Wolves in Colorado!

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CoElkHunter

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They’re here! Well they have been here, just confirmed now.

A321B4B9-6500-472F-B069-3A8A7EF4DD03.png
 
Just like the black bear public vote to stop baiting and stop spring bear hunting. Voted on by the ignorant masses! We pay the DOW for their expertise! I wonder if they would vote for self cancer diagnosis eliminating Doctors from the process? Stupid is as stupid does.
 
Ridgewalker said:
Just like the black bear public vote to stop baiting and stop spring bear hunting. Voted on by the ignorant masses! We pay the DOW for their expertise! I wonder if they would vote for self cancer diagnosis eliminating Doctors from the process? Stupid is as stupid does.
Click to expand...
Yep!
 
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This is the best Wolf Management Program to preserve you deer and elk population. Montana, Idaho and Wyoming have already seen the “benefits” of wolf reintroduction.
 
Declare them fair game with a quota and let hunters control them. Or better yet SOSSTK (shoot on sight shoot to kill).
 
the only thing good that wolf reintro has done for wy.that I can see is eliminate a few hundred bison from Yellowstone that the fed gov didn't have the balls to get rid of,along with a hell of a bunch of moose,elk and deer from wy.Id and mont.
 
It was just a matter of time before the Sportsmen and women of Colorado got dragged into the fight. I sure hope you guys are better prepared and funded than your predecessors. You will not prevent wolves from being introduced, but if you are well organized and fight tooth and nail to the bitter end you might be able to implement a management strategy that doesn’t allow them to decimate your moose, elk and deer populations. There is now quite a lot of history and data available from Idaho, Montana and Wyoming to draw upon that wasn’t available when wolves were introduced here. This could certainly play in favor of Colorado if used properly. CPW, COA (Colorado Outfitters Association), and Sportsmen’s groups should be banding together and preparing for the fight of their lives.
However, I admit I remain a skeptic. Colorado has become too liberal and I doubt CPW has the political will or clout to actually do what is necessary, the percentage of hunters vs the non-hunting public is not favorable in CO anymore.

This article came out yesterday in the Idaho Statesman
https://www.idahostatesman.com/outd...CqMTuzreiRqR97LFPfE7ACJZoizKNqjSZMNDtEfuQIl30

Does “Colorado” collectively have the will and ability to implement year-round hunting and trapping of wolves? We are fortunate here in Idaho that “Idaho” and IDF&G does in fact have the will and ability, sadly just a little bit late. How long that might remain the case is anybody’s guess...

Two years ago, shortly after management of wolves was returned to the state of Idaho, Idaho began to test and implement a different model of wolf monitoring. Instead of the existing model based primarily upon field staff, calculations based on population modeling, and radio collar data, IDFG implemented a plan to use “camera traps” placed in strategic locations such as rendezvous sites, den sites, travel corridors, etc. If I recall correctly, some 1500 or so trail cameras have been deployed. Subsequently, Idaho has revised its statewide population estimate upward from about 900 to 1541 wolves in the summer of 2019.
The annual harvest (I hate that word) of wolves in Idaho by hunters and trappers is about 300. There are usually about 20,000 wolf tags sold annually, although the numbers is increasing. A couple years ago a hunter could buy 5 wolf tags and a certified wolf trapper could buy 5 trapping tags. Those numbers have been increased to 15 and 15. Also, trapping and hunting tags can be used interchangeably so long as both seasons are open.
I mention some of these details just to illustrate even though Idaho has progressively been loosening the regulations and trying to increase the harvest of wolves, we’ll probably still only kill between 300 and 400 this year. About 25 percent of the total population at best. Not enough to actually decrease the total number of wolves.
So, when we have a winter like ‘16/‘17 with a high winter mortality rate it takes a lot longer for the herd to rebuild.
A few more thoughts. I am not a wolf hater. In fact, I hunt them every year and love it. I get to hunt all winter long and there are very, very few other people to compete with. What I hate is that from day 1 wolves were an unmanaged and unmanageable resource. At least the way the were handled when we got them. I hate what they have done to our deer, elk and moose populations but I don’t hate the wolves. And in fact it is not ONLY the wolves that are to blame for where we’re at. They were just the tipping point.
When you consider everything that kills undulates, wolves are just one more factor in the equation. One there wasn’t room for. Vehicles, disease, winter mortality, hunter harvest, mountain lion, bear, coyotes, loss of quality winter range, overall degradation of habitat... the list goes on.
If only Colorado can avoid the path of Idaho... If Idaho had been able to implement our current hunting and trapping regulations in about 2004 when wolves had reached the numbers agreed to for ESA delisting, we might be singing a different tune. What we got were lawsuits, activist judges legislating and managing wildlife from the bench (from another state), biologists hands tied and voices silenced. You know this already...
It is an iffy proposition whether or not enough wolves can be killed by hunters and trappers to keep a wolf population in check without additional control efforts utilizing radio telemetry, aerial gunning, poison, and complete pack removal by USDA APHIS efforts. To my knowledge it has never been done successfully before.
Ecosystems must be managed, not individual species by themselves, but that is what happens where wolves are concerned. Can Colorado reduce the predator load by hunting and trapping of other predators such as mountain lion, bear and coyotes to make some room for wolves? I dunno, but I doubt it.
@Scott CWO , I believe you are a CO Outfitter? Would love to hear some of your thoughts.
 
That clout, what little there was to begin with, likely vanished when the voters decided to let hunting and fishing license fees pay for picnic tables and crappers in state parks so the politicians in Denver didn't have to assign their precious general (slush) fund money to maintaining state parks. They had been drooling over the solvent, general operating fund of the DOW for years. Usually one of the only solvent funds in any state government that has a separate wildlife or game and fish department. Plus, as these poster species are released, there are all varieties of bureaucracies, bureaucrats and academic programs created for their management, baby sitting, and study in perpetuity. Once begun, I've never seen a bureaucracy shrink back if the original necessity goes away. Forget the biological/ecological fact that such apex predators as wolves require huge, uninhabited and un-fragmented habitats with sufficient prey. A condition that simply doesn't exist anymore in most areas of the contiguous US. Even Yellowstone, as big as it is, isn't quite big enough. It will forever be a source of "spillage" (natural emigration) of problem predators like wolves and grizzly bears into the surrounding areas that will demand babysitting or control. :( ugh
 
IdaRam said:
It was just a matter of time before the Sportsmen and women of Colorado got dragged into the fight. I sure hope you guys are better prepared and funded than your predecessors. You will not prevent wolves from being introduced, but if you are well organized and fight tooth and nail to the bitter end you might be able to implement a management strategy that doesn’t allow them to decimate your moose, elk and deer populations. There is now quite a lot of history and data available from Idaho, Montana and Wyoming to draw upon that wasn’t available when wolves were introduced here. This could certainly play in favor of Colorado if used properly. CPW, COA (Colorado Outfitters Association), and Sportsmen’s groups should be banding together and preparing for the fight of their lives.
However, I admit I remain a skeptic. Colorado has become too liberal and I doubt CPW has the political will or clout to actually do what is necessary, the percentage of hunters vs the non-hunting public is not favorable in CO anymore.

This article came out yesterday in the Idaho Statesman
https://www.idahostatesman.com/outd...CqMTuzreiRqR97LFPfE7ACJZoizKNqjSZMNDtEfuQIl30

Does “Colorado” collectively have the will and ability to implement year-round hunting and trapping of wolves? We are fortunate here in Idaho that “Idaho” and IDF&G does in fact have the will and ability, sadly just a little bit late. How long that might remain the case is anybody’s guess...

Two years ago, shortly after management of wolves was returned to the state of Idaho, Idaho began to test and implement a different model of wolf monitoring. Instead of the existing model based primarily upon field staff, calculations based on population modeling, and radio collar data, IDFG implemented a plan to use “camera traps” placed in strategic locations such as rendezvous sites, den sites, travel corridors, etc. If I recall correctly, some 1500 or so trail cameras have been deployed. Subsequently, Idaho has revised its statewide population estimate upward from about 900 to 1541 wolves in the summer of 2019.
The annual harvest (I hate that word) of wolves in Idaho by hunters and trappers is about 300. There are usually about 20,000 wolf tags sold annually, although the numbers is increasing. A couple years ago a hunter could buy 5 wolf tags and a certified wolf trapper could buy 5 trapping tags. Those numbers have been increased to 15 and 15. Also, trapping and hunting tags can be used interchangeably so long as both seasons are open.
I mention some of these details just to illustrate even though Idaho has progressively been loosening the regulations and trying to increase the harvest of wolves, we’ll probably still only kill between 300 and 400 this year. About 25 percent of the total population at best. Not enough to actually decrease the total number of wolves.
So, when we have a winter like ‘16/‘17 with a high winter mortality rate it takes a lot longer for the herd to rebuild.
A few more thoughts. I am not a wolf hater. In fact, I hunt them every year and love it. I get to hunt all winter long and there are very, very few other people to compete with. What I hate is that from day 1 wolves were an unmanaged and unmanageable resource. At least the way the were handled when we got them. I hate what they have done to our deer, elk and moose populations but I don’t hate the wolves. And in fact it is not ONLY the wolves that are to blame for where we’re at. They were just the tipping point.
When you consider everything that kills undulates, wolves are just one more factor in the equation. One there wasn’t room for. Vehicles, disease, winter mortality, hunter harvest, mountain lion, bear, coyotes, loss of quality winter range, overall degradation of habitat... the list goes on.
If only Colorado can avoid the path of Idaho... If Idaho had been able to implement our current hunting and trapping regulations in about 2004 when wolves had reached the numbers agreed to for ESA delisting, we might be singing a different tune. What we got were lawsuits, activist judges legislating and managing wildlife from the bench (from another state), biologists hands tied and voices silenced. You know this already...
It is an iffy proposition whether or not enough wolves can be killed by hunters and trappers to keep a wolf population in check without additional control efforts utilizing radio telemetry, aerial gunning, poison, and complete pack removal by USDA APHIS efforts. To my knowledge it has never been done successfully before.
Ecosystems must be managed, not individual species by themselves, but that is what happens where wolves are concerned. Can Colorado reduce the predator load by hunting and trapping of other predators such as mountain lion, bear and coyotes to make some room for wolves? I dunno, but I doubt it.
@Scott CWO , I believe you are a CO Outfitter? Would love to hear some of your thoughts.
Click to expand...
If wolves establish themselves in Colorado, they will get free reign to decimate our game herds. Just like with the burgeoning black bear population, trapping, baiting and use of dogs will be prohibited. Our DOW is impotent and the non hunting public dictates (through voting) our game management policies. AND, the depredation damages WILL be paid by the DOW through their budget, which is the money hunters and fishermen in this state pay for their licenses, tags, etc., etc! Once again, the voters who will vote to allow wolves in Colorado will be off the hook for any financial (taxes) responsibility for this fiasco!
 
Voter/ballot initiatives have been the death of sound wildlife management practices nationwide :(
 
CoElkHunter said:
If wolves establish themselves in Colorado, they will get free reign to decimate our game herds. Just like with the burgeoning black bear population, trapping, baiting and use of dogs will be prohibited. Our DOW is impotent and the non hunting public dictates (through voting) our game management policies. AND, the depredation damages WILL be paid by the DOW through their budget, which is the money hunters and fishermen in this state pay for their licenses, tags, etc., etc! Once again, the voters who will vote to allow wolves in Colorado will be off the hook for any financial (taxes) responsibility for this fiasco!
Click to expand...
Bingo. Once again, hunters footing the bill for everyone, for something they adamantly oppose.
I suspect one of the arguments for wolf reintroduction may be that wolves have already established themselves in Colorado, but without supplemental wolves to increase the genetic diversity, the established wolves may become inbred thereby harming the species.
 
Apparently, the first couple of batches of exports have done a little too well.

I still chuckle about the "thinking" that the Wolves from Alberta that had done nothing but kill Elk Moose and Deer their entire lives, while being constantly hunted themselves, were supposed to suddenly target Bison. :rolleyes:

It does not surprise me at all that they have done so well where they can't be hunted.
 
IdaRam said:
Bingo. Once again, hunters footing the bill for everyone, for something they adamantly oppose.
I suspect one of the arguments for wolf reintroduction may be that wolves have already established themselves in Colorado, but without supplemental wolves to increase the genetic diversity, the established wolves may become inbred thereby harming the species.
Click to expand...
Possibly? In 2007(?) or thereabouts, a female wolf with a radio collar from YELLOWSTONE was killed by a vehicle trying to cross I-70 near Georgetown, west of Denver! That is a long way! So, yes they've been here for awhile, just unofficially? Two years ago in December, three of us in a vehicle coming from Smith Center to McCook, Nebraska while pheasant hunting, saw a large black wolf standing on a bluff along a highway. We are all coyote hunters, so we know the difference. We were later checked by a Nebraska DOW officer just checking for licenses. We mentioned this to him, and he wasn't very forthcoming, but was very interested where we saw the wolf. So, the wolves are expanding (slowly) and regaining their former habitats.
 
BRICKBURN said:
Apparently, the first couple of batches of exports have done a little too well.

I still chuckle about the "thinking" that the Wolves from Alberta that had done nothing but kill Elk Moose and Deer their entire lives, while being constantly hunted themselves, were supposed to suddenly target Bison. :rolleyes:

It does not surprise me at all that they have done so well where they can't be hunted.
Click to expand...
Yes! And where's all the hue and cry to re-populate the Bison? In Colorado's history, the Bison were all over the plains and were only pushed into the mountains (think Yellowstone in Wyoming) by relentless pursuit by meat/hide market hunters and sport shooters (poachers in my book) who left the Bison to rot for sport! I say the Bison should be "re-populated" before the wolves! Good luck with that! Ha! Ha!
 
Don't forget the LARGE population of wolves in northern Minnesota and to a lesser extent in Michigan and Wisconsin. They've been dealing with wolves since the early '90s?
 
CoElkHunter said:
Possibly? In 2007(?) or thereabouts, a female wolf with a radio collar from YELLOWSTONE was killed by a vehicle trying to cross I-70 near Georgetown, west of Denver! That is a long way! So, yes they've been here for awhile, just unofficially? Two years ago in December, three of us in a vehicle coming from Smith Center to McCook, Nebraska while pheasant hunting, saw a large black wolf standing on a bluff along a highway. We are all coyote hunters, so we know the difference. We were later checked by a Nebraska DOW officer just checking for licenses. We mentioned this to him, and he wasn't very forthcoming, but was very interested where we saw the wolf. So, the wolves are expanding (slowly) and regaining their former habitats.
Click to expand...
No doubt, wolves are traveling machines! We had a documented case recently of a radio collared wolf traveling 120 miles in a 24 hour period. Pretty incredible when you think about it. That would be an average sustained speed of 5 miles per hour for 24 hours, or 10 mph for 12 hours.
Also, up in the Donnely area of Idaho, USDA removed part of a pack that was routinely traveling 30-40 miles, killing a calf (beef) at night, feeding and disappearing before daylight. Only to randomly repeat the performance once every week or two.
Yes, I bet he was very interested in where you saw that wolf. Wow, Nebraska. That wolf had seen some real estate.
 
IdaRam said:
No doubt, wolves are traveling machines! We had a documented case recently of a radio collared wolf traveling 120 miles in a 24 hour period. Pretty incredible when you think about it. That would be an average sustained speed of 5 miles per hour for 24 hours, or 10 mph for 12 hours.
Also, up in the Donnely area of Idaho, USDA removed part of a pack that was routinely traveling 30-40 miles, killing a calf (beef) at night, feeding and disappearing before daylight. Only to randomly repeat the performance once every week or two.
Yes, I bet he was very interested in where you saw that wolf. Wow, Nebraska. That wolf had seen some real estate.
Click to expand...
Yes, a 120 miles in 24 hours! Amazing! But, I'm like you in that I don't/wouldn't hate their presence in Colorado, if they would be able to be hunted to control their numbers? But that won't happen here in Colorado. It'll be a deer/elk smorgasbord for the wolves at our hunters' expense!
 
CoElkHunter said:
Yes, a 120 miles in 24 hours! Amazing! But, I'm like you in that I don't/wouldn't hate their presence in Colorado, if they would be able to be hunted to control their numbers? But that won't happen here in Colorado. It'll be a deer/elk smorgasbord for the wolves at our hunters' expense!
Click to expand...
So sad, yet so true. Exactly as it was in Idaho. They will find a well stocked larder.
I’ve been chasing a pack around here for the last few weeks. They disappeared over a year ago and I wasn’t sure where in hell they had gone. I thought they must have met their demise. All of a sudden back and I’m pretty sure it is the same 2 alphas with a couple of last years pups. Back to the same exact territory and preparing to den in the same area. I’m hoping to have some trail cam pics of them one of these days soon. I’ll post ‘em up if I get any.
I first ran into this bunch a few years ago snowmobiling with my girlfriend. I made the mistake of not having my rifle with me on that trip. I don’t plan on ever making that mistake again!
 
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