100% Success Rate?

[Randy F]

I suppose everyone's definition of 100% success varies at least as much as their preferred method of hunting.
If one is out to simply fill tags, prefers long distance shots, and is willing to take nearly anything to get that shot while hoping to run across a trophy in the process, his/her expectations will likely be higher than one who spent his day stalking in for a bow shot at 40 yards on a trophy he's been after for some time... and got busted in the last ten feet. My bet is the one with the bow would be shaking his head with a wry smile and consider it a success to get even that close to a chance. Somewhere in between these two extremes is where I suspect most hunters reside.

I'd venture to guess that as most hunters gain experience and begin to see success, their definition of what success is to them changes as they progress.

A legal, fair chase hunt culminating in a chance at a shot may be a successful hunt to some, whereas it might be a complete failure to others if they didn't fill a tag. If I'm after a trophy, the first scenario is true. If I'm out to fill the freezer, the latter takes the day.

Ultimately though, I'm inclined to believe that anyone with experience actually hunting (that should stir a turd) for any length of time would know better than to expect 100% success putting down trophies of any kind.

My

 

[fourfive8]

^^Yep, that’s a pretty good assessment! I spent a lot of time between ages 18 and about 26 and many vertical miles bow hunting big mule deer bucks in some really rough country. Crumbling granite scree, rock out crops and thick spruce pockets with seasonally deep snow later in the season. I used a laminated recurve bare bow. Never cared for the then new compounds with sights or releases. 100% success expectation?…LOL ! Never got one and never scratched one. Most old, big ones in that area were in the 180-185 category. Older bucks there were heavy bodied with heavier than usual beams but not noted for length of points nor width. So B&C potential not particularly high. My percentage was exactly 0% . However going Mano a Mano at close range with those bucks day after day and over time taught me how to hunt.

IMO, elk under some circumstances are not nearly as difficult to hunt as some older mule deer bucks. But finding big ones, either mule deer or elk, is becoming much more difficult. There are not great numbers and many now are on private land which can become a trespass bidding war if the landowners are even willing to allow access.

 

[fourfive8]

Oh but I do have a 100% hunting story. I have hunted pronghorn several times over the years with both rifle and muzzleloader. One year around 1975-6? I applied for and received an archery license for pronghorn in a set aside limited draw area. It was during those years of my serious bow hunting pursuit of the big old mule deer described in the pervious post.

I parked my PU at a fence near the hunt boundary and headed out on foot slowly moving along amongst small rises, pausing on the tops to sit and glass for animals. True still hunting, take a very slow step or two, stop look, repeat, repeat, repeat... During the hours from first light to almost noon I did see several at distance but also noticed a couple of small groups pass over a saddle in a low hill that was strewn with boulders. The hill and saddle was no more than 10 feet above the surrounding plains. I made my way to the saddle and low and behold the trail through the saddle was riddled with goat tracts! I said, "self, this would be called a clue!" I picked a small bunch of 4 foot diameter boulders about 30 yards downwind of the trail through the saddle and decided to sit in them and wait. IIRC about noon. Not 15 minutes after settling in, a decent buck came walking to the saddle. I waited until he was just past and quartering away at about 40 yards to release the arrow. I was using the same laminated recurve bare bow. It seemed like the arrow flew in slow motion then disappeared into the animal. That is the only time I ever hunted pronghorn with a bow so it is my 100% hunt. The buck was really pretty nice at 15" with a good prongs.

 

[fourfive8]

My only 100% big game hunt experience. Archery pronghorn from a long time ago

 

[Ray B]

I am cautious when I see an outfitter/PH advertise 100% success. When it comes time to decide on shoot-don't shoot the hunter should be the one making the decision- not a guide concerned with maintaining the 100% rate. I have been on hunts where I didn't shoot an animal but the hunt was 100% successful with regard to my enjoyment and memories.
If the outfitter/PH guarantees that I will have a memorable experience and consider the money well spent- then the hunt is 100% successful- regardless as to what animals died in the process.

 

[fourfive8]

I am cautious when I see an outfitter/PH advertise 100% success. When it comes time to decide on shoot-don't shoot the hunter should be the one making the decision- not a guide concerned with maintaining the 100% rate. I have been on hunts where I didn't shoot an animal but the hunt was 100% successful with regard to my enjoyment and memories.
If the outfitter/PH guarantees that I will have a memorable experience and consider the money well spent- then the hunt is 100% successful- regardless as to what animals died in the process.

Yes, any such 100% statement for success should be a red flag. I read the OP and thought what in the world kind of a thought process includes a 100% hunting success? Never crossed my mind growing up until I started seeing it in print in hook and bullet magazines or being talked about. Just didn't compute and still doesn't. The only thing acceptable to me a guide or outfitter could tell me about 100% would be something like, "I (we) will give you 100% effort during the hunt."

 

[mark-hunter]

In hunting area in Namibia where I was hunting, there is no chance in 7 or 10 days that a hunter does not shoot something. Something means quite a few.

For example:
Package is kudu, warthog, red hartebeest, oryx, impala.
Hunter goes there collects all 5. Success 100%

Question one, same package deal:
hunter shoots: kudu, warthog, red hartebeest, oryx.
No impala, by pure luck.
Is this success 100%?

Question two, same package deal:
hunter shoots: kudu, warthog, red hartebeest, oryx.
No impala.
But there was chance for springbok, he shoots springbok instead of impala, collect s 5 trophies.
Is this success 100%?

This is example of typical plains game hunt package in South Africa and Namibia.
The bottom line, 80% of all hunts (on this forum) are typical PG packages in south africa and Namibia.
Any outfitter who is offering similar hunts, and have similar success options or rates, have right to say, they have 100% success rate.

Having said that, I have never seen advertising the hunt for bongo, on this forum, where outfitter guarantees 100% success rate.

Average outfitters - sponsors on this forum, are very honest, and stand up guys in the industry.
Depending of hunter what hunter is planning to hunt, certain hunts can be described as 100%, and some not. The trick is for hunter to have idea where he is going.

 

[Nevada Mike]

I would not buy or participate in a hunt that offered 100% kills. If it’s real hunting, $hit can happen. There are no guarantees.

 

[mark-hunter]

The thing that complicates this issue is commercial.

Would somebody pay xx.xxx amount of USD for unsuccessful hunt, and still be happy?
Would somebody who saves money for last 20 years, and pays same amount of xx.xxx USD, will still be happy for unsuccessful hunt? And he could afford, only one attempt?

In some businesses (and hunting industry is business) there is a clause - "no cure, no pay". But generally this does not apply to high end hunting. Refundable sums, are fraction of the cost, it any at all..

And when money is involved, the ethics often quickly drains.

Good compromise is day rate + trophy fee. But not always.
In high end hunting, day rates go sky high, hunting permits go sky high, and trophy fee, is small percentage of cost. So hunter again, pays at least 80% of a hunt, in case of not being successful. five figure ammounts. Hard to be happy.

(and this option, opens the door to dishonest outfitters and frauds)

 

[Kevin Peacocke]

You can and should aim for 100% in your preparation, it is fun doing so. But you can't predict the outcome of a hunt and the definition of success there is what you define it to be and it can change as you go.

 

[Desperatezulu]

100% success is largely a marketing gimmick for me - no outfitter/PH can account for the fitness and marksmanship of his hunter, even if he could ensure 100% certainty of shot presentation of whatever species.

If we further complicate the picture with trophy aspirations of the hunter, then 100% has to fall to a lower number, even if the PH has access to large populations with identified trophy potential therein.
Other than in put&take scenarios, trophy animals seldom reach older age without being cunning and elusive. 100% certainty of a trophy animal in a fair chase scenario is just BS marketing hype

If meat/cull hunting then 100% does become a possibility again, the hunter's abilities notwithstanding. With large populations, the PH can be confident of getting his hunter presented with an opportunity, perhaps even 100% of the time.

One comment I would make with regard to the comparisons on this thread of people comparing their self-guided hunts versus African hunts. Remember the PH and his entourage are (nearly always) experts in their craft with 100s of days over a number of years put into familiarising themselves with their concession and resident game populations. The self guided hunter is highly unlikely to be as familiar, especially on public land, no matter how competent a hunter he may be. It's not a fair fight - superior expertise and local knowledge means the PH is going to have a higher percentage getting a hunter onto an animal than the hunter would on his own. It is a big part of why we hire them after all.

I think @WAB and @Philip Glass's comments are bang on.

 

[Desperatezulu]

You can and should aim for 100% in your preparation, it is fun doing so. But you can't predict the outcome of a hunt and the definition of success there is what you define it to be and it can change as you go.

Agreed!