What do you expect from a camp gun?

According to my Grandad , when he went on his Kenya Safari in '68 , the standard rental camp guns from his Safari outfitters were :
.458 Win Mag Winchester Model 70
.375 HH Mag Winchester Model 70
.338 Mag Winchester Model 70 ( this one actually surprised me a bit , since l typically don't think .338 when l think Africa )
.30-06 Winchester Model 70
.22 LR Rifles ( he doesn't remember the brand )
12 gauge Double barrelled side by side shotguns , all full choked with 24 inches barrels , chambered for the 2 5/8 inch shell .
The PH had a .470 Double and one of the native trackers had a .458 Win Mag Model 70
According to my Father in law , who went on a Lion and plains game hunt in 1964 , the following guns were available for rent from HIS outfitters in Kenya :
7mm Remington Magnum for the varmints ( this is suprising if you think about it , since the 7mm Remington Magnum only came out in 1962 and was quite recent )
.375 HH Magnum for the Medium game
.470 Nitro Express double rifles for elephant , rhino and buffalo.
Also , my father in law remembers his PH having a passionate dislike for the Remington 700 which my father in law had brought with him . I can't imagine why , since l like the Remington 700 myself . Of course , l am no expert on African Game yet.
The PH himself carried a .470 Double for back up work and recommended that nothing smaller than .470 NE be used for Elephant , buffalo or Rhino. My father in law recalls seeing many client hunters of other outfitters with the .416 Rigby or .404 Jeffery Mauser rifles , but isn't sure if they were personally brought , or rented
Next year on my 2020 Buffalo Safari , l plan to take my .375 HH Model 70 and my .350 Rigby Magnum . I may need to rent a shotgun if l don't bring one of my own . I will see first hand what is available today.

Best advise is to ask questions as many have said and even some pictures if need be.

I had to go on a short notice hunt to Matetsi in Zim, I could not get a transit permit through Botswana for my own rifles in time. I was assured over and over that they had a good rifle in 375 H&H in camp I could use...well I should have known better.

I took my own ammunition.

I got handed a Sako, very light with a duct taped up stock. Closer inspection revealed a badly cracked stock. First shot at the range had the magazine floor plate pop open and dump the contents at my feet. Some screws and a lot more duct tape had it sorted but I would never use a camp gun again unless I am 100% sure what I am getting...

We finished the safari without a glitch but I had no confidence in that beat up rifle..

Last year in Zimbabwe, I had taken my rifle along, my companion ordered beforehand one of the outfitter/ph‘s rifles. That chap owns two rifles. Well, he never maintains them so both were more or less out of order. Useless junk. My partner was very shocked of course.

In many countries, you wont’ Have a choice of camp gun. You use ‘the one’ they have or that’s it.

Red Leg said:

The real issue is often the ammunition.

Click to expand...

This has been my experience. PH’s may have good ammo, depending usually on what other hunters have left behind. Or they may not. On a recent hunt, I was using some hand loads left by a previous hunter. No problems sighting in. Then a misfire when it came time to shoot the one trophy I was really there for (LDE). After that, I only used the handloads when nothing particular hinged on it - and one out of three wouldn’t fire at all. Luckily a box of factory loads was located in another camp and brought to us.

IvW said:

Best advise is to ask questions as many have said and even some pictures if need be.

I had to go on a short notice hunt to Matetsi in Zim, I could not get a transit permit through Botswana for my own rifles in time. I was assured over and over that they had a good rifle in 375 H&H in camp I could use...well I should have known better.

I took my own ammunition.

I got handed a Sako, very light with a duct taped up stock. Closer inspection revealed a badly cracked stock. First shot at the range had the magazine floor plate pop open and dump the contents at my feet. Some screws and a lot more duct tape had it sorted but I would never use a camp gun again unless I am 100% sure what I am getting...

We finished the safari without a glitch but I had no confidence in that beat up rifle..

Click to expand...

It could be worse . Imagine if you went in there and saw that you had to work with a loathsome .460 Weatherby

Hoss Delgado said:

It could be worse . Imagine if you went in there and saw that you had to work with a loathsome .460 Weatherby

Click to expand...

And God forbid it was a push-feed.

Loaners I have had both excellent and bad.
If it matters to you, ask lots of questions and obtain the information you require.
When you shoot it at the target you'll know what you have. Deal with it. After you accept it, it's on you.

A friend was handed one of these on a hunt and was asked if it was acceptable?


He chuckled.
Needless to say it was spot on.


On an upcoming hunt it has been rumoured that I will be allowed to put my hands on one of these pieces of art.

All I can do is say: "That'll do Pig. That'll do!"
Pretty sure it will be very well taken care of. I have no worries.

I have only been on 3 guided hunts and have used guides rifles each time. Each one was great. My first hunt (Namibia) I took my own rifle but it didn't arrive at the same time as I did. So I used my PHs Weatherby Vanguard in .30-06 for the first day. Two shots from it and I had a Steenbok and Gemsbok on the ground. Hunted the next 9 days with my own. Second hunt (Texas) I used my outfitter's Ruger American .270 and it took care of a ram and several hogs very nicely. My last hunt (Eastern Cape) I used my outfitters Ruger 77 in .300 Win Mag. Shot 7 animals with it and never missed. I got really fond of that rifle! On my last night I got to go after a bonus porcupine and used a CZ in .223 which I also wanted to bring home with me!

I totally understand guys wanting to use their own rifles. If I got saddled with a lemon for a rifle, I'd be leery thereafter. And I think it would be so cool to bring my Browning BLR to Africa. But I find it easier for me not to travel with them and all four rifles that I've borrowed have worked perfectly to me. Plus now I know the advantages of a suppressor...something I can't use here!

BeeMaa said:

And God forbid it was a push-feed.

Click to expand...

Aren't all .460 Weatherby rifles push feed ?

I used a camp gun for one day, It was a Mauser 98 action chambered in 30-06 it had German Glass and a Timney trigger that broke at 2#, no complaints

Thank you everybody.

So lets try it this way.
If I win the lotto tonight, buy a Ranch next week and walk into Safari and Outdoor 3 weeks from now. What Rifles can I buy that will meet your standards? No DG on the farm, only PG. Eland and Giraffe.

I was thinking a pair of Mauser M18’s, a 6,5x55 and 300wm both topped with VX3 3,5-10x40

Wil that be ok? Or will that be frowned upon as low budged ........

Leupold Vx3i will be fine.
The rifles sound nice and reasonably priced for loaners

Honestly as long as they were reliable and functional that is what you would expect of. Camp,rifle.

If I expected it was to be high grade rifles and glass I’m sure I would be expected to pay accordingly. If I could afford that i would take my own gear.

If you win the lotto can you offer discounted services?

No frills hunting experience with good food and good service

Hoss Delgado said:

Aren't all .460 Weatherby rifles push feed ?

Click to expand...

If it is in fact a Weatherby rifle chambered in 460WBY, then yes.
However there are the occasional ones out there made by someone other than Weatherby.
For example, Montana Rifle Co has their newest offering "The African" available in 460WBY and it is CRF.
However, I don't think anyone would be complaining about shooting that...other than the associated recoil and cost of ammo.

CBH Australia said:

Leupold Vx3i will be fine.
The rifles sound nice and reasonably priced for loaners

Honestly as long as they were reliable and functional that is what you would expect of. Camp,rifle.

If I expected it was to be high grade rifles and glass I’m sure I would be expected to pay accordingly. If I could afford that i would take my own gear.

If you win the lotto can you offer discounted services?

No frills hunting experience with good food and good service

Click to expand...

There will be some good management hunts available for the first 5 years. With a more “local” feel to it. There will be a brand new camp but limited staff for the first few years. So we need to braai 3 times a day if we want to eat.

Mauser78 said:

Thank you everybody.

So lets try it this way.
If I win the lotto tonight, buy a Ranch next week and walk into Safari and Outdoor 3 weeks from now. What Rifles can I buy that will meet your standards? No DG on the farm, only PG. Eland and Giraffe.

I was thinking a pair of Mauser M18’s, a 6,5x55 and 300wm both topped with VX3 3,5-10x40

Wil that be ok? Or will that be frowned upon as low budged ........

Click to expand...

If I showed up in your camp and you had two new Winchester Model 70 super grades, one in 270 win and one in .338 wm both with vx3 glass and premium ammo as loaner guns, I would be happy camper.

Mauser78 said:

There will be some good management hunts available for the first 5 years. With a more “local” feel to it. There will be a brand new camp but limited staff for the first few years. So we need to braai 3 times a day if we want to eat.

Click to expand...

huh

Braai, I’ve heard of that. Aussies call it Barbecue or BBQ, a favourite in Australia. We kind of eat Beef steak, Lamb chops and Pork ribs and sausage. We only BBQ twice a day. Nothing wrong with a cold sausage .

CBH Australia said:

huh

Braai, I’ve heard of that. Aussies call it Barbecue or BBQ, a favourite in Australia. We kind of eat Beef steak, Lamb chops and Pork ribs and sausage. We only BBQ twice a day. Nothing wrong with a cold sausage .

Click to expand...

Jip, same principle, but Gas, Burgers and Hot Dogs is not allowed on a braai. Wood, meat, beef sausage. Most of the time if only the boys are around eating of the grill.

You guys are making me hungry.
Time to grab my camp gun and shoot for the pot.

BeeMaa said:

If it is in fact a Weatherby rifle chambered in 460WBY, then yes.
However there are the occasional ones out there made by someone other than Weatherby.
For example, Montana Rifle Co has their newest offering "The African" available in 460WBY and it is CRF.
However, I don't think anyone would be complaining about shooting that...other than the associated recoil and cost of ammo.

Click to expand...

Oh. The only .460 Weatherby l ever fired was a Weatherby Mark V . Recoil is pretty much up there . Not UNBEARABLE , but not something that makes follow up shots easy . The push feed mechanism wasn't the biggest issue for me ( though l will trust the judgement of you more experienced DG hunting gentlemen on that ) . The biggest issue was that the rifle's floor plate would pop open sometimes due to recoil after you fired off your first round , dumping all your remaining shells onto your feet. Imagine if we were shooting elephant or buffalo instead of wild boars , then this issue would have cost us our lives or at least a bad goring.

Hoss Delgado said:

The biggest issue was that the rifle's floor plate would pop open sometimes due to recoil after you fired off your first round , dumping all your remaining shells onto your feet. Imagine if we were shooting elephant or buffalo instead of wild boars , then this issue would have cost us our lives or at least a bad goring.

Click to expand...

Roy Weatherby was obsessed with his cartridges being the fastest and there is a market for that.
Weatherby cartridges wear out barrels faster than others for the same number of rounds.
Probably not the best plan for a camp rifle that may or may not get the proper care it needs.
Although I guess the punishment of the recoil would keep the round count down.

Having the ammo dump at my feet would be unacceptable if I were hunting squirrel, let alone DG.
I have never shot a Weatherby cartridge or rifle, it's just not my cup of tea.