Interesting rifle and chambering

Scrumbag · Nov 29, 2019

Interesting rifle and chambering at an auction house in the UK

https://auctions.holtsauctioneers.c...alelot=S0120+++4340+&refno=++136871&saletype=

Winchester 1895 in 9.3x53r which is real oddity particularly in the UK

ATB,

Scrummy

Hogpatrol · Nov 29, 2019

Barrel bluing is shiny, could be a rebarrel.

Kawshik Rahman · Nov 29, 2019

scrumbag
l have personally had a client bring a Winchester model 1895 under - lever rifle in .30-06 Springfield calibre . Another resident Indian hunter had an old Winchester model 1895 re-chambered and re-barrelled to use the the local Indian Ordinance Factories .315 bore cartridge ( which is a clone of the 8 millimeter mannlicher cartridge ) . The late American President , Colonel Theodore Roosevelt owned a Winchester model 1895 calibrated for the .405 Winchester cartridge . l have been told by more than one of my Russian friends , that some consignments of Winchester model 1895 rifles were even calibrated for the Russian service cartridge many years ago .
In your case , l would suspect that the rifle was re-barrelled to use that particular calibre.

leslie hetrick · Nov 29, 2019

I own and shoot many older lever action rifles in odd calibers that I load for, but I had a 1895 in 30-40 krag and I never warmed up to it and down the road it went for a good profit, that action had a lot going on when you operated it.

crs · Nov 29, 2019

Leslie, the 30-40 Krag was not for me either, but I do like the 1895 rifles in other calibers.

My Winchester 1895 .405 filled a gap in my arsenal that was unknown to me before I fired a .405 belonging to a friend; sweet!
Now I have two 1895 .405s and one Simson .405 sxs double rifle. I really like the way the 300 grain bullets swat down critters from wild boar to red deer and water buffalo. The action is even smoother than my 1886 .45-90 and almost as smooth as my 100+ year old 1892. Plus, the 400 grain ammo elevates the game nicely for bigger and badder game.

bruce moulds · Nov 30, 2019

the 405 has disappointed many on water buffalo in oz.
they read about Roosevelt using one and think it is a nitro express, much to their chagrin.
the krag cartridge is neck and neck with the 303 with similar wt bullets.
bruce.

perttime · Nov 30, 2019

It would be interesting to see what kind of stamps there are on the barrel.
Finland had some Model 1895 rifles in 7.62x54R in military use. After WW2, many were converted to 9.3x53R, for hunting Moose.

Wyatt Smith · Nov 30, 2019

I read an article on the 1895 Winchester last night in “Firearms News” the Russians bought nearly 300,000 of them in 7.62x54r and used them during/until the Great War. The US military tried a few alongside the Krag and the Remington Lee, and it was not seen a suitable for military service, due the the slow rate of fire (due to the difficulty of loading it) and poor accuracy.

perttime · Nov 30, 2019

The first article that I found on the Finnish ones (captured Russian) , issued to second line troops, mentioned difficult reloading especially when prone. There was some reference to calling it the "snow scoop".

crs · Nov 30, 2019

Bruce,
Maybe they should learn to shoot accurately and shoot the game in the right place. And possibly load bullets suited to the game hunted.

A down under friend of mine, Peter, has taken banteng, waterbuff, hogs, deer, etc in country.
(Even Craig Boddingon and daughter took water buff there with the .405.)
Peter has also taken cape buff and such in Africa, and water buff, elk, and others in Texas (lots of exotic ranches where we hunted together).
His 1895 .405 sports a scope mounted by the first owner who used it to take cape buff and other game in Africa.

Even I have used mine on water buff, cape buff(400 grain Woodies), Nilgai,, and many critters of lesser stature.

Certainly, the rifle and cartridge are not best for every hunter, but have long been proven on medium, large, and dangerous game.

Perttime,
loading the magazine with rimmed cartridges, especially on the run, must be done properly or a jam will occur. Clearing the jam, especially with a pocket knife and on the run, can be very frustrating, but can be done. IMHO, this would be a valid objection for a battle rifle.

crs · Nov 30, 2019

PS, should anyone want THE 1895 collectors book, it is:
Winchester Model 1895
Last of the Classic Lever Actions

Authors:
Rob Kassab & Brad Dunbar

Lots of history, details, and pictures of guns and people.
Short stories about TR, Texas Rangers, Martin and Osa Johnson in Africa, lawmen, hunters, The Russia Contract, the Mexican War, and even a picture of the stripper clip for the Russian Contract rifles.
Osa was a little gal, but her .405 talked big for her.
Also photographic evidence that the Cape Buffalo and Rhino could not read, as they did not know that the .405 WCF was "not enough gun" to kill them.

This is a KEEPER for coffee table or library.

Get it for Christmas.

WAB · Nov 30, 2019

Sure wish I hadn’t sold my ‘95 in .303!

crs · Nov 30, 2019

Still reading about Martin and Osa filming animal in Africa.
It seems that after a while they developed specialties; he operated the camera and she stood guard with her 1895 .405.
One quote from the book was that she saved him many times and actually dropped (with her .405) two elephant within 6 feet of him and the camera.
So, it seems those ele were no better educated than the buff and rhino and could not read. Otherwise they would have known that the .405 WCF could not kill them.

crs · Nov 30, 2019

Wab,
If you want a serious 1895,
I have an extra unfired 1895 .405 Deluxe:

sestoppelman · Nov 30, 2019

I love the '95 rifle. Have one in .30-40 Krag, a Browning repro, very good shooter. And on my 2nd .405 Win and soon maybe a third?

.. Took one to Africa but only shot a big nyala with it, but man it were decisive!

WAB · Dec 1, 2019

crs said:
Wab,
If you want a serious 1895,
I have an extra unfired 1895 .405 Deluxe:

Beautiful rifle! I appreciate the offer but there’s some nostalgia with the .303 for me.

Scrumbag · Dec 3, 2019

perttime said:
It would be interesting to see what kind of stamps there are on the barrel.
Finland had some Model 1895 rifles in 7.62x54R in military use. After WW2, many were converted to 9.3x53R, for hunting Moose.

Pertime, that was indeed my thought on the rifle, probably a Finnish connection.

Scrummy

Scrumbag · Dec 3, 2019

Kawshik Rahman said:
scrumbag
l have personally had a client bring a Winchester model 1895 under - lever rifle in .30-06 Springfield calibre . Another resident Indian hunter had an old Winchester model 1895 re-chambered and re-barrelled to use the the local Indian Ordinance Factories .315 bore cartridge ( which is a clone of the 8 millimeter mannlicher cartridge ) . The late American President , Colonel Theodore Roosevelt owned a Winchester model 1895 calibrated for the .405 Winchester cartridge . l have been told by more than one of my Russian friends , that some consignments of Winchester model 1895 rifles were even calibrated for the Russian service cartridge many years ago .
In your case , l would suspect that the rifle was re-barrelled to use that particular calibre.

Mr Rahman sir, I think you are right on the service rifles. The Imperial Russian Army ordered quite a few I understand.

Also I understand some of the Canadian Mounted Police and some Auxilliary units used .303 Brit (Often saddle ring carbines / muskets apparently)

If anyone is interested in "odder" uses of lever action rifles, check out this series from the YouTube channel C&Rsenal

French Contract Winchester 1894:

Russian Contract 1895:

British Contract 1892*:

(For the Royal Navy, the senior bloody service no less! Always were considered slightly "funny" chaps but that's a stretch! Too many long nights away from home and too many "pink gins" under the awning if you catch my meaning)

C&Rsenal are currently releasing a series on the Mauser 98 going through the variants from the original German Gewehr to Serbian, Siamese etc. So the genesis of the best hunting rifles in the world right there. (Not a word, Remington fan boys, you snivelling push-feed-pansies....)

Kawshik Rahman · Dec 3, 2019

Scrumbag said:
Mr Rahman sir, I think you are right on the service rifles. The Imperial Russian Army ordered quite a few I understand.

Also I understand some of the Canadian Mounted Police and some Auxilliary units used .303 Brit (Often saddle ring carbines / muskets apparently)

If anyone is interested in "odder" uses of lever action rifles, check out this series from the YouTube channel C&Rsenal

French Contract Winchester 1894:

Russian Contract 1895:

British Contract 1892*:

(For the Royal Navy, the senior bloody service no less! Always were considered slightly "funny" chaps but that's a stretch! Too many long nights away from home and too many "pink gins" under the awning if you catch my meaning)

C&Rsenal are currently releasing a series on the Mauser 98 going through the variants from the original German Gewehr to Serbian, Siamese etc. So the genesis of the best hunting rifles in the world right there. (Not a word, Remington fan boys, you snivelling push-feed-pansies....)

Scrumbag,
This is most interesting. I apologise to any American gentleman for labelling them or attempting to fit them into a particular stereotype , as it is not my intention . However , l have always thought of an under - lever rifle as being purely an American tool and l have difficulty picturing English gentlemen holding them . In my mind whenever l think of an under-lever rifle , l think of my favorite American actor , John Wayne in " Stage Coach " ( an excellent film ) holding a model 1892 from Winchester in .44-40 bore calibre .

Bob Nelson 35Whelen · Aug 21, 2020

Kawshik Rahman said:
scrumbag
l have personally had a client bring a Winchester model 1895 under - lever rifle in .30-06 Springfield calibre . Another resident Indian hunter had an old Winchester model 1895 re-chambered and re-barrelled to use the the local Indian Ordinance Factories .315 bore cartridge ( which is a clone of the 8 millimeter mannlicher cartridge ) . The late American President , Colonel Theodore Roosevelt owned a Winchester model 1895 calibrated for the .405 Winchester cartridge . l have been told by more than one of my Russian friends , that some consignments of Winchester model 1895 rifles were even calibrated for the Russian service cartridge many years ago .
In your case , l would suspect that the rifle was re-barrelled to use that particular calibre.

@Kawshik Rahman
My dear friend Kawshik you are certainly correct that the model 95 Winchester was chambered for the Russian cartridge the 7.62x54R. It also had a full length fore end and was called the Muskatoon. A friend of mine has around 20 different model 95 Winchester in an array of calibers including the 30/40 Krag, 303 British, 405 Winchester and quite a few more calibers.
Bob
I pray you are keeping safe and well my friend.

Interesting rifle and chambering

Scrumbag

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