

  8. Forrest

    Forrest AH Member

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    Great project. Can't wait to see the finished product.
     

  9. 35bore

    35bore AH Legend

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    That should be amazing. What an awesome build. You have to post a report from the range, who knows, others may follow.
     

  10. BenKK

    BenKK AH Fanatic

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    Awesome rifle! Any progress?
     

  11. Red Leg

    Red Leg AH ENABLER LIFETIME BRONZE BENEFACTOR AH Legend

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    Hope he built a gun carriage and caisson for it. :sneaky:
     

  12. CAustin

    CAustin AH ENABLER BRONZE SUPPORTER AH Ambassador

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    I bet it weighs in over 20 lbs.
    The original post was from 2016 with no updates . Wonder if this rifle was finished?
     

  13. Shootist43

    Shootist43 AH ENABLER GOLD SUPPORTER AH Legend

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    Gert, I'm way late to this post. I just saw it a couple of minutes ago. My first thought was to suggest the use of Phosphoric Acid to remove all traces of rust without damaging the metal in any way. Since this is an old thread the project rifle is probably been completed by now. How about an update?
     

  14. fourfive8

    fourfive8 AH Fanatic

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    YoungFCSelous.jpg
    Very interesting project especially after reading Selous and his experiences with that same model 4 bore! Certainly hope the project can be completed. Would love some pics or video of firing it. Such living history is not at all common!

    Just contemplating. A regular full hunting load of about 410 gr black powder with a 1750 gr RB on top would be something. To think Selous' gun bearer once double loaded his Hollis 4 bore in the confusion of shooting elephants... then Selous fired it!! He later said he could never shoot well again. That's like a 410 gr black powder charge firing a projectile weighing somewhere around 3910 gr!!!
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018

  15. Tom Hawk

    Tom Hawk AH Enthusiast

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    Selous said that the 4 bore was always leaving his shoulder tender after shooting.
     

  16. fourfive8

    fourfive8 AH Fanatic

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    Yes, he laments ever using the big black powder gun and much preferred the more modern 450 "Express". In the 1870-80s there weren't a lot of reliable sources for guidance or reference nor availability of the nitro cartridge. The "Nitro" versions of the earlier BP Express cartridges weren't available until the late 1890s early 1900s.

    It is also surprising the double loaded 4 bore didn't burst and cause even more trauma to Selous. There is probably a very good chance (but no one will ever know) that both charges fired- further exaggerating the effects of the simple double load. That's like a 410 gr charge firing a 3910 grain projectile of which the imbedded 410 gr charge within the "projectile" also ignites! Yikes
     

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